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Information for GTR Southern passengers during strike (no DOO discussion)
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One for Jeremy Corbyn to board then if he is ever serious about travelling on overcrowded train services.
I note the tone on Southern's Web Site is more positive.
http://www.southernrailway.com/your-journey/strike/travel-advice-for-the-amended-timetable/
I wonder how many additional services will run before the full timetable is in place?
tsr
Established Member
It's hectic with whatever formation and whatever calling pattern "they" decide, that's for sure. Pretty much considered jinxed by the crews who have the joy of working it.
I'm very curious about any added stops it's doing at Norwood Junction. I'm sure this must be some sort of regular stop order given on the evening, if that's what it's doing (I haven't really been paying too much attention other than having been made aware that it's rather a lot busier), rather than something on the diagrams. I'll see if I can find out what's going on.
I guess not only is the lack of the half-hourly Uckfield service making it busier, but also the sheer volume of passengers displaced by the lack of London Bridge-East Grinstead services.
Surreytraveller
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Or if you are going to use them, use the correct ones
Seeing that the 07.12 was short formed yesterday and today, didn't take the train on Monday, from East Croydon to London Bridge.. Is it possible to claim a delay repay on it seeing the next LBG train was 16 minutes after?
Actually scrap the above.. Looks like the difference was only 14 minutes...
Actually scrap the above.. Looks like the difference was only 14 minutes...
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Deepgreen
Established Member
Southern's web site tells us that OBSs are able to concentrate on their sole role of "Customer Service". I wonder what this means, as I have yet to see a single OBS on the train on any Southern working, and only ever hear them repeating the recorded announcements (such as this morning when the OBS made three very poor attempts to get his message out, only to be followed immediately by the recorded announcement as we entered Victoria. Pointless. Extract below:
"This follows the completion by Southern at the start of the year of its programme to put drivers in sole control of the operation of the train, including closing the doors, on nearly 80% of routes and the transfer of many conductors to the new on-board supervisor role focused exclusively on customer service."
"This follows the completion by Southern at the start of the year of its programme to put drivers in sole control of the operation of the train, including closing the doors, on nearly 80% of routes and the transfer of many conductors to the new on-board supervisor role focused exclusively on customer service."
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Whoops think I might have been imagining the added stop at Norwood J as it didn't stop there last night. Instead it left LBG at the same time as the late running Horsham train. The UCK train overtook the Horsham train and went through the dive under and was well ahead of the Horsham train. However the Horsham train was put through New Cross Gate first, so we had to wait and follow it down. Horsham train I think does stop at Norwood J as we were late in to East Croydon.
Yes as a passenger I would say the 18.06 is definitely carrying extra people down to Oxted at present, but it's also carrying a vast number of people to East Croydon. The LBG to ECR part has always been very busy but at present it's approaching crush loading.
In the full timetable it often gets stuck behind a late running all stops East Grinstead train and is therefore late leaving Oxted. Timekeeping from Edenbridge on though has improved significantly with the longer platforms. The unloading time at intermediate stations is significantly shorter than it used to be.
It's still late most days, just not as late as it used to be!
Next Tuesday the full timetable is back so then I guess.
Are roasters arranged from Monday to Sunday? Being issued each Monday for the following week so to speak?
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Bishopstone
Established Member
So next Tuesday, we establish whether they've retained enough Guards to run the full timetable on routes that still need them.
LBSCR Times
Member
No doubt there will be a shortage of 313 units on the coast......
They are claiming the full timetable will be introduced so that I'd what I am expecting, bar any individual train faults or incidents that occur on the day which could not be known about this far in advance.
Out of interest, has anyone noticed any additional trains running yet. They said they would run them where possible.
Also I see an additional 200 trains will run on Monday. I wonder if we will get figures on the percentage of trains running. I don't remember any figures during the drivers strike and there were trains running that day, abet hardly any.
Also.be interesting to see how many additional trains are run on the Tuesday compared to the Monday.
Bishopstone
Established Member
Genuine question.
If a 377 substitutes for a 313, can it run DOO (or with an OBS)? In other words, have Seaford and the shacks between Chichester and Havant (etc) been passed for DOO, even though 313s are the only or almost only booked traction?
If you check Southern's journeycheck like pages, you will find a number of additional trains scheduled tomorrow - principally to Tonbridge and Watford Junction from my brief perusal.
That's good. I was only looking at their strike pages, which said they would if they could but doesn't mention any specifics, other than no trains running to Watford.
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http://www.southernrailway.com/your-journey/plan-your-journey/live-running-information/
I see most of the trains to and from Milton Keynes Central are starting at Selhurst. What would be the reason they can't start at East Croydon?
Who says they can't? But they must be able to run more trains with the available resources if they go directly to Selhurst from the depot without reversing.
87015
Established Member
First West London line has jacked at Willesden, been standing for 30 and counting.
The only London Bridge train from East Grinstead (during overtime ban/strike period) was cancelled & an incoming train managed to contact the 3rd rail at Dormans this morning. Oxted Line messed up on top of reduced service!:roll:
Deepgreen
Established Member
Poor at Blackfriars yesterday evening when a 319 formation was turned south to north in platform 1. A chaos of mis-information ensued - first it was not in service, then in service bound for St. Albans, then empty to City Thameslink, then announced as being the first train to St. Albans to passengers waiting on platform 2, who then crossed to platform 1, and then finally out of service again! It was a contemporary 'Monsieur Hulot's holiday'!
The indicator board obstinately refused to show it until shortly before departure when it was shown as the 1644 to St. Albans, when it was actually out of service anyway!
Can northbound trains from platform 1 at Blackfriars not run in service? If not, why not, as the route is fully signalled?
The following southbound trains stacked up from City Thameslink northwards.
What a mess.
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That's what they are supposed to do!
The indicator board obstinately refused to show it until shortly before departure when it was shown as the 1644 to St. Albans, when it was actually out of service anyway!
Can northbound trains from platform 1 at Blackfriars not run in service? If not, why not, as the route is fully signalled?
The following southbound trains stacked up from City Thameslink northwards.
What a mess.
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That's what they are supposed to do!
Here's an example of PIS communication at East Croydon on platform 3. At 18.20 and about 49 seconds the 18.21 to Bignor Regis was showing as on time.
Suddenly the board updated to it being the second train due in, now at 18.24, with a 3 minute delay. The first transaction was now the late running 18.18 to Brighton. That was previously listed as the second time.
The Bognor train soon changed to 18.25. Then 18.26.
To be fair the station announcer was keeping customers informed once the train was delayed.
Then the PIS changed to 18.27 and train arrived. I knew it would likely leave at 18.28. However it didn't. It left at 18.29! So it came from being on time, less than 30 seconds before it was due to leave and after the doors should have closed, to being 8 minutes late!
I assume it had got past the previous signal before the station and was at that point on time.
I also assume it would have cleared from the other summery departure boards. However would it have been put back on once the delay increased?
The next fastest train to Redhill seemed to keep showing it throughout but that was the screen on platform 3 itself.
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With an extra 200 trains running tomorrow, they are still advising people not to travel during the peak.
So does anyone know how many trains won't be running tomorrow compared to the full timetable on Tuesday?
Suddenly the board updated to it being the second train due in, now at 18.24, with a 3 minute delay. The first transaction was now the late running 18.18 to Brighton. That was previously listed as the second time.
The Bognor train soon changed to 18.25. Then 18.26.
To be fair the station announcer was keeping customers informed once the train was delayed.
Then the PIS changed to 18.27 and train arrived. I knew it would likely leave at 18.28. However it didn't. It left at 18.29! So it came from being on time, less than 30 seconds before it was due to leave and after the doors should have closed, to being 8 minutes late!
I assume it had got past the previous signal before the station and was at that point on time.
I also assume it would have cleared from the other summery departure boards. However would it have been put back on once the delay increased?
The next fastest train to Redhill seemed to keep showing it throughout but that was the screen on platform 3 itself.
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With an extra 200 trains running tomorrow, they are still advising people not to travel during the peak.
So does anyone know how many trains won't be running tomorrow compared to the full timetable on Tuesday?
They claimes they would run a full service so bar on the day train faults or track issues that I'd what I'm expecting. Obviously last minute sickness can't be helped either but those aside I'm expecting a full service.
They bigged themselves up by stating this fact.
swt class 450
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Can anyone confirm am i correct in thinking that there will be no 171s or 313s (or 455s on the Dorking to Horsham and Leatherhead to Guildford lines) running today during the Guards strike or have any management Guards been trained on them? Also am i correct in thinking that all the 377s will run normally today as they are all now DOO?
171s are running on the Uckfield line. They are running the hourly Service so a few are not running. No idea who the guards are as I missed my train this morning and diverted to Tunbridge Wells
No Guildford bound trains running today as far as I can tell. Wasn't helpful to people living in Bookham as an issue at Wimbledon meant only the 58 minutes past the hour Guildford to Waterloo via Bookham trains seemed to be running. Of course during the morning peak between 7 and 9, there are no 28 mins passed as those are taken up Southern trains which weren't running today.
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http://www.southernrailway.com/southern/news/southern-set-to-restore-full-rail-service/
The last figure I saw for trains running during a conductors strike was 61% or as the BBC recorded, 62%.
Now this means one of three things:.
1. Southern are rounding up their percentage of trains running figures
2. Southern are rounding down their percentage of trains running figures
3. I didn't see the percentage of trains running during the pervious strike and the figures I quote are from an earlier strike.
It's a minor point but I thought I'd note it all the same.
If the last strike was indeed 60% then that suggested a combined conductors strike and overtime ban results in an extra 1-2% of trains being cancelled compared to a conductors strike without overtime ban. This being prior to the additional DOO routes in January of this year.
Tomorrow I'm expecting approximatky remaining 30% to be running of course.
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Welcome to the full timetable. The 7.13 arrival from Sutton into Guildford and the 7.22 departure to London Bridge have been cancelled due to a broken down train. To be fair that could not have been known about in advance. However given this service hasn't run for some weeks, I doubt passengers who would regularly use it when it did run will to happy. These things happen though. Just unfortunate it's today.
Less excusable though is the 6.58 Haywards Heath to Brighton and the 8.06 to London Bridge. They are cancelled due to a shortage of drivers.
Note they no longer say industrial relations, driver sickness or anything else. No doubt those reasons would return should the any future action take place.
So GTR's statement that they would run a full timetable didn't happen. I'm not surprised.
I see the 8.41 Redhill to Horsham is cancelled due shortage of train crew. I don't say if it's a driver or conductor.
The 7.16 to London Bridge is skipping Redhill today as it left Littlehampton 47 minutes late due to a waiting train crew. That seemed to happen quite a bit when their was industrial action. No such action today.
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Deepgreen
Established Member
No - it has proved categorically not to be!
GTR were setting themselves up to fail and digging themselves a hole by saying they would restore a full timetable.
If they said they hoped to restore a full timetable, there would have been a get out but they didn't. They publicised the high standard of 100% trains running, not me, and not surprisingly failed to deliver it.
If they had said we plan to timetable 100% of our trains that would have also got them a get out clause but they didn't.
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