How could heritage railways encourage more visitors to arrive by public transport?

[BRX]

mods note - split from this thread

I'm often a bit disappointed how car-centric some heritage railways are. Even when they have a direct connection to NR - timetables and facilities are sometimes centred around the station which has the biggest car park instead.

 

[Calthrop]

I'm often a bit disappointed how car-centric some heritage railways are. Even when they have a direct connection to NR - timetables and facilities are sometimes centred around the station which has the biggest car park instead.

Rather echoing my notions as in post #62 -- but, if the railway wants custom, and thus money, in fair plenty: it can be seen as needing to exert itself to cater for car-parking -- the inescapable fact is that most visitors will come by car, NR connections or not. (Agreed, timetables should be displayed and easily accessible at all the line's stations.)

I recall a visit many years ago, to the Nene Valley Railway (I've told of this before on the Forums) -- my companion and I got talking to a couple of friendly volunteers on the line. After being duly complimentary about the railway, I ventured to mention my feeling of regret that the line had not been extended through to Oundle (that section remained in genuine use until a latish date), but terminated basically in the middle of nowhere. While the conversation continued to be polite and friendly; one of the guys proceeded to throw a metaphorical bucket of cold water over my head -- or one could call it administering a reality check -- by saying that the things which the large majority of visitors were keenest to get from the railway, were not to do with from where to where it went -- the most-desired things were good car-parking; acceptable, convenient and hygienic toilets; and courtesy from the railway staff.

My initial thought was, "what soulless, imagination-bereft blockheads the punters are"; but on reflection -- fair's fair: if one has a passion for the thing being visited, one will be ready to accept a degree of inconvenience / hardship in the course of experiencing it. If one is not thus passionate -- as "normals" visiting a heritage line are not; they'll be moved just by mild curiosity / nostalgia: then, especially when they are parting with a fairish sum of money for the experience -- they'll wish for the venue to furnish good quality, re everyday aspects of life which are important to them.

 

[30907]

I'm often a bit disappointed how car-centric some heritage railways are. Even when they have a direct connection to NR - timetables and facilities are sometimes centred around the station which has the biggest car park instead.

Or the carriage shed/loco shed (Bluebell, KWVR, Watercress)?
Shared locations with NR tend to lack space for more than minimum facilities - Kidderminster being a superb exception!

Though I agree websites should prioritise public transport info as a matter of policy even when only a tiny minority use it.

 

[Titfield]

I'm often a bit disappointed how car-centric some heritage railways are. Even when they have a direct connection to NR - timetables and facilities are sometimes centred around the station which has the biggest car park instead.

But some other visitor attractions are even worse as they are virtually only accessible by car.

For example Monkey World, The Tank Museum, The Etches Collection all in Dorset.

 

[BRX]

Or the carriage shed/loco shed (Bluebell, KWVR, Watercress)?
Shared locations with NR tend to lack space for more than minimum facilities - Kidderminster being a superb exception!

Though I agree websites should prioritise public transport info as a matter of policy even when only a tiny minority use it.

I always notice what's the first section in the "how to find us" page on preserved railway websites. It's nearly always driving directions. Even for those with mainline rail connections.

 

[paul1609]

I always notice what's the first section in the "how to find us" page on preserved railway websites. It's nearly always driving directions. Even for those with mainline rail connections.

Probably because for every heritage railway in the South passengers arriving from National Rail are 8 % or less of total passengers. It doesn't mean we don't want them but it's unreasonable to expect them to be our priority. I don't have extensive info on the North some of the Metropolitan railways may have a higher figure. Given that the national network has effectively been closed on repeated Saturdays well over a year those figures may well now be too high.

 

[BRX]

Probably because for every heritage railway in the South passengers arriving from National Rail are 8 % or less of total passengers. It doesn't mean we don't want them but it's unreasonable to expect them to be our priority. I don't have extensive info on the North some of the Metropolitan railways may have a higher figure. Given that the national network has effectively been closed on repeated Saturdays well over a year those figures may well now be too high.

Maybe that % could be a little higher with some active encouragement?
The Epping & Ongar seem to be an exception, with quite a lot of effort to provide access by public transport even though they don't have a direct national rail connection. In contrast the Bluebell railway has run events that are essentially impossible to get to without a car.

 

[paul1609]

Maybe that % could be a little higher with some active encouragement?
The Epping & Ongar seem to be an exception, with quite a lot of effort to provide access by public transport even though they don't have a direct national rail connection. In contrast the Bluebell railway has run events that are essentially impossible to get to without a car.

Why don't to volunteer your time and effort at your local railway to promote through travel, I'm sure they'd welcome your offer.

 

[Meerkat]

I'm often a bit disappointed how car-centric some heritage railways are. Even when they have a direct connection to NR - timetables and facilities are sometimes centred around the station which has the biggest car park instead.

The Vale of Rheidoil has moved out of Aberystwyth Station - presumably to have space for better facilities, and to be nearer the car park. Possibly also to be easier for coaches - isn’t a good chunk of business in tourist areas bookings by the coach load, and they need good access very close to a station.

But some other visitor attractions are even worse as they are virtually only accessible by car.

For example Monkey World, The Tank Museum, The Etches Collection all in Dorset.

I walked from the train to the Tank Museum! It felt a long way as it’s pretty boring.

 

[The_Van]

Maybe that % could be a little higher with some active encouragement?
The Epping & Ongar seem to be an exception, with quite a lot of effort to provide access by public transport even though they don't have a direct national rail connection. In contrast the Bluebell railway has run events that are essentially impossible to get to without a car.

There is very limited car parking at or around the EOR so they make a great effort to run and publicise their vintage buses from Epping tube and Shenfield National rail station

 

[BRX]

That’s because only 2% of all journeys in the UK are made rail.

It's because, at the railways concerned, no-one has decided to use the website layout to actively encourage public transport use. That's why.

 

[paul1609]

It's because, at the railways concerned, no-one has decided to use the website layout to actively encourage public transport use. That's why.

I suspect its not. At my railway we have spent an awful lot of time promoting travel by public transport including bus promotions through train bus heritage tickets. Through timetables, the response has been pretty much non existent and in some cases pretty embarrassing. Most of the other Southern railways experiences have been similar.

 

[Titfield]

I suspect its not. At my railway we have spent an awful lot of time promoting travel by public transport including bus promotions through train bus heritage tickets. Through timetables, the response has been pretty much non existent and in some cases pretty embarrassing. Most of the other Southern railways experiences have been similar.

and sadly even where a mainline connection exists persuading significant numbers to use it is a herculean task.

The reality is that most visitors use their cars to visit a heritage railway for the same reason they use their car for all other reasons: convenience, flexibility, cost.

 

[BRX]

But choosing to put the public transport options as the first ones you see when visiting the relevant page of the website doesn't cost anything.

That the majority of visitors come by car doesn't seem to be a justification for promoting that method over others. Or is there a worry that car users will visit the website and think that there are no driving directions because it's not the first thing you read?

 

[LUYMun]

Perhaps a carrot should be attached to the stick for encouraging those to travel by public transport - a discount for showing a valid ticket upon the booking office, for instance?

 

[BRX]

Perhaps a carrot should be attached to the stick for encouraging those to travel by public transport - a discount for showing a valid ticket upon the booking office, for instance?

If you look at the bluebell railway website for example, there is a 2 for 1 offer if you come by train. But when you go to the relevant page

How to get here - Bluebell Railway in Sussex

www.bluebell-railway.com

It shows you the driving options as the default and you have to click through to the "by train" options to discover this offer.

This is the sort of thing, where if the first thing you were presented with was the "by train" info with this 2 for 1 offer highlighted, maybe some people would choose to take advantage of that rather than driving. As it is, the offer only gets advertised to those who are already planning to come by rail.

 

[Meerkat]

Give big prominence to public transport and punters will assume it’s difficult to drive and not bother.
They want to quickly see how easy it is to drive there and what the parking is like.
It’s supposed to be a fun day out - I can’t imagine herding kids around public transport and lugging about all the assorted stuff is a fun day out. Plus it’s expensive and inflexible - you don’t want tired grumpy children and then find it’s nearly an hour until the next train.

 

[BRX]

Give big prominence to public transport and punters will assume it’s difficult to drive and not bother.
They want to quickly see how easy it is to drive there and what the parking is like.
It’s supposed to be a fun day out - I can’t imagine herding kids around public transport and lugging about all the assorted stuff is a fun day out. Plus it’s expensive and inflexible - you don’t want tired grumpy children and then find it’s nearly an hour until the next train.

That's a very defeatist starting point - doing stuff by public transport is too difficult so let's not make any effort to make it easier.

There is an organisation that promotes car-free access to tourist sites - https://www.goodjourney.org.uk/about-us/

I get it that attractions are terrified of upsetting their car-driving majority of visitors. But there are ways of setting out "getting here" pages that promote the public transport options without making it appear like it's difficult to come by car. For example, see Blenheim Palace:

Getting Here

Find information on how to get to Blenheim Palace. The Palace is within easy reach of central London and Birmingham. Both cities are around one and a half hours away by car. Free car parking is available on-site, however, we do encourage the use of sustainable public transport as much as possible.

www.blenheimpalace.com

RHS Wisley are not scared of promoting public transport options:

Getting to RHS Garden Wisley / RHS Gardening

Find out how to get to RHS Garden Wisley by train, bus, coach, bike and car. Travel car-free and save on garden entry.

www.rhs.org.uk

 

[Krokodil]

Give big prominence to public transport and punters will assume it’s difficult to drive and not bother.

Only if their capacity for logical reasoning is severely lacking. I know that we're discussing the general public here, but...

 

[Mike Machin]

and sadly even where a mainline connection exists persuading significant numbers to use it is a herculean task.

The reality is that most visitors use their cars to visit a heritage railway for the same reason they use their car for all other reasons: convenience, flexibility, cost.

Absolutely, especially if you’re travelling with youngsters, there’s no way anybody is going to drive to a station and pay a fortune to park before paying a King’s Ransom for train tickets,wait for a train, hope to get a seat where everyone can sit together, and then repeat this on the way home.

Travelling by car is cheaper, more convenient and comfortable and offers far greater flexibility.

Give big prominence to public transport and punters will assume it’s difficult to drive and not bother.
They want to quickly see how easy it is to drive there and what the parking is like.
It’s supposed to be a fun day out - I can’t imagine herding kids around public transport and lugging about all the assorted stuff is a fun day out. Plus it’s expensive and inflexible - you don’t want tired grumpy children and then find it’s nearly an hour until the next train.

I totally agree! Travelling on public transport with youngsters is a complete non-starter.

 

[BRX]

There are, in fact, people who have kids and don't have a car and believe it or not... they go and do stuff using public transport, where it's made available.

 

[Meerkat]

RHS Wisley are not scared of promoting public transport options:

Drop in the ocean, and to assuage their guilt. Have you been to Wisley? Absolutely enormous car parks full of SUVs and those crossovers that wealthy retired folk drive. Don't think I have ever been anywhere quite so middle class!

 

[Titfield]

There are, in fact, people who have kids and don't have a car and believe it or not... they go and do stuff using public transport, where it's made available.

This summer with the £2 single bus fare I have seen a lot more families, parent with kids on the bus. As Red Ken (and Sheffield) proved really cheap fares will get people on the buses.

 

[30907]

There are, in fact, people who have kids and don't have a car and believe it or not... they go and do stuff using public transport, where it's made available.

And those who have a car and leave it at home/the holiday flat/the nearest station....

 

[BRX]

Drop in the ocean, and to assuage their guilt. Have you been to Wisley? Absolutely enormous car parks full of SUVs and those crossovers that wealthy retired folk drive. Don't think I have ever been anywhere quite so middle class!

I'm not quite sure what point you're making.

 

[Box]

Drop in the ocean, and to assuage their guilt. Have you been to Wisley? Absolutely enormous car parks full of SUVs and those crossovers that wealthy retired folk drive. Don't think I have ever been anywhere quite so middle class!

They are promoting public transport prominently, which I thought was the point under discussion, why is that a problem for you?

 

[Mike Machin]

This summer with the £2 single bus fare I have seen a lot more families, parent with kids on the bus. As Red Ken (and Sheffield) proved really cheap fares will get people on the buses.

Yes, I think my views on Public Transport are somewhat skewed as I have quite a long drive to reach either a train or a bus, (about nine miles to the nearest train and about six miles to the nearest bus), so for me personally it's always quicker and easier to drive.

 

[xotGD]

Have a good selection of ale on the trains and folk will be more likely to come by public transport.

 

[D6130]

Have a good selection of ale on the trains and folk will be more likely to come by public transport.

Agree 100%!

 

[BRX]

Yes, I think my views on Public Transport are somewhat skewed as I have quite a long drive to reach either a train or a bus, (about nine miles to the nearest train and about six miles to the nearest bus), so for me personally it's always quicker and easier to drive.

This is a kind of odd statement; does it mean you are just realising at this point in time that what applies to you personally might not apply to others?

One encounters this kind of response quite a lot when arguing for things to be made more accessible by public transport, people who write the whole notion off as ridiculous because they themselves are not in the habit of getting anywhere without their own car.