Greek Street bridge replacement Stockport

[CHAPS2034]

Thanks for the link.

Fascinating stuff to the layman

 

[Killingworth]

TPE and EMR will fit via Marple. You'll fit 2 Avantis on the Styals as well.

But will the stoppers to New Mills, Rose Hill and Sheffield plus freight all fit as well? I suspect something will have to give.

 

[The Planner]

But will the stoppers to New Mills, Rose Hill and Sheffield plus freight all fit as well? I suspect something will have to give.

Stuff will get flexed I suspect.

 

[Chester1]

There won't be a rail service between Piccadilly and Stockport unfortunately because work is also taking place at Heaton Norris. The blockade is from 2nd August to 05.00 on 23rd August. So it will affect some people going to Derby for the Rail 200 event on 2nd and 3rd.

Where is the work at Heaton Norris? Does it effect the junction with the Denton line? Any chance of a Victoria - Stockport shuttle?

 

[Rail Ranger]

I don't actually know the answers to any of those questions but I strongly suspect that no trains will be able to run through Heaton Norris Junction from any direction.

 

[The Planner]

Where is the work at Heaton Norris? Does it effect the junction with the Denton line? Any chance of a Victoria - Stockport shuttle?

No chance at all, it will take the junction out.

 

[Jamesrob637]

We live in Stockport. My wife works literally at the end of Greek Street, on the A6. Will buses terminate each side of the A6?

 

[Rail Ranger]

Buses will be diverted via alternative routes.

 

[CHAPS2034]

Stuff will get flexed I suspect.

Well there should be plenty of available paths into Piccadilly!

Buses will be diverted via alternative routes.

AFAI understand it the diversion routes have yet to be publicised, but when they are it will be for 12 months!

 

[Pacco]

As per an earlier poster, will Buxton retain a service from Hazel Grove or even Davenport.

Recognise there may be refueling or maintenance issues, but units could 'escape' at night via Chinley perhaps? Or is there anything up Buxton way that could support them.

It's a bit of a dent for a tourist town like Buxton to lose its railway in the summer.

 

[The Planner]

As per an earlier poster, will Buxton retain a service from Hazel Grove or even Davenport.

Recognise there may be refueling or maintenance issues, but units could 'escape' at night via Chinley perhaps? Or is there anything up Buxton way that could support them.

It's a bit of a dent for a tourist town like Buxton to lose its railway in the summer.

Hazel Grove

 

[buz33]

Press release from Network Rail which includes a CGI video showing how the Greek street bridge will be replaced.

https://www.networkrailmediacentre....ajor-greek-street-bridge-replacement-revealed

CGI video of major Greek Street bridge replacement revealed​

Region & Route: North West & Central: North West | North West & Central
A 3D, computer generated video explains how engineers will demolish and rebuild the Greek Street roundabout in Stockport, which crosses Europe’s busiest mix-used railway.


The video has been revealed by Network Rail ahead of the closure of the roundabout this month.

The bridge takes vehicles and pedestrians in Stockport over the West Coast Main Line, which sees almost 400 services pass through Stockport station every day.

The Greek Street roundabout will be closed to traffic for one year starting from 31 March 2025.

This closure is part of Network Rail’s almost £20m investment to replace the aging bridge that crosses over the West Coast Main Line.

The original bridge, which was constructed in 1958, has reached the end of its life and needs to be replaced.

A video has been published that shows exactly how engineers will replace the 67-year-old structure.

 

[high camera]

The NR website also mentions rail disruption in April

Over Easter 2025, work will take place to prepare the railway for the bridge’s replacement this summer. There will be changes to train services between 19-22 April 2025. Passengers are advised to check National Rail Enquiries before they travel. Some services will be diverted around Stockport, whilst others will be replaced with a bus.

Demolishing and rebuilding the 58-metre-wide bridge will be a complex process. Over Christmas 2024, engineers constructed a temporary bridge to reroute existing utility services such as water and electricity. Once the road is closed, the road layout will be removed carefully in a way that does not damage the bridge structure while the railway is in operation.

From 2 - 23 August 2025, the bridge, which is made of about 200 concrete beams, will be demolished and the new bridge will be installed. Then, the team will redirect the utility services, waterproof the bridge, and reinstate the road to the highest standard.

 

[tumbledown]

Looks like they are planning on running the full East Midlands and Transpennine services via New Mills at Easter: quite a busy time at Ashburys.

Realtime Trains | Departures from Ashburys around 1759 on 19/04/2025

Train information at Ashburys around 1759 on 19/04/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Wonder if that is also the plan for August.

 

[The Planner]

Looks like they are planning on running the full East Midlands and Transpennine services via New Mills at Easter: quite a busy time at Ashburys.

Realtime Trains | Departures from Ashburys around 1759 on 19/04/2025

Train information at Ashburys around 1759 on 19/04/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Wonder if that is also the plan for August.

Yes. It will be a carbon copy.

 

[Nottingham59]

Press release from Network Rail which includes a CGI video showing how the Greek street bridge will be replaced.

https://www.networkrailmediacentre....ajor-greek-street-bridge-replacement-revealed

I see they are replacing the twin-bay structure with a single span. Does this mean there is scope in the future to increase the number of rail tracks on the line between Stockport Station and Edgeley Junction?

 

[The Planner]

I see they are replacing the twin-bay structure with a single span. Does this mean there is scope in the future to increase the number of rail tracks on the line between Stockport Station and Edgeley Junction?

No

 

[furnessvale]

No

But could there be scope in the future, if needed, for adjustment to crossover locations etc, to aid movements?

 

[The Planner]

But could there be scope in the future, if needed, for adjustment to crossover locations etc, to aid movements?

Not until someone bites the bullet and resignals the area. Even then I can't see how you fit more than one extra line in, and that isn't a lot of use.

 

[py_megapixel]

We live in Stockport. My wife works literally at the end of Greek Street, on the A6. Will buses terminate each side of the A6?

Appreciate this message is a few months old now so you may already have this information, but the bus diversionary routes are now published at https://tfgm.com/rail-improvement-works/greek-street-bridge-replacement

All routes will still reach the Interchange, but using Longshut Lane West instead of Greek Street, and then either the A6 and Daw Bank (11, 368 and 374) or Higher Hillgate and Mersey Square (312 and 313).

The 313 is perhaps a little odd as it would usually go via the A6 rather than Hillgate, but I suppose with how chaotic this will make the service, having all buses from the Adswood direction going the same way probably minimses the overall confusion caused!

 

[Nottingham59]

But could there be scope in the future, if needed, for adjustment to crossover locations etc, to aid movements?

Precisely. I would expect that five bidirectional tracks between the station and Edgeley under ETCS signalling would increase flexibility after disruptions and therefore total capacity at this point where four northbound traffic flows converge onto just two northbound lines over the viaduct.

At the very least, a fifth track would allow the 2-car Chester stopper to terminate at a new platform 5 at Stockport, and thus free up another hourly path for an 11-car Avanti from London to Piccadilly.

Probably best to start a separate speculative thread ....

 

[Jamesrob637]

Appreciate this message is a few months old now so you may already have this information, but the bus diversionary routes are now published at https://tfgm.com/rail-improvement-works/greek-street-bridge-replacement

All routes will still reach the Interchange, but using Longshut Lane West instead of Greek Street, and then either the A6 and Daw Bank (11, 368 and 374) or Higher Hillgate and Mersey Square (312 and 313).

The 313 is perhaps a little odd as it would usually go via the A6 rather than Hillgate, but I suppose with how chaotic this will make the service, having all buses from the Adswood direction going the same way probably minimses the overall confusion caused!

Thanks! We will be living the other side of Stockport from April now.

 

[The Planner]

Precisely. I would expect that five bidirectional tracks between the station and Edgeley under ETCS signalling would increase flexibility after disruptions and therefore total capacity at this point where four northbound traffic flows converge onto just two northbound lines over the viaduct.

At the very least, a fifth track would allow the 2-car Chester stopper to terminate at a new platform 5 at Stockport, and thus free up another hourly path for an 11-car Avanti from London to Piccadilly.

Probably best to start a separate speculative thread ....

All of this is moot currently. No one is touching Stockport for the next 15 years. Why does the Chester being on a seperate line for 300m release a London to Piccadilly path?

 

[Topological]

All of this is moot currently. No one is touching Stockport for the next 15 years. Why does the Chester being on a seperate line for 300m release a London to Piccadilly path?

Terminating in a new Platform 5 would, but that would not be popular with anyone using the Chester train as presumably "Platform 5" would require using the underpass to reach the platform for continuing towards Piccadilly.

If it was all rejigged so that there was a southern bay in the Platform 3/4 island then it would be less of an inconvenience, but much of the benefit of segregating the Chester service would be lost.

Back in the original VHF days, I watched them put down all the extra bits of track around Stockport with hope something impressive was going to happen. However, none of that required any change to Greek Street.

 

[The Planner]

Terminating in a new Platform 5 would, but that would not be popular with anyone using the Chester train as presumably "Platform 5" would require using the underpass to reach the platform for continuing towards Piccadilly.

If it was all rejigged so that there was a southern bay in the Platform 3/4 island then it would be less of an inconvenience, but much of the benefit of segregating the Chester service would be lost.

Back in the original VHF days, I watched them put down all the extra bits of track around Stockport with hope something impressive was going to happen. However, none of that required any change to Greek Street.

How does it release a path from Euston to Piccadilly? Currently the Chester follows the Euston path into Picc.

 

[Topological]

How does it release a path from Euston to Piccadilly? Currently the Chester follows the Euston path into Picc.

Doesn't terminate mean that the Chester train does not go to Piccadilly, freeing the path between Stockport and Piccadilly. The dedicated line would further reduce the interaction between any terminator and the hypothetical path.

Are you saying this is because it would be daft to have two London to Manchester trains following each other? Since if the Chester follows the Euston path into Picc then the "new" Euston to Piccadilly would be just behind the current one.

I assume the argument is that some recasting would be enabled so that something else went into the Chester path and there was then a different "spare". However, if there is nothing that can be done there, the extra Euston would be the "fast" path and only catch up near Stockport (in this new hypothetical world).

Note that there is no saying that a path could be created that ended up reaching Stockport just behind the current path.

It is also not necessarily the case that the benefactor from the Chester path should be another Euston train. That was @Nottingham59 suggestion.

 

[The Planner]

Doesn't terminate mean that the Chester train does not go to Piccadilly, freeing the path between Stockport and Piccadilly. The dedicated line would further reduce the interaction between any terminator and the hypothetical path.

Are you saying this is because it would be daft to have two London to Manchester trains following each other? Since if the Chester follows the Euston path into Picc then the "new" Euston to Piccadilly would be just behind the current one.

Yes

I assume the argument is that some recasting would be enabled so that something else went into the Chester path and there was then a different "spare". However, if there is nothing that can be done there, the extra Euston would be the "fast" path and only catch up near Stockport (in this new hypothetical world).

Note that there is no saying that a path could be created that ended up reaching Stockport just behind the current path.

It is also not necessarily the case that the benefactor from the Chester path should be another Euston train. That was @Nottingham59 suggestion.

I don't understand the need for a fifth track to alleviate any interaction an hourly path has off the Altrincham line.

 

[edwin_m]

I think the point here is that the Mid-Cheshire could use a hypothetical fifth track to the west of the others, terminating in an equally hypothetical fifth platform also to the west. That frees up one path on an Up line when that train doesn't need to use them. On the Down one path is freed up by removal of the Down train itself, and two more because the Up train no longer crosses both Down lines on the flat.

 

[The Planner]

I think the point here is that the Mid-Cheshire could use a hypothetical fifth track to the west of the others, terminating in an equally hypothetical fifth platform also to the west. That frees up one path on an Up line when that train doesn't need to use them. On the Down one path is freed up by removal of the Down train itself, and two more because the Up train no longer crosses both Down lines on the flat.

As long as its understood it releases a path at that location, it doesn't mean you can suddenly run a train to/from x.

 

[furnessvale]

Not until someone bites the bullet and resignals the area. Even then I can't see how you fit more than one extra line in, and that isn't a lot of use.

Yes, exactly my point. There may not be room for a 5th line but removal of that centre pier gives track designers of the future a blank sheet of paper for crossover etc locations.