Half cabs on the continent

[popeter45]

so realised this the other day, do any european railways in europe apart from the UK use half cabs with the ability for thru coridors like we have on the class 350, 730, 158, 442 etc?
i know DSB IC3's have thru corridors but they have a full cab that moves out of the way to link up

 

[DanielB]

The Belgian classical EMU's have them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_Railways_Classical_twin_EMUs

MS96 also has the corridors, but in the same way as the DSB sets.

 

[StephenHunter]

Does the Koploper count? The through gangways have been taken out of use though.

 

[30907]

The earliest Re4/4s on SBB had a gangway, and the related power cars Rbe4/4 an end door of some sort, but I am not sure they were used!
The classic Swiss narrow-gauge power car of the 60s had a narrow end door plus a drop-down bridging plate (so a bit like LUL cars).

 

[Class172]

Does the Koploper count? The through gangways have been taken out of use though.

Don’t think those count in the context of the half-width cab question, as I’m pretty sure the cab sits above the gangway.

 

[Bemined]

The Netherlands does have some museum stock with doors at the front: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/...met_rit_28_211_naar_Haarlem_(15306350912).jpg

 

[Beebman]

Italian ALn 668 DMUs have doors at the front:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FS_Class_ALn_668

 

[DanielB]

Don’t think those count in the context of the half-width cab question, as I’m pretty sure the cab sits above the gangway.

The only thing matching would be the width of the gangway indeed, the cab itself is full width. (Next to the gangway there's only a staircase)

 

[Trainbike46]

The only thing matching would be the width of the gangway indeed, the cab itself is full width. (Next to the gangway there's only a staircase)

From experience, it's a very narrow staircase up to that cab! The cab itself is spacious though

 

[superalbs]

Not quite 'the continent', but Ireland has a few Japanese DMUs with end gangways.

I also think the gangways have since been removed. Not sure what's left of the cabs.

 

[jamesontheroad]

The Danish MF, or IC3, has probably the best-ever evolution of a cab-end door: a full-height, full-width door which swings more than 90° out of the way to allow for a broad and almost level passage between units. Rubber gaskets on the leading edge of the two trains seal the connection when operating in multiple. This same design appears on the DSB IR4, the Øresundståg class ET/X31K and the NMBS/SNCB Class AM 69.



Photo by Matthewross, CC BY-SA 3.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=2620441

 

[rf_ioliver]

Finnish Sm1 EMUs and some older DMUs like the Dm7. Though I think on the former they could not be used by passengers or while the train was in motion

Sm1: http://vaunut.org/kuva/155350?tag0=4|Sm1|
Dm4; http://vaunut.org/kuva/158048?tag0=3|Dm4|
Sm2 and Dm7: http://vaunut.org/kuva/161807?tag0=4|Sm1|

Here's an inside view of the Dm7 cab: http://vaunut.org/kuva/154268?tag0=3|Dm7|
The note on the door reads "Läpikulku vain henkilökunnalle" - Passage for staff only

 

[AdamWW]

so realised this the other day, do any european railways in europe apart from the UK use half cabs with the ability for thru coridors like we have on the class 350, 730, 158, 442 etc?
i know DSB IC3's have thru corridors but they have a full cab that moves out of the way to link up

Some types of DEMU in Czechia have (or at any rate had) a similar arrangement to the UK, allowing a through gangway connection to other units or to regular coaches.

 

[Re 4/4]

The earliest Re4/4s on SBB had a gangway, and the related power cars Rbe4/4 an end door of some sort, but I am not sure they were used!

Around 2000, I used to take a peak hour extra train slotted into the Zurich S-Bahn schedule that was usually an RBe 4/4 with some EW coaches attached. The door to get from the first coach to the power car was in use, I used it several times on my commutes. Typically when the toilet in the power car was out of use!

These trains had the extra attraction that standing behind the half cab, you could look out the front through a window; on some days the driver would even allow one to sit on the seat on the other side of the cab itself.

I think the Jungfrau railway cabs have a "corridor" and front door because, like on the Tube, that's your escape route in a tunnel.

 

[station_road]

Not quite 'the continent', but Ireland has a few Japanese DMUs with end gangways.

I also think the gangways have since been removed. Not sure what's left of the cabs.

Outside Europe, a number of railways around the world have half cabs usually because of needing emergency doors in the centre for evacuation in tunnels - Sydney and older trains in Adelaide in Australia, many local trains or metros in the US (New York/Los Angeles/Chicago/Boston Subway, LIRR and Metro North in NY, NJ Transit and PATH, BART in California). While they have reduced size cabs because of the doors (apart from BART, which just has a half cab for some reason!), I can't think of any railway outside the UK that has gangways next to cabs that are used in normal passenger service, in the way that they are in the UK.

 

[JonasB]

Finnish Sm1 EMUs and some older DMUs like the Dm7. Though I think on the former they could not be used by passengers or while the train was in motion

Sm1: http://vaunut.org/kuva/155350?tag0=4|Sm1|
Dm4; http://vaunut.org/kuva/158048?tag0=3|Dm4|
Sm2 and Dm7: http://vaunut.org/kuva/161807?tag0=4|Sm1|

Here's an inside view of the Dm7 cab: http://vaunut.org/kuva/154268?tag0=3|Dm7|
The note on the door reads "Läpikulku vain henkilökunnalle" - Passage for staff only

The Dm7s are licence built versions of Swedish rail cars, usually known as the Y6-series. From the linked image the Dm7's cab looks pretty similar to the Swedish versions, that really don't have what I would call a half-cab. Even if there is a door.

 

[Gag Halfrunt]

I can't think of any railway outside the UK that has gangways next to cabs that are used in normal passenger service, in the way that they are in the UK.

The ALn 668 (mentioned by Beebman) has retractable gangways.

File:ALn 668.1462+1478 intercomunicazione.JPG - Wikimedia Commons

commons.wikimedia.org

The Czech class 854 railcars (Czech Wikipedia entry) have cabs at both ends and a gangway at only one end.

 

[AdamWW]

The Czech class 854 railcars (Czech Wikipedia entry) have cabs at both ends and a gangway at only one end.

And here's some photos of the gangway provision, offering the unusual experience of a gangway with windows in:




Curiously, at the other end of the the train above, was:



While they are certainly happy to run single coach DEMUs round a coach or more, if they did it on this train they would have the non gangway cab at the wrong end.

 

[hexagon789]

And here's some photos of the gangway provision, offering the unusual experience of a gangway with windows in:

View attachment 135453
View attachment 135454

Curiously, at the other end of the the train above, was:

View attachment 135455

While they are certainly happy to run single coach DEMUs round a coach or more, if they did it on this train they would have the non gangway cab at the wrong end.

I've seen plenty of photos of the 854s running like that - hauling one or two trailers with the power car having its non-gangway cab against the trailers.

ČD-Baureihe 854 – Wikipedia

de.m.wikipedia.org

(Photo of ČZ series 854 railcar at Prague hlavní nádraží)

I understand originally the 854s were for 'fast' trains between provincial centres, often over secondary lines (a sort of Czech CrossCountry of sorts), the traditional formation being two power cars sandwiching up to 4 trailers.

Even as 852s and 853s (the 854s are modernised and refurbished ex-852s and 853s), they had the second small cab with gangway. Possibly the idea was it was to also simpler shunting of sets?

 

[AdamWW]

I've seen plenty of photos of the 854s running like that - hauling one or two trailers with the power car having its non-gangway cab against the trailers.

Fair enough. Nice that they do use the gangway connection when it's the right way round.

I think the only times I've actually travelled on a railcar and trailer combination there it's been with units that didn't have corridor connections.

There used to be trailer cars with very odd corridor connections that I imagine were for staff only. Then again given different views on safety to us at present let along decades ago I don't know.

 

[Beebman]

Not quite 'the continent', but Ireland has a few Japanese DMUs with end gangways.

I also think the gangways have since been removed. Not sure what's left of the cabs.

Talking of Japan, JR Central series 313 EMUs have end gangways:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/313_series

Meanwhile the KiHa 85 series has gangways at one end:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KiHa_85_series

 

[superalbs]

Talking of Japan, JR Central series 313 EMUs have end gangways:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/313_series

Meanwhile the KiHa 85 series has gangways at one end:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KiHa_85_series

I'm in Japan now, absolutely loads of trains have end gangways!

 

[MarkyT]

Italian high-performance ALe 601 EMUs had end corridor connection capability through the cabs. Constructed between 1961 and 1980, each powered car was self-contained, 1st class only, with a cab at each end, and there were matching unpowered driver-trailer cars with various functions and classes that could be coupled in formation. They were capable of high speeds of up to 200kph in normal service. Some examples survive and are being restored for special trains by the FS Foundation. I remember riding one of the class on a fast daytime Rome - Sicily trip sometime around 1980 I think, including crossing the Strait of Messina via the train ferry:

Automotrice FS ALe 601 - Wikipedia

it.wikipedia.org

(Google translation as no English wiki page)
The ALe 601s are a family of electric railcars of the State Railways .
Together with the towed boats Le 360, Le 420, Le 480, Le 481, Le 530, Le 601, Le 700, Le 780 they were designed and built to perform fast and luxury passenger services.
Expected from the outset to travel at at least 180 km/h, they allowed the FS to set up and develop, from 1961 , a high-speed network of connections .

 

[JKF]

The Danish MF, or IC3, has probably the best-ever evolution of a cab-end door: a full-height, full-width door which swings more than 90° out of the way to allow for a broad and almost level passage between units. Rubber gaskets on the leading edge of the two trains seal the connection when operating in multiple. This same design appears on the DSB IR4, the Øresundståg class ET/X31K and the NMBS/SNCB Class AM 69.

View attachment 135413

Photo by Matthewross, CC BY-SA 3.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=2620441

Renfe operate a version of these in Spain too, though they’ve been modernising them and getting rid of the sphincter-like gasketed corridor ends for more standard cabs. Have to say they’re probably one of the least attractive trains I’ve seen!

Serie 594 de Renfe - Wikipedia, la enciclopedia libre

es.wikipedia.org

 

[MarcVD]

The Belgian classical EMU's have them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_Railways_Classical_twin_EMUs

Anyone interested to see them in action, just hurry up. Probably they will all be gone by the end of this year. The attrition rate increased notably those last few weeks. There is a train to haul sone of them to the scraper almost every weekend now.

 

[duesselmartin]

any idea what they will be replaced with on the Aachen service?

 

[MarcVD]

any idea what they will be replaced with on the Aachen service?

HLE 18 + I11 - New service from Liège. Should start end 2023 if nothing changes in between.
Many things can still happen that could prevent that plan from materializing. Notably M7 deliveries.

 

[Kreissignal]

The Belgian classical EMU's have them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_Railways_Classical_twin_EMUs

MS96 also has the corridors, but in the same way as the DSB sets.

The Bundesbahn "Hasenkasten" ("rabbit-hutch") Silberling DVTs (BDnf 738) (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silberling) had a very cramped driver’s cab next to the 'corridor' door, but I don't think any are still in service.