Hearing impairment?

[Rave]

Hi all, so I've bunged my application into DBS and not heard anything back, even though I'm an employee of a DB subsidiary (Arriva) and a former bus driver. Apparently that's par for the course. But while reading around I've read that the medical includes a hearing test?

When I was a kid I had a Cholesteatoma in my left ear, and had to have my skull cut open a couple of times. The end result is that I have no eardrum or ossicles in my left ear, and so although the cochlea is still absolutely fine, I'm a bit deaf in that ear. My right ear is as good as any other 35 year old who likes a bit of loud music, which is to say probably not perfect, but still well up to the job. I have never bothered to get a hearing aid for my duff ear, not because I'm embarrassed to wear one (I couldn't care less) but that it has never caused me any bother in life, even when I worked as a bus driver, with my left ear closest to the cab window.

I've read that up to 30db hearing loss is O.K. for a driver. I have absolutely no idea how good or bad my left ear is, but I have Rockbox firmware on my MP3 player, and for music to sound perfectly balanced through headphones I need -13db set on the balance control. Googling around it seems that any percentage figure of hearing loss quoted is utterly meaningless, but a nurse once told me that I have about 30% of normal hearing in that ear.

So...am I going to have a problem? The DBS application form doesn't even ask about your hearing, but at the same time I don't want to turn up and waste their time doing the tests if I'm going to fail the medical:roll: .

 

[SkinnyDave]

Hi all, so I've bunged my application into DBS and not heard anything back, even though I'm an employee of a DB subsidiary (Arriva) and a former bus driver. Apparently that's par for the course. But while reading around I've read that the medical includes a hearing test?

When I was a kid I had a Cholesteatoma in my left ear, and had to have my skull cut open a couple of times. The end result is that I have no eardrum or ossicles in my left ear, and so although the cochlea is still absolutely fine, I'm a bit deaf in that ear. My right ear is as good as any other 35 year old who likes a bit of loud music, which is to say probably not perfect, but still well up to the job. I have never bothered to get a hearing aid for my duff ear, not because I'm embarrassed to wear one (I couldn't care less) but that it has never caused me any bother in life, even when I worked as a bus driver, with my left ear closest to the cab window.

I've read that up to 30db hearing loss is O.K. for a driver. I have absolutely no idea how good or bad my left ear is, but I have Rockbox firmware on my MP3 player, and for music to sound perfectly balanced through headphones I need -13db set on the balance control. Googling around it seems that any percentage figure of hearing loss quoted is utterly meaningless, but a nurse once told me that I have about 30% of normal hearing in that ear.

So...am I going to have a problem? The DBS application form doesn't even ask about your hearing, but at the same time I don't want to turn up and waste their time doing the tests if I'm going to fail the medical:roll: .

You will get a hearing test done at the medical but it's usually a screening which will probably show a worse result for your left ear because you have a conductive hearing loss! They didn't do a bone conduction test at my medical or masking so yes you will have problems at medical but I wouldn't get downhearted yet.
If your application proceeds further I would get a hearing consultation done privately with full testing and an explanation of the results (which you will need) before attending medical and keep Schenker HR informed.

A conductive hearing loss as you say means your cochlear is fine (lay off loud music) it's just that sound has to work a lot harder to get through but there are options.

I'm not saying they will be fine with it and I'm not saying your snookered either but I don't think it should be too much of an issue (depending on results)

 

[WeGoAgain]

Hi all, so I've bunged my application into DBS and not heard anything back, even though I'm an employee of a DB subsidiary (Arriva) and a former bus driver. Apparently that's par for the course. But while reading around I've read that the medical includes a hearing test?

When I was a kid I had a Cholesteatoma in my left ear, and had to have my skull cut open a couple of times. The end result is that I have no eardrum or ossicles in my left ear, and so although the cochlea is still absolutely fine, I'm a bit deaf in that ear. My right ear is as good as any other 35 year old who likes a bit of loud music, which is to say probably not perfect, but still well up to the job. I have never bothered to get a hearing aid for my duff ear, not because I'm embarrassed to wear one (I couldn't care less) but that it has never caused me any bother in life, even when I worked as a bus driver, with my left ear closest to the cab window.

I've read that up to 30db hearing loss is O.K. for a driver. I have absolutely no idea how good or bad my left ear is, but I have Rockbox firmware on my MP3 player, and for music to sound perfectly balanced through headphones I need -13db set on the balance control. Googling around it seems that any percentage figure of hearing loss quoted is utterly meaningless, but a nurse once told me that I have about 30% of normal hearing in that ear.

So...am I going to have a problem? The DBS application form doesn't even ask about your hearing, but at the same time I don't want to turn up and waste their time doing the tests if I'm going to fail the medical:roll: .

What SD said.
However, it's possible to get a Hearing test done for Free by visiting a Hearing Aid retailer. If they're any good, they'll be able to test your Hearing under the same conditions that you would be under during your Medical. You will then be able to see where your hearing levels are. - If they are within the Hearing Limits of DBS, all fine. If they aren't, you can look at Hearing Aid options.

Nowadays, they have very discreet hearing aids. They can now be made small enough to sit in your Ear canal which will be almost totally invisible. Hearing Aids aren't all cheap, but (should you need one), you may be able to get away with a cheaper one.

First things first. Find out the Hearing Requirements for the specific FOC/TOC you with to apply to. (Hr should be able to provide you with this information).
Then have your Hearing Test.

From there, you can determine whether you wish to look at using a Hearing Aid as an option.

WGA.

 

[#1 driver]

I've bunged my application into DBS and not heard anything back

I'm a bit deaf

dunno if you were trying for humour , but I couldn't resist .

am I going to have a problem?

this might be of help -

http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_... Management/Guidance Notes/GOGN3655 Iss 1.pdf


BUT , if you were DBS HR and trying to sift through LOTS of applications , would you pick someone with less than perfect hearing ?
the Arriva thing may help but I wouldn't hold my breath .

you've got nothing to lose by trying , though .
right ?

good luck .

 

[Rave]

Many thanks all.

dunno if you were trying for humour , but I couldn't resist .

this might be of help -

http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_... Management/Guidance Notes/GOGN3655 Iss 1.pdf

BUT , if you were DBS HR and trying to sift through LOTS of applications , would you pick someone with less than perfect hearing ?
the Arriva thing may help but I wouldn't hold my breath .

you've got nothing to lose by trying , though .
right ?

good luck .

Very helpful link, cheers. Reading through it seems that I should be fine as I have absolutely no bother using phones/intercoms/walkie talkies etc. with my good ear. I'm more than happy to cough up for and wear a hearing aid if that's a condition of my employment. I'll raise it with HR if and when the medical is on the horizon...many hoops to jump through first!

 

[ExRes]

I think, from experience a few years ago, that this is still entirely down to how an individual company looks at each case

The hearing aid requirement with my employer was for a digital aid to be worn at all times when performing safety critical duties, failure to meet the agreement at any time was permanent removal from driving duties

I realise that discrimination rules may well have changed but I'm sceptical that anyone not meeting the minimum requirements would be employed as a new entrant

 

[142094]

Very helpful link, cheers. Reading through it seems that I should be fine as I have absolutely no bother using phones/intercoms/walkie talkies etc. with my good ear. I'm more than happy to cough up for and wear a hearing aid if that's a condition of my employment. I'll raise it with HR if and when the medical is on the horizon...many hoops to jump through first!

Being able to hear an oncoming train and the horn is probably the most important reason for having a hearing test.

 

[ExRes]

Being able to hear an oncoming train and the horn is probably the most important reason for having a hearing test.

I think it's rather more than that, as a driver you have to be able to hear and react to all in cab alarms, all internal and external forms of communication including signal post telephones especially when exposed to the noise of a running line, for example being given instructions to pass a signal at danger must be heard, understood and repeated, shunting activities in a yard, using walking routes, if the OP is applying for a driving position with DBS then he will be required to understand all instructions while shunting wagons, dropping ballast etc and while on worksites, if he is applying for a shunters position then he will require all those abilities and more as he will be working under and around wagons and locos

No way am I trying to be negative toward the OP, but it should never be underestimated just how much we rely on hearing, especially in a safety critical area such a the railway. He should also take a look at the price of hearing aids, if his potential employer insists on a digital hearing aid then all I can say is ouch, they don't come cheap and have to be replaced every few years

Regardless of all that, I hope the OP passes with flying colours and enjoys a career on the railway

 

[SkinnyDave]

A conductive loss is not that difficult to correct with a decent hearing aid it's only to provide amplification to pass through the obstruction. There is no nerve damage so I would be surprised if they would knock the OP back.
And it's only in one ear with other one fine according to OP

 

[ExRes]

A conductive loss is not that difficult to correct with a decent hearing aid it's only to provide amplification to pass through the obstruction. There is no nerve damage so I would be surprised if they would knock the OP back.
And it's only in one ear with other one fine according to OP

Once again I'd like to point out that I'm aware the rules may have changed slightly in the last 5 years and underline that I'm not trying to be negative, but .....

One ear or both ears makes no difference whatsoever, the candidate must reach the agreed railway standards, if they can't meet them with both ears then they will fail the medical

All TOCs and FOCs will treat unacceptable hearing loss within their own safety case, should they actually have one that covers reduced hearing of course

In my own experience I was sidelined from driving and all other safety critical duties for 2 years while my TOC did nothing, ASLEF were almost as bad actually asking me what I'd found out as they made no effort to do anything on my behalf other than my then H&S rep who did what she could out of pure decency. The only help I had was from my Train Crew Manager and particularly my HR Manager whose efforts finally forced the company into producing the safety case with the financial costs of not producing one being the main reasoning. My experience should at least mean that any driver in that TOC now has a precedent should they suffer significant hearing loss

All companies require their own safety case, the fact that a couple of others had one in place when I was fighting my case meant nothing and I would suspect that is still the case

Unless changes to the discrimination laws have taken place which would force a TOC or FOC to alter their stance, then I see no likelihood that the OP would be treated any differently to how I was, worse in fact as I was an expensively trained driver with 10+ years experience

 

[142094]

I think it's rather more than that, as a driver you have to be able to hear and react to all in cab alarms, all internal and external forms of communication including signal post telephones especially when exposed to the noise of a running line, for example being given instructions to pass a signal at danger must be heard, understood and repeated, shunting activities in a yard, using walking routes, if the OP is applying for a driving position with DBS then he will be required to understand all instructions while shunting wagons, dropping ballast etc and while on worksites, if he is applying for a shunters position then he will require all those abilities and more as he will be working under and around wagons and locos

Of course - but at least with using CSR/SPTs etc you can ask for repetition in order to come to a clear understanding on what is to happen. But if you're on the track, you don't have the benefit of a second chance - if you don't hear an approaching train and the driver sounding the horn, well we all know what can happen.

 

[ExRes]

Of course - but at least with using CSR/SPTs etc you can ask for repetition in order to come to a clear understanding on what is to happen. But if you're on the track, you don't have the benefit of a second chance - if you don't hear an approaching train and the driver sounding the horn, well we all know what can happen.

Totally agree with you, out there on the track there's no room for error, bear in mind though a driver who cannot properly hear an emergency radio broadcast or a message from their Train Manager and the possible consequences of that situation