Gospel Oak to Barking Line (GOBLIN) electrification

[47421]

"Work begins in June, with trains running on weekdays only between Gospel Oak and South Tottenham until the full [5 month] closure from October"

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/tran...m-october-network-rail-confirms-a3171606.html

 

[Class 170101]

This block will make Forest Gate Jn to WCML via Stratford, Dalston and Camden Road a very congested bit of railway with all the T&H freight traffic diverted via this route.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside extension is 'on'. Boris has approved it, but TfL now need to seek the legal powers to actually construct the extension.

http://www.railjournal.com/index.ph...und-barking-riverside-extension-approved.html

It should be operational in 2021.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside extension is 'on'. Boris has approved it, but TfL now need to seek the legal powers to actually construct the extension.

http://www.railjournal.com/index.ph...und-barking-riverside-extension-approved.html

It should be operational in 2021.

I don't wish to start the whole north-south thing again but this is London and gets complete by 2021 but other northern projects are uncertain. Unfair.

 

[tsangpogorge]

Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside extension is 'on'. Boris has approved it, but TfL now need to seek the legal powers to actually construct the extension.

http://www.railjournal.com/index.ph...und-barking-riverside-extension-approved.html

It should be operational in 2021.

Under the river to Thamesmead and through to Abbey Wood for interchange with Crossrail by 2033? Definitely not happening but what does everyone think about this proposal?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I don't wish to start the whole north-south thing again but this is London and gets complete by 2021 but other northern projects are uncertain. Unfair.

Well, the Riverside developers are forking out £172m (more than 50% of the £263m cost), and 10 800 houses are being built on the strength of it.
Nobody is helping fund the northern projects.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Well, the Riverside developers are forking out £172m (more than 50% of the £263m cost), and 10 800 houses are being built on the strength of it.
Nobody is helping fund the northern projects.

Sorry about that - fair enough I suppose

 

[ScotGG]

I don't wish to start the whole north-south thing again but this is London and gets complete by 2021 but other northern projects are uncertain. Unfair.

It isn't that simple though as plenty of projects in the north are now underway (at long last), and plenty of desperately needed projects in the south aren't. In some ways, north - south London mirrors north and south England. This project really needs to cross the Thames to help out the long neglected area of south east London and particularly Thamesmead. If it did it would unlock 5000-10000 new homes.

Thamesmead has had endless promises for 50 years. Jubilee line, bridges and tunnels over the Thames etc. Always cancelled. Crossrail wont help that much as the nearest station is no closer than existing stations have always been, and still cut off by dual carriageways, the main southern outfall sewer and endless cul-de-sacs etc. A bus journey to nearby stations is often slow and meandering.


Ultimately the UK infrastructure budget is way too small. So only a few small areas get what is needed. Instead of that changing so most areas get what's needed some squabble about the small pot being diverted elsewhere instead of enlarging it.

 

[plcd1]

In the final set of Mayor's Answers in Boris Johnson's term as Mayor there are two answers which touch on issues related to Barking - Gospel Oak electrification and if second hand electric trains can be used as soon as the wires are live. I suspect the questions may have been provided by the line's User Group given the level of detail.

Electrification of the Barking - Gospel Oak Rail Route
Question No: 2016/1101
John
Biggs

As
the
railway
between
Barking,
Woodgrange
Park
and
Forest
Gate
Junction
is
already
electrified
and
will
remain
open
while
the
rest
of
the
route
is
closed
for
electrification,
will
London
Overground
continue
to
operate
trains
between
Barking
(platforms
1,
7
or
8)
and
Woodgrange
Park
where
turn
back
facilities
are
already
provided?


Written response from the Mayor

Electrification
of
the
Barking
to
Gospel
Oak
Line
is
being
undertaken
by
Network
Rail
and
we are
working
closely
with
them
to
ensure
that
the
project
minimises
the
impact
on
passengers.



The
vast
majority
of
Class
172
diesel
trains
are
stabled
at
Willesden
so
would
not
be
able
to
reach
the
far
end
of
the
route
at
Barking
to
provide
the
connection
you
propose.
In
any
case,
a
connection
between
these
two
stations
would
be
expected
to
carry
very
few
passengers.
Additionally,
TfL
is
using
the
period
of
the
blockade
to
overhaul
a
number
of
Class
172
vehicles,
which
means
limited
rolling
stock
of
that
type
will
be
available
during
that
period.




Electric Trains for Barking - Gospel Oak Service
Question No: 2016/1102
John
Biggs

Could
the
Mayor
please
explain
why
it
not
viable
to
lease
electric
trains
to
fill
the
gap
between
the
completion
of
the
electrification
and
platform
extension
projects
in
mid
2017
and
the arrival
in
passenger
service
of
the
new
Class 710
electric
trains
in
April
2018?


Class 315
electric
trains
on
TfL
Rail
duties
will
be
replaced
by
new
Crossrail
Class 345
trains
from
early
2017
and
the
Class 315
trains
are
not
currently
designated
for
any
further
use.
Could
not
the
lease
of
ten
of
these
Class 315
trains
be
extended
for
10-12
months
to
enable
them
to
be
transferred
to
the
electrified
Barkng
-
Gospel
Oak
route
so
enabling
the
eight
2-car
diesel
trains
on
the
service
to
come
off
lease
instead?
This
will
end
the
appalling
overcrowding
at
a
stroke
and
allow
8
desperately
needed
modern
diesel
trains
to
be
transferred
to
another
train
operator.


Written response from the Mayor

Class
315
trains
will
not
be
available
from
the
TfL
Rail
route
until
late
summer
2017,
and
the
new
Class
710
trains
will
start
to
be
introduced
on
the
Gospel
Oak
to
Barking
route
from December
the
same
year.
Transferring
Class
315s
to
the
Gospel
Oak
to
Barking
line
would
be
expected
to
bring
significant
costs
in
terms
of
the
lease
extension,
driver
training
and
solving
the
logistical
issues
of
maintaining
and
stabling
the
fleet.
Given
the
short
period
of
time
the
trains
would
be
in
service
on
this
route,
this
would
be
unlikely
to
provide
value
for
money.

 

[AndyNLondon]

Neither of those (a 4-minute 1-stop shuttle service, and hiring in different rolling stock for a few months) seem like particularly sensible/worthwhile ideas

In other GOBLIN news, work has started on replacing Wightman Road bridge (the road bridge over the line immediately adjacent to the ECML rail bridge), which is apparently "showing signs of severe deterioration" and needs more clearance for electrification. More detail via Haringey council, including plans of the pretty complicated road closures that will be in place from next week until August.

 

[40129]

Is it just my imagination or id Thamesmead the most isolated part of Greater London?

 

[mister-sparky]

I don't wish to start the whole north-south thing again but this is London and gets complete by 2021 but other northern projects are uncertain. Unfair.

If the cost of living and other things was the same in the north as it is in London then your comment would be valid.

 

[Hophead]

Is it just my imagination or id Thamesmead the most isolated part of Greater London?

No and yes. And the arrival of Crossrail at Abbey Wood doesn't change that a great deal. Unless you include some of the more rural areas to the south and east, but certainly, for a developed part of London, the links are desperately poor.

 

[jopsuk]

Is it just my imagination or id Thamesmead the most isolated part of Greater London?

Not your imagination- it's notoriously and infamously badly connected.

 

[Mikey C]

Another example where London shows its uniqueness, as we have a situation where the electrification is likely to finish BEFORE the new trains arrive. Not a problem found elsewhere

 

[jopsuk]

It will allow GEML to WCML electric freight that currently has to via Stratford to run via GOBLIN though.

 

[racyrich]

It will allow GEML to WCML electric freight that currently has to via Stratford to run via GOBLIN though.

Or more correctly, LTS to WCML freight.

 

[Class 170101]

It will allow GEML to WCML electric freight that currently has to via Stratford to run via GOBLIN though.

Or more correctly, LTS to WCML freight.

Indeed no link from GEML to T&H from Felixstowe to Leytonstone. Nearest connection is via Stratford and Tottenham South Jn.

 

[Bald Rick]

Or more correctly, LTS to WCML freight.

And how much electric freight is there daily between the LTS and WCML? Count them on one hand; if you run out of fingers, you're wrong.

 

[Class 170101]

How much could be turned over to electric traction post GOB wiring though? Forward thinking?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

How much could be turned over to electric traction post GOB wiring though? Forward thinking?

It is something that has been sadly lacking on Britain's Railways for generations. Let us hope so.

 

[87015]

How much could be turned over to electric traction post GOB wiring though? Forward thinking?

Why would it though? More spare sheds than ever before,hence green skodas being made available to sleepers, DB not using 92s beyond Dollands Moor, etc...

 

[Bald Rick]

How much could be turned over to electric traction post GOB wiring though? Forward thinking?

Not very much at all. Most of the freight that runs on the T&H is aggregates traffic to places a long way off the wires.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It is something that has been sadly lacking on Britain's Railways for generations. Let us hope so.

:roll:

 

[GRALISTAIR]

:roll:

I confess to being puzzled by your rolling eyes smiley.

 

[Mikey C]

While most of the headlines are about the affect to London Overground services, how badly will the GOBLIN closure affect freight services?

Indeed, I assume the section between Willesden Junction and Gospel Oak is already pretty full with Overground service.

 

[Class 170101]

Why would it though? More spare sheds than ever before,hence green skodas being made available to sleepers, DB not using 92s beyond Dollands Moor, etc...

But apparently 70s are standing in for 90s on freight duties to keep time on Class 90 timings

 

[MrB]

Why would it though? More spare sheds than ever before,hence green skodas being made available to sleepers, DB not using 92s beyond Dollands Moor, etc...

Sheds? Skodas? What are they!?!

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Sheds? Skodas? What are they!?!

Class 66 and Class 90 locomotives, respectively.

 

[Class 170101]

While most of the headlines are about the affect to London Overground services, how badly will the GOBLIN closure affect freight services?

Indeed, I assume the section between Willesden Junction and Gospel Oak is already pretty full with Overground service.

Willesden to Gospel Oak remains open.

The biggest stink is between Stratford and Forest Gate Jn trying to path freights across all four lines of the GEML.

 

[RichmondCommu]

How much could be turned over to electric traction post GOB wiring though? Forward thinking?

If you look at the aggregate / cement traffic (and I'm not aware of any Intermodal currently running via the GOBLIN) then nothing in my opinion. It will be a long time before the Hope Valley route in Derbyshire is electrified.