HS2 Old Oak Common

[Horizon22]

If they are replacing the GW bridge due to a widening of Old Oak Common Lane then that will be a lengthy blockade wont it?

Relatively lengthy. I think there’s plans for terminating at Ealing Broadway & Reading respectively for a long weekend or potentially 7 days. I imagine it’s a Christmas / NY piece of work.

 

[brad465]

Yes, this been stated often in official documents, such as the last Network Rail Western route study. Also has been regularly pointed out in these forums over recent years, it’s exactly why the GW side will have eight platforms, two for each of the four through lines

I presume there will also be measures taken to try and enforce pick up/set down only in the relevant direction for intercity services, and anyone travelling between OOC and Paddington has to use Liz Line services.

 

[swt_passenger]

I presume there will also be measures taken to try and enforce pick up/set down only in the relevant direction for intercity services, and anyone travelling between OOC and Paddington has to use Liz Line services.

Don’t know. You’re not the first to raise the point though.

 

[cuemaster]

ok

Not to mention the Elizabeth and Bakerloo line tunnels already there, plus H&C sub-surface and the canal alongside.
Paddington is on quite a sharp bend from Royal Oak too, making 400m platforms hard to fit in.
An underground station would probably compromise the whole trainshed structure as well, leading to the same sort of construction problems as at Euston.
The initial search for a London terminus concluded that Euston was the only viable site of the (23?) possibles analysed.

So the box is 15m deep....and the short tunnel 1.2km would come out just north of the great western line so 1.5:100 gradient thereabouts. I dont know if thats too much of gradient for trains... Ah ok yes platforms/400m trains would be an issue but then again what kind of demand would there be in the short term?

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

There was a recent talk given to the PWI in which a track diagram for the GWML at OOC was presented. Here is a screenshot I took at the time. It only shows a single line link to the Chiltern line but an earlier slide in the presentation mentions a proposal for a two-platform station on the Chiltern line.

View attachment 133791


In case you would like to see the presentation. It is available on YouTube

Excellent overview far more information than we often see on big projects so thanks for posting up the link

 

[Jimbo]

Does anyone know how much of the OOC box has been excavated to date please? We’ve only had fragments of information in various updates, articles etc. Also, when do they currently expect to f8nish excavation? Thanks!

 

[Horizon22]

Excellent overview far more information than we often see on big projects so thanks for posting up the link

It was mentioned in that video a provision for an 18 day all-line block for Christmas 2028 - with diversions to Waterloo and increasing capacity at Ealing Broadway

 

[Snow1964]

Does anyone know how much of the OOC box has been excavated to date please? We’ve only had fragments of information in various updates, articles etc. Also, when do they currently expect to f8nish excavation? Thanks!

One end of the box is easier to excavate as it is north of the running lines. The box isn't parallel to the running lines, it's at an angle and the other end goes under the tracks so needs a series of blocks to lift track, bore sidewalls and cap them.

I think box is being excavated top down. Bore the piles for walls in a row so they are almost touching, cast a big concrete slab linking them and forming the roof (or cross beams where being left open), cast in sections along the length, then continue digging out below. I think one of the HS2 updates suggested it will take about 4-5 years to dig, then another couple of years to build up the station building, plus station fit out. But can't find article currently.

 

[zwk500]

Does anyone know how much of the OOC box has been excavated to date please? We’ve only had fragments of information in various updates, articles etc. Also, when do they currently expect to f8nish excavation? Thanks!

The best I can show is this video with some drone shots from a couple of months ago:

 

[Snow1964]

The best I can show is this video with some drone shots from a couple of months ago:

Which is not a lot so far, considering the walls are about 30m deep, and the bottom of hole is going to be dug out to something like 20m deep. The whole box is nearer 850m long between the portals, and upto 70m wide.

The video is only about quarter of depth and a small fraction of the length

 

[PG]

I presume there will also be measures taken to try and enforce pick up/set down only in the relevant direction for intercity services, and anyone travelling between OOC and Paddington has to use Liz Line services.

Will those measures be any more successful than the restrictions imposed for Reading though?

The initial search for a London terminus concluded that Euston was the only viable site of the (23?) possibles analysed.

I wonder if that search considered the possibility of a terminus located outside of the Circle line with passengers changing for the "last mile"?

 

[brad465]

Will those measures be any more successful than the restrictions imposed for Reading though?

How well is it enforced for Avanti between Euston and Watford Jct (or was enforced during Virgin), which I recall being an invalid journey? I don't recall many services trying to discourage it for Reading (other than the handful of peak services that skip it entirely); some of the Devon/Cornwall services have in the down direction at least, usually by not advertising a Reading call on departure boards and leaving just after a Bristol service that calls at Reading.

 

[Benjwri]

Will those measures be any more successful than the restrictions imposed for Reading though?

Quite possibly, I assume they’re going to have to gateline each platform individually (Or paired) for Heathrow express, so they can just set the gateline not to allow entries.

 

[Horizon22]

I wonder if that search considered the possibility of a terminus located outside of the Circle line with passengers changing for the "last mile"?

Which sounds somewhat like OOC itself!

 

[PG]

Which sounds somewhat like OOC itself!

All part of the Treasury's Death by a thousand cuts

 

[Fazaar1889]

Does anyone know how much of the OOC box has been excavated to date please? We’ve only had fragments of information in various updates, articles etc. Also, when do they currently expect to f8nish excavation? Thanks!

Your prayers seem to have been answered by Mr Bottom

HS2 OLD OAK COMMON AREA​

 

[swt_passenger]

Your prayers seem to have been answered by Mr Bottom

That’s not the same box being discussed though, that’s the Victoria Road crossover box a bit further up the line from the Old Oak Common box - the latter only appears in a long shot at the end…

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I think most of that footage is of the Victoria Road Crossover Box rather than the OOC station site (which appears right at the end).
The crossover box is where the Northolt East TBMs will be launched later in the year.

 

[Fazaar1889]

That’s not the same box being discussed though, that’s the Victoria Road crossover box a bit further up the line from the Old Oak Common box - the latter only appears in a long shot at the end…

Ah

 

[bib]

I don't think you will be able to tell what's going on in OOC from the outside because of the top-down construction method, I guess we will have to wait for some official update from HS2. This video sort of shows how it was planned to be built.

 

[bib]

Further progress at HS2’s Old Oak Common Station site as first base slab poured

HS2 have completed the first concrete pour in the west box at Old Oak Common Station Excavation of the 850m underground box has now reached track level in some areas

mediacentre.hs2.org.uk

Update from HS2, they've reached track level at one section of the box and poured the first base slab, looks to be about 1m thick. Gives a good sense of scale if you think that they've got to excavate that deep for another mile or so.
It also claims that they only finished the last of the diaphragm walls and piling in March and the flyover video looks like they haven't started excavation in some parts of the box. Sounds like the plan is to complete it in sections.

 

[Snow1964]

The first base slab poured at Old Oak Common is just one of a number of significant milestones we have on the project in 2023. BBVS JV began permanent works for the station box in June 2021, with the first diaphragm wall (D-Wall) and piling activity taking place on the site. The work was completed in March this year, after BBVS’s contractor SB3 installed the last of 275 D-Wall panels and 161 bearing piles, completing the 1.8km long wall.

Work to begin constructing platforms for the ground level platforms, to be used by the Elizabeth Line and Great Western Mainline services, will begin later this year.

Further progress at HS2’s Old Oak Common Station site as first base slab poured

HS2 have completed the first concrete pour in the west box at Old Oak Common Station Excavation of the 850m underground box has now reached track level in some areas

mediacentre.hs2.org.uk

 

[Samzino]

So apparently the Old Oak Common Station will be served by Lizzy line trains adding to a new stop on the line.

'No reason' passengers will pick Euston over Old Oak Common rail minister says

HS2 passengers will have to take the Elizabeth line from West to Central London initially, even though direct classic trains will continue at the same time

www.mylondon.news

 

[swt_passenger]

So apparently the Old Oak Common Station will be served by Lizzy line trains adding to a new stop on the line.

Well we’ve known that since the very beginning. It’s why there have always been 8 GW Platforms. 4 main and 4 relief.

 

[Fazaar1889]

So apparently the Old Oak Common Station will be served by Lizzy line trains adding to a new stop on the line.

'No reason' passengers will pick Euston over Old Oak Common rail minister says

HS2 passengers will have to take the Elizabeth line from West to Central London initially, even though direct classic trains will continue at the same time

www.mylondon.news

yep, like the image below. the purple bit is where the trains will be...ish
EDIT: image updated to be more accurate

 

[Samzino]

yep, like the image below. the purple bit is where the trains will be...ish
View attachment 135599

Ah I see. Well then so the current Paddington stoppers we still have on the Lizzy line I assume then will extend to terminate aswell eventually st OOC

Well we’ve known that since the very beginning. It’s why there have always been 8 GW Platforms. 4 main and 4 relief.

Ah I see

 

[hwl]

yep, like the image below. the purple bit is where the trains will be...ish
View attachment 135599

No the Hitachi depot to the south of the GWML is unaffected, the new relief line platforms will all be north of the existing relief lines, most of the platform length overlaps with the Hitachi Shed. some of the new relief line tracks will be on top of the eastern end of the HS2 box.

Ah I see. Well then so the current Paddington stoppers we still have on the Lizzy line I assume then will extend to terminate aswell eventually st OOC

Correct, but there aren't quite enough 345 units to do the extend all services hence the TfL to Dft funding request

 

[swt_passenger]

yep, like the image below. the purple bit is where the trains will be...ish

That is very wrong, you’d be better off deleting that sketch or anyone reading this thread in future will be completely misled. The drawing linked in post #55 shows the correct platform locations, even if its not current for the expected track layout:

https://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/hs2-maps-20120110/hs2arp00drrw05301issue3.pdf

 

[Fazaar1889]

No the Hitachi depot to the south of the GWML is unaffected, the new relief line platforms will all be north of the existing relief lines, most of the platform length overlaps with the Hitachi Shed. some of the new relief line tracks will be on top of the eastern end of the HS2 box.

You're right. it wasn't meant to be the most accurate. just did a rought sketch off the top of my head. the general idea of the station extending over the GWML is what is important

That is very wrong, you’d be better off deleting that sketch or anyone reading this thread in future will be completely misled. The drawing linked in post #55 shows the correct platform locations, even if its not current for the expected track layout:

https://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/hs2-maps-20120110/hs2arp00drrw05301issue3.pdf

you're right. i just changed it to an official picture

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Correct, but there aren't quite enough 345 units to do the extend all services hence the TfL to Dft funding request

According Ian Visits article the DfT are engaging with TfL over how these units could be funded.

https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/article...eth-line-trains-to-cope-with-hs2-demand-63123

Also in that article this comment struck me

One concern that’s being raised by TfL is that the platforms being built at Old Oak Common might not support level boarding onto the Elizabeth line trains, and TfL is pushing for the station design to ensure level boarding without staff having to provide ramps. Apart from the moral case for level boarding, with the numbers of passengers expected to need to swap between HS2 and Elizabeth line at the station, having staff installing ramps for people who need them could cause problems in offering the planned 24 trains per hour that the Elizabeth line delivers.

Surely not in this day and and age would you not build platforms except for level boarding. If it doesn't work for other trains don't stop them.