Hope Valley stopping services

[MalaiseForever]

Does anybody know why the Northern stopper services are not going via Stockport? This massively increases the time it takes me to travel from Crewe to the likes of Edale, Bamford, Hathersage etc as I now have to go up to Piccadilly and wait 30+ minutes for a connection and the increased travel time of the route via New Mills.

Are there any plans for this worse service to change back to the old arrangement and is it anything to do with the Hope Valley Improvement scheme over the last few years?

It is particularly annoying this weekend as it means I don’t have time to hike before going to the football due to the hugely increased travel times.

 

[rg177]

New Mills has been the normal route for a considerable number of years. It was only when there were protracted emergency engineering works required last year that trains were routed via Stockport instead. It serves as the second stopping service an hour to/from Marple and New Mills so you'd need to replace that (likely to/from Chinley for connections) before you consider diverting the Sheffield service.

 

[MalaiseForever]

I’m sure whenever I have gone hiking before in the Peak District I’ve always changed at Stockport!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

I’m sure whenever I have gone hiking before in the Peak District I’ve always changed at Stockport!

There used to be a single Liverpool - Sheffield (and beyond) service which had an Edale stop, but not the other Hope Valley stations. Something like 1040 at Piccadilly. But that was, oh, 20 years ago?

It was well used by walkers as a faster service to get to Edale but those short distance travellers (Manchester - Edale) made the service much busier, taking up space required by longer distance passengers. Other than that I can't recall the all stations going via Stockport, even back in the 1980's when you had the 'alight and reboard' situation at New Mills. For those not familiar, trains from Sheffield used to terminate at New Mills, proceed up the line, reverse, then come back into the other platform to return to Sheffield. Trains from Manchester did the opposite, at the same time, reversing in the stub of the Hayfield branch (on the Sheffield side of the Station). Passengers had to alight, remain on the platform, then re-board once the trains had done their little dance routine.

 

[ChrisC]

Until the Hazel Grove chord opened in 1986 all trains between Manchester and Sheffield ran via New Mills. Except for a few months last year when the line through New Mills was closed due to a landslip, the stopping service has never run via Stockport.

 

[johnnychips]

I’m sure whenever I have gone hiking before in the Peak District I’ve always changed at Stockport!

Perhaps you went walking off the Buxton line somewhere?

 

[MalaiseForever]

Perhaps you went walking off the Buxton line somewhere?

Nope, never been to Buxton.

I must be imagining a quicker journey to Edale and the likes than in reality. Stranger things have happened!

Thanks all.

 

[175001]

It was a short term change to do with the landslip at New Mills. It's reverted to the route it's taken for years.

 

[tumbledown]

National Rail Journey Planner actually gives the option of Stockport-New Mills Newtown -(walk)- New Mills Central - Edale. Must be a permitted route, and definitely if you have a rover of some sort. Not the quickest way at most times but would warm your legs up.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

National Rail Journey Planner actually gives the option of Stockport-New Mills Newtown -(walk)- New Mills Central - Edale. Must be a permitted route, and definitely if you have a rover of some sort. Not the quickest way at most times but would warm your legs up.

A GM Wayfarer ticket would certainly be valid from Holmes Chapel->Stockport->New Mills Newtown then New Mills Central->Edale and would likely be about the same price as an Anytime Short Return from Crewe to Edale if you're travelling at off peak times, even once you've added on the cost of an appropriate day return from Crewe to Holmes Chapel. If you're lucky, there might even be a convenient bus connection (GM Wayfarer valid on this) between New Mills Newtown and New Mills Central but even if not, it's not that far a walk, being under a mile (approximately).

 

[Pete 1981]

I complained and made them run it through Reddish North again. Stockport has two trains an hour that pass through the Hope Valley, admittedly non-stop. When the service ran through Edgeley/Hazel Grove, it left Reddish North,Brinnington, Bredbury,Romiley,Marple and New Mills without a service along the Valley.

 

[Travellin’man]

Nope, never been to Buxton.

I must be imagining a quicker journey to Edale and the likes than in reality. Stranger things have happened!

Thanks all.

Whilst agreeing with most of the replies I think that on a Sunday the Hope Valley locals have been booked via Stockport on occasions

 

[Kite159]

Whilst agreeing with most of the replies I think that on a Sunday the Hope Valley locals have been booked via Stockport on occasions

Only at times of engineering works which closes the usual route via Marple.

Other than services run early morning/late nights for route knowledge for staff (i.e. 2S90 0546 Manchester Piccadilly to Sheffield)

 

[Jamesrob637]

Whilst on this matter, wouldn't it make sense for at least one Sheffield-bound TPE or EMR to call at Hazel Grove in the evening? The 06:35 Nottingham to Liverpool already does going towards Manchester in the morning, and a welcome addition it is too.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Whilst on this matter, wouldn't it make sense for at least one Sheffield-bound TPE or EMR to call at Hazel Grove in the evening? The 06:35 Nottingham to Liverpool already does going towards Manchester in the morning, and a welcome addition it is too.

Does it possibly depend on the capacity available on these services? If they are already filled by commuters travelling to or from Sheffield then swamping them with inner-suburban customers for Hazel Grove may not be the cleverest idea?

 

[bunnahabhain]

Does it possibly depend on the capacity available on these services? If they are already filled by commuters travelling to or from Sheffield then swamping them with inner-suburban customers for Hazel Grove may not be the cleverest idea?

The Hazel Grove stop is purely to provide extra capacity into Piccadilly in the morning. It's also the reason the Liverpool-Norwich service used to pick up stops at Hough Green, Birchwood and Irlam on some services. Now that Northern have more capacity it's only a few calls at Birchwood and Hazel Grove that remain. I seem to recall going back 20 years or more there was an early Stockport to Liverpool service in this group which split from the ECS Nottingham to Liverpool and picked up additional local stations towards Liverpool like West Allerton and Mossley Hill.

 

[bristollh]

Whilst agreeing with most of the replies I think that on a Sunday the Hope Valley locals have been booked via Stockport on occasions

Going back to Sundays in the late 90s and early 2000s, the two-hourly year-round Hope Valley stoppers ran via Marple, while the additional summer Sunday journeys that made the service up to hourly overall ran via Stockport. It may be this regular arrangement that the OP is thinking of.

Jeff

 

[yorksrob]

Yeah it seems funny doing the New Mills traipse again - but it was ever thus. Hazel Grove was but an interregnum.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Perhaps it's the station calls not the routing that's the issue? There's already an hourly all stops Piccadilly to New Mills train for Manchester commuters so maybe Northern's Hope Valley service should run fast from Piccadilly to New Mills thence all stops to Sheffield? This would both shorten journey times and reduce peak time overcrowding.

 

[scrapy]

Perhaps it's the station calls not the routing that's the issue? There's already an hourly all stops Piccadilly to New Mills train for Manchester commuters so maybe Northern's Hope Valley service should run fast from Piccadilly to New Mills thence all stops to Sheffield? This would both shorten journey times and reduce peak time overcrowding.

This would halve the number of trains at Reddish North, Brinnington, Bredbury and Marple, and reduce services at Romiley. It would also eliminate the possibility of those to/from stations on the Rose Hull services changing at Romiley for the Hope Valley.

Peak time overcrowding is not particularly bad on this line when 3 car 195s are used. (Except when EMR /TPE cancel trains). It's generally only those from Marple onwards into Manchester that need to stand. I'm sure these would rather have the option of standing rather than half the service. Also if the service at these stations is halved, you'd just be shifting crowding onto 1 train per hour, which wouldn't cope.

It's unlikely that journey times would be shortened due to pathing. It'd likely lead dwell time approaching Ashburys/Piccadilly or at New Mills South.