I'm impressed. Love to see that.
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Hope Valley Capacity Scheme updates
- Thread starter Killingworth
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The distant signals over the Hope Valley now are all either:
- Existing distant signals in the AB territory from Earles westwards. This is governed really by the distance between block posts, with IB signals roughly equidistant between Edale and Earles, it's all just a bit too far apart for functions to be combined
- Around the fringe between Earles and YROC (only on the Up – I'm surprised that one wasn't made a stop signal, but that'd have required what used to be Earles' Up Section Signal to have been converted to a colour-light to act as the distant for it).
- In tunnels, where you really wouldn't want stop signals
There's a couple of quite significant risks with that arrangement too.
One is that you get YY at the distant in the tunnel, but dont react immediately (other than perhaps shutting off power) because of the distance to the red, then lose focus and only start braking when the Y comes properly into view, by which time it's too late.
The other, which I was always awake to at the similar setup approaching Hazel Grove and then again approaching Edgeley No.1 in the Down direction, is that it's YY 95% of the time or more, so you don't react appropriately on the odd occasion that it's actually just Y, with no further cues then until you encounter the red.
Both these are dealt with under the new arrangement.
There was a 30/50 TSR over Dore West Jn for quite some time prior to the final remodelling. I've not had the pleasure of going since, but I assume that this has now been removed.
edwin_m
Veteran Member
This is the point I was trying (not very well) to make in a previous post. A train catching up with one going into the loop could be following it much more closely, reducing the time the looped train had to wait.
Quite often a line with a mix of faster and slower trains has stop signals more closely spaced near where trains can overtake, because in these areas the faster trains will be catching up with the slower ones approaching the overtake, and going away from the overtake the slower one needs to get moving as soon as possible after the fast. Introducing the loop at Bamford they have done the second part but not the first.
Yes, I see what you mean, and you're right. In this case, the TPE would surely have closed the gap enforced by the Chinley - Edale section in the time taken for the stopper to call at both Hope and Bamford in the same signal section. The extra stop signal would at least let it get on the move from ES3 whilst the stopper was still in the platform at Bamford, reducing the delay to both trains.
On a slightly related note, the box diagram at Earles (as per @GardenRail's earlier post) shows ES3 *slotted by* York ROC. That implies that, if York takes the slot back, the signal returns to danger? Assuming that this isn't the case (which would require some sort of motor-worked mechanical slotting arrangement?!), should this actually say "released by York ROC"?
GardenRail
Member
If we take the slot back it sends an emergency alarm to Earles to replace ES3 to danger. It's an odd set up, with it being a semaphore rather than colour lights. In normal operation, the slot is in auto so that Earles can pull off as required. If we need to replace the slot, we would normally call them first, unless an emergency.
eastwestdivide
Established Member
Seen at Grindleford station, a planning notice for demolition of the signalbox:
Elecman
Established Member
Grindleford box structure may survive for other uses
GardenRail
Member
Better than it becoming an unmaintained wreck that gets a lick of paint every 10 years.
Freightmaster
Established Member
- Joined
- 7 Jul 2009
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- 3,496
My bungalow resembles that remark!
Killingworth
Established Member
See; https://www.networkrailmediacentre....n-of-the-gbp-150m-hope-valley-railway-upgrade
Note Happy Valley, my highlighting!
No, more trains, no significantly quicker trains.
Top 4 destinations from Sheffield, ORR estimates 2022-23
Manchester 442k
London 342k
Leeds 318k
Doncaster 247k
Who notices at Westminster and in Whitehall?
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I hope the Rail Minister had a happy time with no problems with the lifts or with the Rail Replacement Bus. Maybe a Ministerial Replacement ? Hopefully no 'Huskisson momentary lapse' but maybe a political landslide to come?
Killingworth
Established Member
He managed the stairs like everyone else. Hopefully the lifts will be operational more quickly than those at Dawlish. They seem to have taken 6 months.
It didn't rain so lack of seated shelter on the old platform wasn't highlighted as it might have been. The strong winds over the weekend had abated and it was quite mild. The new platform is remarkably exposed to prevailing westerlies!
Network North: Rail Minister Huw Merriman cuts the ribbon at refurbished station on Sheffield-Manchester line - video Dailymotion
The Rail Minister, Huw Merriman MP, cut the ribbon at the official opening of the Dore & Totley station in Sheffield. It is part of a £150million rail improvement project in the Hope Valley line between Sheffield and Manchester. Mr Merriman spoke with The Star's Harry Harrison after the...
www.dailymotion.com
Love it- train comes in loudly on 'wrong' (old) platform, deafening what was being said!
I note from Real Time Trains what looks like ONLY 1tph each way stopping at Dore, and (coincidentally reducing noise nuisance?) the down St Pancras- Sheffield 'express' 1F20 was delayed 10 mins between Chesterfield and Sheffield- https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C54824/2024-04-08/detailed#allox_id=0; while the Piccadilly- Sheffield 2S76 was held for 5 mins at Dore & Totley- https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:W33787/2024-04-08/detailed#allox_id=0.
Many a slip ...?
pokemonsuper9
Established Member
That's completely normal, only at peak times do extra trains stop.
Killingworth
Established Member
Network North: Rail Minister Huw Merriman cuts the ribbon at refurbished station on Sheffield-Manchester line - video Dailymotion
The Rail Minister, Huw Merriman MP, cut the ribbon at the official opening of the Dore & Totley station in Sheffield. It is part of a £150million rail improvement project in the Hope Valley line between Sheffield and Manchester. Mr Merriman spoke with The Star's Harry Harrison after the...
Love it- train comes in loudly on 'wrong' (old) platform, deafening what was being said!
I note from Real Time Trains what looks like ONLY 1tph each way stopping at Dore, and (coincidentally reducing noise nuisance?) the down St Pancras- Sheffield 'express' 1F20 was delayed 10 mins between Chesterfield and Sheffield- https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C54824/2024-04-08/detailed#allox_id=0; while the Piccadilly- Sheffield 2S76 was held for 5 mins at Dore & Totley- https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:W33787/2024-04-08/detailed#allox_id=0.
Many a slip ...?
1F20 was already 9 minutes late at Chesterfield so another minute was no big thing.
2S76 is timed to dwell for 5 minutes at Dore to fit paths into Sheffield. It arrived on time at Sheffield.
You missed 10.14, 2S77, that left Sheffield 4 minutes late, due to leave 10.21 from Dore and was on time by Bamford after dropping the Minister at Dore.
All timings on the Hope Valley route will be adjusted but nothing major likely before June 2025 to allow the new arrangements time to settle in.
If you check this RTT extract you'll see that Manchester commuters are well served from Dore, up to 3 trains an hour at peak times; https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/se...8/0000-2359?stp=WVSC&show=pax-calls&order=wtt
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YorksLad12
Established Member
Boo. It's been corrected.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Indeed 150m for very little benefit to the passengers
Killingworth
Established Member
As planning had started by 1999, with all the subsequent replanning it's probable true cost will have been a lot more than that.
Ok. The ex-London train was delayed before it reached Chesterfield; did it or the train from Dore go into Sheffield first?
Was the 'Ministerial' train, like the one seen on the video coming in to Dore, a mere three coaches? It seems a shame that the Minister can not be filmed 'welcoming' a six-coacher and/or one of the peak 3tph that justified the expenditure.
I note that the train between Dore and Sheffield is timed at 5-11 minutes (typically 7) and priced at £3.15 anytime return; so hopefully a sign of things to come in the fullness of time.
Killingworth
Established Member
He was on the platforms at the station for about an hour and saw a good spread of trains pass on all lines, although he was talking to different people throughout so won't have appreciated the details of every one.
There is cushion in many of the timings to allow for accumulated delays that can potentially arise on routes passing through to/from Aberdeen, Glasgow, Cleethorpes, Norwich, Bournemouth, Penzance , Liverpool and many places in between.
Dore's still a small station but a great place to observe many trains that pass through.
Apologies for my scepticism- it seemed possible that trains had been delayed for the Minister's convenience.
I'm glad he had time there and took opportunity to talk, and hopefully listen.
I considered he had a good record as Chair of the Parliamentary Committee before being minister.
Killingworth
Established Member
If anything his train was delayed to ensure he knew what local users have to experience, but it wasn't enough for him to really notice. It just happened.
Killingworth
Established Member
The new layout has been operational for over 3 weeks and it's good to see services passing each other through Dore & Totley station. That's working well, only 25-30 years since planning for it started.
I have yet to see a freight service standing in the Dore loop (near my house) although it is being used. Work is continuing on the embankment side below Poynton Wood.
I have yet to see a freight service standing in the Dore loop (near my house) although it is being used. Work is continuing on the embankment side below Poynton Wood.
Dave S 56F
Member
Could I just ask on rail U.K. forums about the hope valley capacity scheme updates thread would any member please be able to answer has the dore south junction and dore west junction chord been redoubled what is used for freight trains? or has it just been left single and only the lines through dore and Totley station only been redoubled?
Only the lines through Dore and Totley station have been redoubled. The curve avoiding the station has been lengthened but is still single line. However there is an additional loop on the eastbound line for freight.
Traksy has the correct layout: https://traksy.uk/live/M+38+DORE+-22
GardenRail
Member
Though the loop at Bamford seems to get used more for the Hope Valley stoppers when they're late etc
Indeed. Its much more useful as a loop on the main line than if they'd doubled the south curve.
70014IronDuke
Established Member
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- 13 Jun 2015
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- 3,699
Has timekeeping on the route improved noticeably at all as a result of the re-doubling?
Difficult to say for sure, but recent train times suggests it's getting better at recovering from delays.
Sheffield to Edale search
Link to graph of arrival time actual vs booked. The Scheme opened around March 25th.