fgwrich
Established Member
So a slight touch of the irony then with Yellow Buses eventually dying out, More Bus taking on most of its routes, and operating buses painted Yellow on the streets of Bournemouth and Poole!
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AwkwardHail
Member
Is there a source for this? Currently sounds like wibble.
With new E400MMC due for route M1 with a pvr of aprox 25 it sounds completely plausible to me, by the way where does 'wibble' come from?
Yes, me!
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AwkwardHail
Member
Then logically to me that would push the B7RLEs out with E200MMCs replacing those.
The 34 seat E200MMC are totally unsuitable for morebus, and should never have been ordered for the m1/m2 to begin with. The Euro 5 B7RLEs are going nowhere, they can carry 99 people and are still far more popular with both drivers and passengers than the E200s. They are also able to comfortably undertake other longer range work such as covering for the Evosetis on the 40 when weather conditions prevent double deck operation, working low bridge rail replacement work across the New Forest and replacing the E200s on m1/m2 when the service level is reduced due to driver availability.
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Can't comment on their suitability or otherwise, The new Manchester operation clearly needs lots of buses and a mixed age profile is better than all new or old ex London. Morebus has more of a need for 'deckers than singles, as you say the B7RLE have plenty of life left and there is no sign of an LEZ happening in Bornemouth/Pool in the immediate future so Euro 5 fine.
I wonder as well if the accountants have had an influence, 28 new E400 for Morebus + 7 for Vectis is a lot of capital expenditure, assuming that Go-south own rather than lease? (or variations of) there's a lot of depreciation taking place, the E200MMC are only 5 years old. The Go South fleet has a lot of ageing 'deckers which will need replacing with similar, my money is on ex Oxford stock replacing them.
The issue they will have is what is going to replace the vehicles which have the tin tops removed for summer, but needed on for winter to operate schools?
Are there any manufacturers still building removable tops?
AwkwardHail
Member
MCV are the only ones iirc.
Pure speculation on my part but the afore mentioned Oxford bus co have some new all electric open toppers on order and currently have 5 open topped Scania/ADLs upgraded to Euro 6.......
cnjb8
Established Member
But the Scania's don't have removable roofs and neither do electric StreetDecks
The convertible roofs is only part of the problem. The biggest issue is that there is no longer any chassis option available suitable for use on the Sandbanks Ferry. The Volvo B8L is tri axle and prohibited on the ferry and the BZL decker is overweight for the ferry. The e400 MMCs aren't suitable either due to their exhaust position and engine bay design.
The current 17xx fleet from 2016 looks like being the last ferry bus fleet for Swanage.
The current 17xx fleet from 2016 looks like being the last ferry bus fleet for Swanage.
So what happens after those buses are withdrawn? I’d hate for the iconic Purbeck Breezer 50 to be permanently curtailed at Sandbanks or Studland from the Swanage direction.
cnjb8
Established Member
They still have years left in them, considering open tops tend to run longer than closed deck vehicles. By then, a suitable replacement may be available
It purely depends how long their 5 litre engines hold on. Out of the batch of 12, 5 have had new engines already.
On top of that there is no guarantee that the Sandbanks Ferry itself will continue in service beyond 2028. Estimates are put at around £12-15 million for a replacement vessel. There have been suggestions of a smaller, cars only electric battery powered replacement which plugs in between crossings. Whether there is a business case for any new vessel is something that is not certain yet.
On top of that there is no guarantee that the Sandbanks Ferry itself will continue in service beyond 2028. Estimates are put at around £12-15 million for a replacement vessel. There have been suggestions of a smaller, cars only electric battery powered replacement which plugs in between crossings. Whether there is a business case for any new vessel is something that is not certain yet.
What do they need roofs for? 14 years old, park them up October - April, nearly fully depreciated, its what they do on the isle of Wight.
They need roofs for schools and colleges when there is no summer uplift. They can just about get away with moving singles around post Easter, due to reduced school commitments. But they need them roofed for September!
Park them up where? Every SORN bus is taking up depot or yard space that could be occupied by a revenue earning asset. The situation on the Isle of Wight that saw the three displaced Swanage half top Scanias (1401-3) parked up for 6-8 months of the year when they were only 6-7 years old was beyond belief.
Surely the peak requirement for vehicles is May - mid July, Open toppers in use, schools/colleges open, foreign language students in Bournemouth. (this explains why they have Manchester Scania 'deckers on hire at the moment).
The schools/colleges start again in September (when open tops still operating).
Historically the argument has always been, do you: -
1. Have a fleet of older (permanent) open toppers used from May - September and parked up de-licensed over the winter
2. Have a modern fleet of convertibles which can be used as closed toppers for the rest of the year.
Go-South Coast have followed both policies, presumably they do so for both pragmatic and cost reasons.
Some of the open tops are getting on age wise.
The 2 ex Yellowbus Volvos may last a few years yet as they only see use in the summer, ditto the 2 IOW Volvos & solitary Scania conversions.
The Volvo convertibles (54/05 reg) now nearing 23 years old see use 12 months of the year.
I have no knowledge/insight into the mechanical/bodywork conditions of the various vehicles, they may soldier on for a few years yet?
The debate seems to be around whether replacements are new convertibles (big cap-ex) or older conversions, parked up out of use for 7 months of the year.
I don't pretend to know the depot parking situation on the IOW, presumably the vehicles were parked 'under cover' at Newport?
Would be interested to know more, is Ryde still used as a parking area? Also Whitmore road?
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WibbleWobble
Member
University requirement has dropped this week, due to the U1 reducing for the remainder of term (as happens every year, due to student numbers tailing off). It will drop further to the lowest requirement (I think four) when the vacation timetable starts.
Colleges start to end late June, first with Kingston Maurward (albeit permanently this time) at the same time as the university. Brockenhurst follows one week later, but that is partly offset by the New Forest Tour starting. The week in between is why Unibuses have traditionally been loaned to Lymington, to allow for de-roofing.
However, the increased open top requirement this year, due to the 70 extension and 80 starting, is why the Manchester buses are in Poole on loan.
341o2
Established Member
- Joined
- 17 Oct 2011
- Messages
- 1,908
Given that Morebus recently rebranded 1812/3 as Beach Breezer buses (formerly 02 plate) and the New Forest Tour buses are 54/05, best part of 20 years old, I don't think there is immediate cause for concern regarding the Breezers.
Meanwhile, Breezer buses have been deployed on ordinary Morebus routes, such as the M1/2 and 1/a/b. One regular journey pre 27th involved a round trip to Somerford, then a transfer to route 70
There won't be any new convertibles. It is no longer an option avaiable to purchase whether ferry spec was required or not.
Hants and Dorset could rebuild Euro 6 buses to convertible format as they did with Go Ahead London's WVL 83/93 but that would be costly and they are full to the brim with TfL work for the foreseeable future.
Hants and Dorset could rebuild Euro 6 buses to convertible format as they did with Go Ahead London's WVL 83/93 but that would be costly and they are full to the brim with TfL work for the foreseeable future.
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WibbleWobble
Member
It's out of date. The B5TL chassis for it was discontinued by Volvo.
BenS123
Member
Popular Bournemouth bus routes increased thanks to big cash boost
A POPULAR bus route is to run more frequently due to popular demand and thanks to a government cash injection.
The Daily Echo are reporting that the 18 is increasing to every 30 mins from an hour and a regular Sunday service, and the 13 is increasing from half hourly to every 20 minutes.
This change occurred last Saturday. In fact I’m waiting for a bus on one of the newly introduced no.18 journeys as I type this. It’ll be interesting to see how the loadings are compared with before.
Popular Bournemouth bus routes increased thanks to big cash boost
A POPULAR bus route is to run more frequently due to popular demand and thanks to a government cash injection.www.bournemouthecho.co.uk
The Daily Echo are reporting that the 18 is increasing to every 30 mins from an hour and a regular Sunday service,
Also good to hear, although this might leave the Wimborne Road corridor in Moordown out of sync with the 12 (former 4) which will still be running every 30 minutes. Several years ago there were 8bph along the corridor when the 4a and 4b ran every 20 minutes each, so maybe Morebus have ambitions for a higher frequency along this corridor. The 13 always seems heavily loaded whenever I use it.
DaveHarries
Established Member
I have used the 13 between WImborne and Bournemouth when working down that way and I have also found this too so it has been good to have double-deckers on it.
Dave
BenS123
Member
I'm on the 13 as I type this and it's completely full today on one of the higher capacity unibus double deckers, so this frequency uplift is definitely justified
I’d be interested to know if the Bournemouth - Ferndown section is busier than Ferndown - Wimborne (and vice versa). When Yellows operated the half-hourly 4c to West Moors, the former section was served by 4 buses an hour. That route also seemed busier than the X6 which was never going to be quicker for West Moors - Bournemouth journeys.
Also I’m aware that there is lots of new housing being built on land near Parley Cross, so perhaps this could be justification for the frequency increase?