If you were in charge of the East Midlands Railway franchise

[Jorge Da Silva]

Ok so if you were to be awarded an 8-year franchise to run the East Midlands Franchise from August 2019 until August 2027, What would you do?

Think about:

• What stock you would use?
• What timetable changes would you make and why?
• When would you introduce the changes?

Most of the things that are currently planned but I would :

• Extend 'fast' Sheffield service to Leeds providing a direct service from Leeds to Derby and Leicester on a regular basis
• Extend one train per day from Sheffield to Barnsley
• Extend the Crewe-Derby service to Nottingham and Manchester Airport
• Introduce a Summer Saturday direct service from Skegness to London St Pancras
• Keep Summer Saturday London-Scarborough
• Run Nottingham to Norwich service to Sheffield via Derby

 

[adamedwards]

Run a Leicester - Nuneaton - Tamworth - Lichfield - Stoke - Macclesfield - Stockport - Manchester service. Given there's no capacity in the Hope Valley but might be this way round. 110mph converted 365 with batteries for the unelectrified bit!

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Run a Leicester - Nuneaton - Tamworth - Lichfield - Stoke - Macclesfield - Stockport - Manchester service. Given there's no capacity in the Hope Valley but might be this way round. 110mph converted 365 with batteries for the unelectrified bit!

No capacity between Stoke and Manchester is there?

 

[Glenn1969]

How about a Leicester- Burton- Derby- Chesterfield- Sheffield- Manchester service once the Hope Valley Upgrade scheme is completed

I agree with Skegness to London and would add a direct service from Cleethorpes to St Pancras

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

How about a Leicester- Burton- Derby- Chesterfield- Sheffield- Manchester service once the Hope Valley Upgrade scheme is completed

I agree with Skegness to London and would add a direct service from Cleethorpes to St Pancras

Cleethorpes to London St Pancras? Would it not just be easier to extend the LNER Lincoln service, why St Pancras instead of Kings Cross anyway.

I think Skegness was planned by EMT but never implemented. How many trains between Cleethorpes and London? 1 train per day?

 

[Glenn1969]

This post refers to the EMR franchise so it has to be St Pancras. You are right that Kings Cross makes more sense

 

[yorksrob]

Keep the HST's until 2022 to ensure an orderly transfer to the new stock (no 180 rubbish).

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

This post refers to the EMR franchise so it has to be St Pancras. You are right that Kings Cross makes more sense

No harm in doing it though. How about a separate shuttle between Leicester and Nottingham via all stations and joining the Grimsby Town to Leicester service to the Birmingham-Leicester forming a Birmingham-Leicester-Nottingham-Lincoln-Grimsby service but would only call at Loughborough and East Midlands Parkway between Leicester and Nottingham.

 

[Glenn1969]

Good idea but Leicester- Birmingham is a Cross Country service not EMR

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Good idea but Leicester- Birmingham is a Cross Country service not EMR

Transfer it instead of it going to WMT (as proposed by the DfT). Another idea I had was to extend my proposed Barnsley service and run it hourly to Huddersfield (could it go to Bradford?, more direct than via Leeds or Doncaster surely) so the EMR InterCity timetable would look like this.

• 1tph London St Pancras to Leeds: Leicester, Derby, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Wakefield Westgate and Leeds
• 1tph London St Pancras to Bradford Interchange: Calling at: Leicester, Loughborough, East Midlands Parkway, Long Eaton, Derby, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Barnsley, Huddersfield, Halifax and Bradford Interchange
• 1tph London St Pancras to Nottingham: Calling at: Market Harborough, Leicester, East Midlands Parkway and Nottingham
• 1tph London St Pancras to Nottingham calling at: Bedford, Kettering, Market Harborough, Leicester, East Midlands Parkway, Beeston and Nottingham
• 2tph London St Pancras to Corby: Calling at: Luton Airport Parkway, Luton, Bedford, Wellingborough, Kettering and Corby
• 2tpd London St Pancras to Melton Mowbray: Caling at: Luton Airport Parkway, Luton, Bedford, Wellingborough, Kettering, Corby, Oakham and Melton Mowbray
• 1tpd London St Pancras to York (Weekends only) Calling at: Leicester, Loughborough, East Midlands Parkway, Long Eaton, Derby, Chesterfield, Sheffield Doncaster and York
• 1tpd London St Pancras to Scarborough (Summer Saturdays Only) Calling at: Leicester, Loughborough, East Midlands Parkway, Long Eaton, Derby, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Doncaster, York and Scarborough
• 2tpd London St Pancras to Lincoln Central: Calling at: Bedford, Kettering, Market Harborough, Leicester, East Midlands Parkway, Beeston, Nottingham, Lowdham, Newark Castle, Collingham and Lincoln Central
  • 1tpd continues to Cleethorpes: calling at Market Rasen, Barnetby, Grimsby Town and Cleethorpes
• 1tpd London St Pancras to Skegness (Summer Saturdays Only): Calling at: Market Harborough, Leicester, East Midlands Parkway, Nottingham, Grantham, Boston and Skegness

 

[Glenn1969]

I think it could go to Bradford but given the single line at Bradley Jct it may have to replace the current Northern service

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

I think it could go to Bradford but given the single line at Bradley Jct it may have to replace the current Northern service

Bradford-London would be more direct than via Leeds or via Doncaster and provide Huddersfield and Barnsley with regular hourly services to London.

 

[Glenn1969]

2 per hour on the Penistone line requires an infrastructure intervention because there is quite a lot of single track between Huddersfield and Barnsley but I agree the idea is a good one. Not sure whether Barnsley- Wakefield- Huddersfield is possible without a reverse at Kirkgate

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

2 per hour on the Penistone line requires an infrastructure intervention because there is quite a lot of single track between Huddersfield and Barnsley but I agree the idea is a good one. Not sure whether Barnsley- Wakefield- Huddersfield is possible without a reverse at Kirkgate

I proposed running Sheffield to Barnsley then Huddersfield and then using the curve which runs to the line to Halifax and Bradford, no Wakefield required.

 

[Glenn1969]

The Penistone Line has 20 miles of single track that would need doubling before service can be increased to 2 per hour. Thus far neither PTE has shown much sign of being willing to pay for it or lead a bid for funding for it

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

The Penistone Line has 20 miles of single track that would need doubling before service can be increased to 2 per hour. Thus far neither PTE has shown much sign of being willing to pay for it or lead a bid for funding for it

Ah fair enough.

 

[tbtc]

It's not all in the EMR "map" but I think that Leicester really needs improved services - half hourly to Birmingham/Derby and little better to Nottingham (given the slowness of the Ivanhoe stopper).

Would a half hourly Ivanhoe service work, permitting skip-stopping to speed it up, to provide a combined fifteen minute frequency between the cities? Similarly, a "turn up and go" frequency on the Nottingham - Derby line.

Oh, and forget about Bradford/ Huddersfield/ Penistone. Focus on improving services in the "core" area - the East Midlands franchise ought to exist to improve things for the main bits of the East Midlands, not giving some civic pride to bits of Yorkshire wanting the "prestige" of seeing their name on the departure boards down in That London.

Extend 'fast' Sheffield service to Leeds providing a direct service from Leeds to Derby and Leicester on a regular basis

If the intermediate platforms could take it then I'd suggest extending the half hourly London - Sheffield services onto the half hourly Sheffield - Meadowhall - Barnsley - Kirkgate - Leeds service (upsetting the tiny number of people who've got used to the direct Lincoln - Leeds service, sure)... but I can't see any more spaces for trains through Westgate after the two/three coach 195 from Nottingham to Bradford is sent that way (plus the short DMUs from Knottingley via Featherstone occupying a path through Westgate). But I don't think Meadowhall could cope with a five coach AT300

Extend one train per day from Sheffield to Barnsley

I'm not convinced of much real benefit of "one a day" services - other than giving some local councillors/MPs some feeling of importance. Either it justifies a proper service or not.

Run Nottingham to Norwich service to Sheffield via Derby

That'd be even slower than today (from Norwich/ Peterborough/ Nottingham to Sheffield) - plus there's already four/hour from Derby to Sheffield.

Introduce a Summer Saturday direct service from Skegness to London St Pancras

I agree with Skegness to London and would add a direct service from Cleethorpes to St Pancras

Cleethorpes to London St Pancras? Would it not just be easier to extend the LNER Lincoln service, why St Pancras instead of Kings Cross anyway

If London - Leicester - Cleethorpes would be better run from Kings Cross instead (and, I agree, it would, if such a service were ever to exist) then I can't understand people putting up with the longwinded way of getting from London to Skegness via Leicester etc. But I can't see the need for either coastal town to get a London service as any kind of priority TBQH.

 

[Aictos]

In partnership with a infrastructure company with the DfT being kept away from the partnership, I would do the following:

1. Remodel Leicester itself and the surrounding approaches so reducing conflicts and making it OHL ready.

2. Electrify Market Harborough and Corby to Leicester first with Leicester being the changeover point from Diesel to OHL and vice versa.

3. Once Point 2 is completed, then work north of Leicester to Nottingham and Sheffield via Derby and Langley Mill.

4. Enough Class 800s to replace all HSTs and Class 222s with a equal mix of 5 and 9 coach sets with the HSTs being retired by no later then Dec 2020.

5. Service wise, might be wise off peak to run a 10 car between London and Leicester with 5 going to Nottingham and 5 going to Sheffield.

 

[MidlandMainlie]

In partnership with a infrastructure company with the DfT being kept away from the partnership, I would do the following:

1. Remodel Leicester itself and the surrounding approaches so reducing conflicts and making it OHL ready.

2. Electrify Market Harborough and Corby to Leicester first with Leicester being the changeover point from Diesel to OHL and vice versa.

3. Once Point 2 is completed, then work north of Leicester to Nottingham and Sheffield via Derby and Langley Mill.

4. Enough Class 800s to replace all HSTs and Class 222s with a equal mix of 5 and 9 coach sets with the HSTs being retired by no later then Dec 2020.

5. Service wise, might be wise off peak to run a 10 car between London and Leicester with 5 going to Nottingham and 5 going to Sheffield.

Personally I would like to see 2 new platforms built on the East side of Leicester along with grade separation of Wigston and Knighton junctions (for a restored service to Burton on Trent) so the cross country services do not need to cross the fast lines. Electrification extended from Market Harbrough to Leicester.

Platform 1 would be for Northbound IC services to Nottingham/Derby/Sheffield

Platform 2 would be for Southbound IC services to St Pancras and would be non-stop after Leicester

Platforms 3 & 4 would become platforms where new electric 360 services would terminate

New platforms 5 & 6 would be for Ivanhoe services to Nottingham, restored services along Burton line and Cross Country services to Birmingham and East Anglia.

The IC Service patten from St Pancras would be

2TPH to Sheffield
1 fast calling at Leicester - Derby - Chesterfield- Sheffield
1 semi fast calling at Leicester - Loughbrough - East Midlands Parkway - Derby - Chesterfield- Sheffield

2TPH to Nottingham
1 Fast calling at Leicester - Nottingham only
1 Semi fast calling at Leicester - Loughbrough - East Midland Parkway - Nottigham

Alternatively if stopping at both Loughborough East Midlands Parkway lead to an unbalanced timetable then either the Loughborough or East Midland PW stop could be added to the fasts.

With extra EMU's the electric service from St Pancras would 2 TPH to Corby calling at

Luton/Luton Airport Parkway alternate - Bedford - Wellingborough - Kettering - Corby

2TPH to Leicester

Luton/Luton Airport Parkway alternate - Bedford - Wellingborough - Kettering - Market Harbrough - Leicester

Would this require somewhere for IC services to overtake the fast? If so then with Beford due s rebuild then platform 5 could be added so current platform 4 become a through platform for non stop services?

Finally with the grade separation of Wigston and Knighton Junctions and 2 new platforms at Leicester then I wouuld like to see the East Midlands Franchise take on the Cross Country services along with their 170's. The Birmingham to Stansted could be interworked with the Nottingham to Norwich st that you would have

1 tph Birmingham NS - Nuneaton - Leicester - Melton - Oakham - Stamford - Peterbrough - Ely then alternate Cambridge - Stansted or Thetford - Norwich

1 tph Nottingham - Grantham - Peterborough- Ely then alternate Cambridge - Stansted or Thetford - Norwich.

Finally Ivanhoe services between Leicester and Nottingham would be extended to Birmingham calling at all stations and a Derby to Leicester via Burton service calling at Peartree - Wellington - Burton then reopened stations along the Burton Leicester line.

XC would take on the displaced 222's for Nottingham- Cardiff services

Just a few thoughts

 

[Aictos]

One service I would like to see happening is Ivanhoe services serving Coalville.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Would it be worth adding a Manchester to London St Pancras service? by extending the existing Sheffield service and the other service could go to Leeds?

better connectivity for Leicester

 

[Bletchleyite]

Get the work done on Bedford station to have platforms on both fast lines, and stop both Nottinghams or one of each there for connections from Thameslink, but not carrying passengers between London and Bedford on those.

 

[43096]

Get the work done on Bedford station to have platforms on both fast lines, and stop both Nottinghams or one of each there for connections from Thameslink, but not carrying passengers between London and Bedford on those.

No. Inter-City services should be that and shouldn’t be calling at every lamppost. The planned service using Kettering as an interchange hub is fine (in the absence of wiring to Leicester), it just needs a Sheffield service stopping there in place of one of the Nottinghams.