Improving the Exeter area

[MarkyT]

Realistically you would double from the junction but just short of Polsloe Bridge to avoid expensive station rebuilding work but provide space for a train to Exmouth to clear onto the branch without blocking trains behind.

Agree that would be a cheaper way to increase resilience. The station really does need improved access though. A Penryn-style arrangement as shown in my comment #46 above, with the double to single turnout part way along a lengthened single platform could share an improved access for trains in both directions.

Don’t forget the cross over by Pennsylvania Bridge. This used to used quite often years ago to turn trains back towards St Davids but is a move that is seldom used now.

I can understand the reluctance to use it routinely as if the other cab proves problematic on changing ends you might end up stuck on the main line. It's still there as an alternative in an emergency.

 

[Irascible]

We've got a bit tied up in Central-Exmouth for a bit, what else can be improved?

* North to Taunton I don't think much can be done other than flood prevention towards Stoke Canon & wires.
* To Crediton, redouble from Newton St Cyres, sort out Crediton's token equipment/maybe properly redouble to Yeoford to provide a bit of resilience. Anything further north to Barnstaple?
* Towards Newton Abbott ( as opposed to Newton Abbott itself ) - any more loops needed? any remodelling?

Sadly I think freight through here is pretty much dead, which I guess provides some focus, anyway. Perhaps a night logistics flow to replace the nightly 737 flight from East Mids might happen ( there's some huge depots by the airport now, it'd only take a south facing spur straight off the WoE to service most of them ), but industry in the SW has been comprehensively stamped out so other prospects I find minimal.

 

[Meerkat]

As an outsider I have always thought that St Thomas needed a high level (ie long bridge) pedestrian route all the way across all the roads and the river to New Bridge St, connecting local passengers from the south with the lower end of the city centre.

 

[21C101]

Does anyone have any idea when the recontrol will be done and what NR actually are planning.

I assume that Abolition of Exmouth Junction and Crediton boxes is a given.

Anything else presumably they will want outside funding for.

Reconfiguring Crediton to Yeoford gets a lot of improvement for relatively little cost. The down platform at Yeoford still exists and step free access between the two via the Station Road overbridge is not beyond the bounds of possibility.

Agree that congestion at Exeter is an issue. Exeter Central platforms are long enough for two trains. A radical solution is to shorten them at the West End and turn from two through platforms and two fairly useless London facing bays into two Island Platforms with four through roads. A new footbridge would leave the ticket office and provide an elevated passage above the old through roads to the the point where the remodelled platforms start.

At Exeter St Davids the layout is based around tbree through platforms for Plymouth Line snd two yhrough platforms used as terminus roads for services from Central ie totally unsuited to the service.

It really needs to be reconfigured so that the main line runs through platforms 5&6.

A double junction then leads from the main line from St Thomas to platforms 1&3 as well as from Central to 1&3.

Half of the through road between 1&3 is reinstated giving access to the north end of both platforms, effectively turning 1&3 into double platforms (given four Exmouth Paignton and Vice Versa reverse there).

Platform 4 would be an additional through platform with access from both Central and St Thomas.

Cowley bridge. Provide a half mile long passing loop beyond the river bridges so trains heading to Crediton don't clog the main line wating for trains from Crediton.

That together with the west of Crediton reconfiguration would give enough resilience to extend Waterloo trains to Okehampton instead of the current shuttle which would remove a train hourly from Exeter and stop Waterloo trains and Okehampton trains terminating there clogging the place up.

Double all the way from Cowley to Crediton would be nice but probably fail the bean counter test.

Exmouth junction double as far as Polsloe Bridge Stn (exclusive) gets exmouth trains awaiting line clear off the main line.

A dynamic loop at Eggesford and doubling from Chapelton to Barnstaple with second platform would allow some Padd to Paignton trains to have a Barnstaple portion but probably far too expensive

 

[Irascible]

It's a pity about the road bridge, because there's so much free space to the immediate east of Central you could build something enormous. I'm leaning more and more to not turning trains round there though - Okehamptons to Axminster or Honiton, Barnstaples to Newcourt as suggested upthread, although it might be a nice touch to send anything that turns around at St Davids & doesn't need the depot up there anyway.

Barnstaple was meant to be getting naother platform back, wasn't it? what if anything happened there?

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Half of the through road between 1&3 is reinstated giving access to the north end of both platforms, effectively turning 1&3 into double platforms (given four Exmouth Paignton and Vice Versa reverse there).

You can’t easily split platforms 1 and 3 as the gradient from Exeter Central (one of the steepest on the country) requires an overlap through to the Red Cow Crossing for trains running down the bank.

 

[21C101]

You can’t easily split platforms 1 and 3 as the gradient from Exeter Central (one of the steepest on the country) requires an overlap through to the Red Cow Crossing for trains running down the bank.

Bother.

In that case whatever you do at Central then St Davids is going to be a pinchpoint.

In that case getting Crefiton to Coleford reconfigured and a passing loop on the west side of the Cowley river bridge has got to be an imperative so that the Waterloo to Exeter service can be extended to Okehampton without undue performance risk, getting shot of one an hour right through the Exeter "core" and eliminating long platform occupation of platform 1 by terminating Waterloo trains.

Various other layout enhancements could be made including doubling the connection between 1&3 and the line to St Thomas, access from Central to platform 4 and better connection between 1, 3 & 4 to the up main.

 

[Irascible]

WoE don't need to go to Okehampton, Okehamptons need to go to Axminster - which means I think the loop required is on the WoE. Resilience says "put more track between Cowley & Crediton" though.

Service-wise I'd see both platforms at Central linked to St Davids directly, so WoE generally go in and out of P1 at St D & the up platform at Central no matter which way they're actually travelling, and Exmouths/anything else passing through go through the down platform at Central & in and out of P3/4. Not exclusively, of course. That means both sides of the bank need to be bidirctional.

 

[21C101]

Extending trains from the Taunton direction to Exeter Central would be a better solution for Passengers than extending platform 2 and enable pax from Bristol, Taunton etc to actually get to Exeter by train rather than being deposited at a Parkway station named after St David on the edge of town.

 

[devon_belle]

Indeed - Exeter Central is crying out for better infrastructure.

 

[Xavi]

Extending trains from the Taunton direction to Exeter Central would be a better solution for Passengers than extending platform 2 and enable pax from Bristol, Taunton etc to actually get to Exeter by train rather than being deposited at a Parkway station named after St David on the edge of town.

Cullompton and Wellington will be almost certainly be served by the Cardiff - Penzance service. Platform 2 extension is primarily for turning around 5-car IETs and Voyagers.

 

[devon_belle]

Cullompton and Wellington will be almost certainly be served by the Cardiff - Penzance service. Platform 2 extension is primarily for turning around 5-car IETs and Voyagers.

Is Cullompton being built on the old site (i.e. with loops) or a new site?

 

[Xavi]

Indeed - Exeter Central is crying out for better infrastructure.

I agree. There's loads of space for turnback sidings between the main platforms to save time and avoid running to Exmouth Junction. Won't be practical until relay-based signalling is replaced though.

 

[devon_belle]

I agree. There's loads of space for turnback sidings between the main platforms to save time and avoid running to Exmouth Junction. Won't be practical until relay-based signalling is replaced though.

Some interesting ideas have been discussed in this speculative thread. As you say all wishful thinking until the signalling can be changed.

RE: Cullompton and Wellington being served by the Cardiff-Penzance trains, it does feel a shame that the stations will not get a direct link to Exeter Central (students, commuters, and shoppers alike would have appreciated this I suspect). Axminster to Taunton rather than Axminster to Barnstaple/Okehampton would be better in my opinion. Maybe there aren't enough paths between Exeter and Taunton.

 

[Dan G]

It's unrelated to Exeter PSB but what Exeter and surrounds needs more than anything is the loop at Whimple to allow 2tph to Axminster. Aiui Central and St David's has the capacity to accommodate the movements required.

I wonder how Wellington and Cullompton stations would be serviced. Surely not by stopping IETs? Ideally those stations would have 2tph to Exeter.

 

[Irascible]

Extending Bristol-Tauntons I thought. There's a thread somewhere, the project's been in progress for quite a while..

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Extending Bristol-Tauntons I thought. There's a thread somewhere, the project's been in progress for quite a while..

Most of the Tauntons already run through to Penzance anyway.

 

[Meerkat]

It's unrelated to Exeter PSB but what Exeter and surrounds needs more than anything is the loop at Whimple to allow 2tph to Axminster. Aiui Central and St David's has the capacity to accommodate the movements required.

I wonder how Wellington and Cullompton stations would be serviced. Surely not by stopping IETs? Ideally those stations would have 2tph to Exeter.

If there was a GWR shuttle to Axminster would SWR want to drop some stops?

 

[HamworthyGoods]

If there was a GWR shuttle to Axminster would SWR want to drop some stops?

The expectation has always been Whimple and Feniton would drop into a new Axminster service and Pinhoe and Cranbrook would see a service increase.

 

[Wychwood93]

The expectation has always been Whimple and Feniton would drop into a new Axminster service and Pinhoe and Cranbrook would see a service increase.

That sort of implies that SWR services will be fast from Honiton to Central, subject to pathing etc.?

 

[devon_belle]

That sort of implies that SWR services will be fast from Honiton to Central, subject to pathing etc.?

For Pinhoe and Cranbrook to see a service increase that would mean that SWR would have to stop at these stations, unless there was more than 1 GWR train per hour.

 

[Dan G]

Most of the Tauntons already run through to Penzance anyway.

So it would be the Penzance-Cardiff services that would stop at Wellington and Cullompton? That wouldn't provide sufficient frequency.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

So it would be the Penzance-Cardiff services that would stop at Wellington and Cullompton? That wouldn't provide sufficient frequency.

yup, I understand that to be the case.

 

[30907]

So it would be the Penzance-Cardiff services that would stop at Wellington and Cullompton? That wouldn't provide sufficient frequency.

Hourly is realistic at this stage, assuming they fill any gaps in the service.

 

[Dan G]

The Cardiff to Plymouth/Penzance service is every two hours. I'd be surprised if that's judged to be sufficient frequency for C and W.

I guess maybe the hourly semi-fast IETs from London could call at them as well as Tiverton Parkway.

 

[Irascible]

The Cardiff to Plymouth/Penzance service is every two hours. I'd be surprised if that's judged to be sufficient frequency for C and W.

I guess maybe the hourly semi-fast IETs from London could call at them as well as Tiverton Parkway.

Ouch. A rush-hour extra shuttle might cover it though.

 

[devon_belle]

The Cardiff to Plymouth/Penzance service is every two hours. I'd be surprised if that's judged to be sufficient frequency for C and W.

I guess maybe the hourly semi-fast IETs from London could call at them as well as Tiverton Parkway.

Extending the Cardiff - Taunton would make the most sense to me. Perhaps utilise the longer P2 now XC don't need it as much. As discussed upthread (or in the other one) I would like to see direct services to Exeter Central, however.

 

[Dan G]

I wonder if an IET could run to Central. Presumably extended Cardiff-Tauntons could. The question then would be what is required to get the capacity for them to come and go from Central.

If the Whimple loop was built IETs could provide one half of a 2tph service to Axminster! Axminster to Cardiff, anyone?

 

[Class172]

IETs can definitely run up towards and through Central as this is something they do when there are blockades near Taunton and GWR services divert via Yeovil.

 

[devon_belle]

Is the long-term plan to have IETs on those services? Once other units get cascaded I wonder if they will take over.

Really the Taunton to Axminster service would probably benefit from commuter-style stock with short dwell and convenient doors.