joining 110a (or 113a) rail to 109lb

[McRhu]

See attached pic which shows an unorthodox method of filling a large expansion gap between two jointed rails. This utilises a chunk of 113a (rounded head) between lengths of 109 lb rail (flat head). Whilst what the photo depicts probably isn't entirely in keeping with normal main line practice, it does make me wonder what happens when you join a length of rounded head rail to an older flatter-headed variety (98lb, 109lb or original 110 lb). To avoid a bump is the rounded head ground down slightly into a kind of ramp, or do transition rails (much like the ones for joining CEN 60 to 113a) exist? Many thanks for any illumination.

 

[Bald Rick]

Whilst what the photo depicts probably isn't entirely in keeping with normal main line practice

That’s putting it mildly! If anyone did that on a running line on the NR network they could expect a conversation with the boss, no biscuits, no tea!

 

[furnessvale]

That’s putting it mildly! If anyone did that on a running line on the NR network they could expect a conversation with the boss, no biscuits, no tea!

Many years ago that happened near Kirkham when the sub inspector involved was pulling back jointed track one night but by the end of the possession had not lost the gap! he did no more than fly fished a piece in as shown in the photo!

As you say, he had a tea and biscuitless discussion with the boss!

 

[paul1609]

See attached pic which shows an unorthodox method of filling a large expansion gap between two jointed rails. This utilises a chunk of 113a (rounded head) between lengths of 109 lb rail (flat head). Whilst what the photo depicts probably isn't entirely in keeping with normal main line practice, it does make me wonder what happens when you join a length of rounded head rail to an older flatter-headed variety (98lb, 109lb or original 110 lb). To avoid a bump is the rounded head ground down slightly into a kind of ramp, or do transition rails (much like the ones for joining CEN 60 to 113a) exist? Many thanks for any illumination.

There's transition fishplates that lift the rail to the correct height to correct height, different types of rail etc. Sometimes these are also called junction plates or joggle plates. Theres also minimum rail lengths specified for use in passenger running lines which are generally at least 2 metres so what your photo shows wouldn't be acceptable in a passenger running line on a UK heritage railway or mainline. On welded rail there are special moulds for joining different types of rail with thermal welding.

 

[McRhu]

There's transition fishplates that lift the rail to the correct height to correct height, different types of rail etc. Sometimes these are also called junction plates or joggle plates. Theres also minimum rail lengths specified for use in passenger running lines which are generally at least 2 metres so what your photo shows wouldn't be acceptable in a passenger running line on a UK heritage railway or mainline. On welded rail there are special moulds for joining different types of rail with thermal welding.

Many thanks for that. The issue here is the difference in the rail head shape, in addition to the height of the rails although I suppose if the flat headed rails were lifted to the same height as the highest point of the rounded head crown that would do the trick. Yes I see what you mean.

As an aside I’m sure I read somewhere that the original 110 rail (not 110a) had a flat head like the earlier rail sections and that the high crown was later introduced to improve the way the coned wheels steered along the track. Can anyone confirm this?

That’s putting it mildly! If anyone did that on a running line on the NR network they could expect a conversation with the boss, no biscuits, no tea!

Hence the expression “Mind the gap”.

For the record, this was a very mothballed line which hadn’t seen a train for many years. I think the idea was to keep it maintained to the bare minimum for a track machine to pass along although that never happened sadly. I have many pictures of the line as it descended into ruin. It was a real patchwork of different rail types and sizes.

 

[plugwash]

I'm no expert, but my understaninding is that when different rail profiles (or the same nominal profile but with different amounts of wear) are joined a grinder is used to blend the transition.

 

[Annetts key]

I’ve seen a similar bodge (although all rails were the same type) in the line to an engine depot. And yes, engines ran over it…

 

[mr_moo]

I'm no expert, but my understaninding is that when different rail profiles (or the same nominal profile but with different amounts of wear) are joined a grinder is used to blend the transition.

Ish - that's the 'bodge' way, but there are more 'preper' ways to do it.

If it's jointed track, you can get special fishplates that allow for the difference in section and make the rail head be in the same plane. sometimes the grinder is needed if the two sections have very different levels of wear on them though, although there are diffferent fishplates available for that too.

In welded rail you get a factory made casting where the rail is cast to transition from one profile to the next over a very short distance, with the head being the same along the length.

I have also seen a bodge like that but only on very ill-used sidings or as quick fixes.

 

[plugwash]

Even with the positions matched, wouldn't a transition from say flat top to rounded top rail need some shaping of the railhead?