Kentish Town station closure from 26th June

[MikeWh]

How does that work on Oyster/contactless/keyGo? Are there at least validators on the platform?

There is at least one validator next to the night gate.

 

[Blindtraveler]

This is going to be a right pain in the bum for so many reasons. I am quite surprised that this station is not a potential candidate for a set of incline lifts such as scene on the Elizabeth line and at greenford, this would make it step free and whilst admittedly passenger flow through the station might be slightly hampered as you can accommodate less people this way I'm not sure quite how much of an impact it would have most of the time

 

[Chris M]

This is going to be a right pain in the bum for so many reasons. I am quite surprised that this station is not a potential candidate for a set of incline lifts such as scene on the Elizabeth line and at greenford, this would make it step free and whilst admittedly passenger flow through the station might be slightly hampered as you can accommodate less people this way I'm not sure quite how much of an impact it would have most of the time

There simply isn't space for an incline lift without constructing another shaft. An incline lift is approximately the same width as an escalator, and the two (1 up, 1 down) at Kentish Town completely fill the shaft they run in. The capacity of an incline lift is only a fraction of that of an escalator (based on the one at Liverpool Street Crossrail I would estimate less than 10%) so replacing one escalator with a lift is also a non-starter (and post 12 makes me doubt it would be physically possible to do this without an awful lot of work).

When this station gets step-free access, my money is on it being a normal vertical lift in one of the disused* lift shafts, with additional excavation and construction work done to allow level access to both platforms (the original lifts arriving at a landing in between the two levels). But given that step-free access will (at some point) be coming to Camden Town when that is rebuilt, step-free interchange to Thameslink available at both St Pancras and West Hampstead (lifts at West Hampstead Jubilee are I believe in the planning phase), and step-free access to the North London Line available both Gospel Oak and Camden Road (but not Kentish Town West), the station is simply not near the top of the priority list and unlikely to become so until after the Thameslink station gets step-free access (and the lack of step-free access to the tube will move that down NR's priority list).
*Chances are one or both are actually currently in use for ventilation, cable routes, machinery, etc.

 

[Recessio]

The existing escalators, which are the most unreliable on the Underground network, were installed in 1997 and are bespoke to the station, making it difficult to source parts for maintenance and repairs. The new escalators will be the same model as those used on the Elizabeth line and throughout the London Underground network making sourcing parts much easier and this will lead to a reduction in unplanned station closures, improving reliability for customers. They are expected to last for around 40 years.

1997 was when the Jubilee Line Extension was being constructed, so why did Kentish Town not just get standard escalators like the many new JLE stations (presumably) did?

Was this some penny-pinching to get a cheaper model, that has now come back to bite them with increased repair and early-replacement costs?

 

[Blindtraveler]

Yes I was wondering this as well. And what did it have before and how long did they last?

 

[miklcct]

Two standalone readers have been installed at the National Rail entrance of the station.

May I ask if:

- more Thameslink trains will call at Kentish Town (most current pass through without stopping) to absorb the demand from the displaced Tube passengers? For example, the Luton - Rainham / Orpington services?
- Will there be a temporary out of station interchange between Kentish Town and the nearby Northern line stations, to facilitate journeys such as Highgate to Cricklewood avoiding zone 1?

 

[Starmill]

Two standalone readers have been installed at the National Rail entrance of the station.

May I ask if:

- more Thameslink trains will call at Kentish Town (most current pass through without stopping) to absorb the demand from the displaced Tube passengers? For example, the Luton - Rainham / Orpington services?
- Will there be a temporary out of station interchange between Kentish Town and the nearby Northern line stations, to facilitate journeys such as Highgate to Cricklewood avoiding zone 1?

Some of them do call before 0700 anyway, with more down services later than that, and in the PM peak there are 2tph which start and terminate at Kentish Town. Outside of these times there's unlikely to be enough time for services from Luton to stop there. The stops at Brent Cross West or West Hampstead Thameslink could have been moved to Kentish Town but this likely wouldn't be very popular.

 

[ac-03]

This is going to be a right pain in the bum for so many reasons. I am quite surprised that this station is not a potential candidate for a set of incline lifts such as scene on the Elizabeth line and at greenford, this would make it step free and whilst admittedly passenger flow through the station might be slightly hampered as you can accommodate less people this way I'm not sure quite how much of an impact it would have most of the time

Step-free access at Kentish Town Station

www.london.gov.uk

 

[Blindtraveler]

Can't say I'm surprised but still

 

[Horizon22]

The re-opening is to be delayed to September. I do wonder with ageing assets how often this sort of thing might occur with similar station closures that are extended due to “essential repairs” additionally found.

Kentish Town Tube station to remain closed until September

It was closed in April to upgrade the escalators but transport bosses say other repairs are needed.

www.bbc.co.uk

A TfL spokesperson said: "The work to upgrade the escalators at Kentish Town Tube station is progressing well and we are on track to complete the installation of the new escalators this summer.

"However, during unrelated work to improve other parts of the station we identified assets that require essential repair to allow the station to operate safely.


"Our engineers are doing everything possible to reopen the station, which is projected to happen in September, while ensuring that the high standards of safety our colleagues and customers expect on the Tube are met."

 

[Recessio]

It does make sense to try tackle as many major repairs as they can while the station is closed, to prevent future closures. Even if it is very annoying that it gets pushed back further.

 

[jdhondy@gmail.]

What would be better is improved planning i.e. a survey to seek to work out what might need doing in addition to the escalator work but to make everyone wait for many months and then blithely announce that the closure is to be extended by a couple of months for reasons to include some cleaning and painting shows the total disregard TfL has for its customers.

 

[stuu]

What would be better is improved planning i.e. a survey to seek to work out what might need doing in addition to the escalator work but to make everyone wait for many months and then blithely announce that the closure is to be extended by a couple of months for reasons to include some cleaning and painting shows the total disregard TfL has for its customers.

That's really not what the press release says

 

[jdhondy@gmail.]

Isn't it? How would you view the following

Transport for London (TfL) said that other essential repairs during the upgrade is prolonging its closure.
This includes deep cleaning, painting, installing a new floor and wall tiling, as well as new signage.

No-one would have known that some cleaning, painitng, tiling and signage would be needed.

 

[stuu]

No, they said that while doing other repairs, they had "identified assets that require essential repair to allow the station to operate safely". I'm not privy to what that may be, but they are clearly stating that they found something that they didn't know about which needs fixing. That's not cleaning, painting or tiling

 

[jdhondy@gmail.]

Is your position of senior apologist recently acquired? It seems pretty clear that excuses are being made for a failure to stick to a schedule and whether they are the only reasons or not some of the quoted examples should have reasonably been anticipated. Perhaps they found some addtional things because of the poor assessment of the difficulty of the job in the first place? It all adds up to a miserable failure which affects quite a lot of passengers for a long time.

 

[matthewmacleod]

Is your position of senior apologist recently acquired? It seems pretty clear that excuses are being made for a failure to stick to a schedule and whether they are the only reasons or not some of the quoted examples should have reasonably been anticipated. Perhaps they found some addtional things because of the poor assessment of the difficulty of the job in the first place? It all adds up to a miserable failure which affects quite a lot of passengers for a long time.

It would be better to refrain from personal attacks and again read this statement:

"However, during unrelated work to improve other parts of the station we identified assets that require essential repair to allow the station to operate safely.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Isn't it? How would you view the following

Transport for London (TfL) said that other essential repairs during the upgrade is prolonging its closure.
This includes deep cleaning, painting, installing a new floor and wall tiling, as well as new signage.

No-one would have known that some cleaning, painitng, tiling and signage would be needed.

I think that there is an alternative interpretation of what TfL are saying.

They said in two paragraphs (and you quoted most of them).

Transport for London (TfL) said that other essential repairs during the upgrade is prolonging its closure.

+

This includes deep cleaning, painting, installing a new floor and wall tiling, as well as new signage but no compensation scheme is in place for surrounding businesses.

My bold.
To me the word "this" applies to the upgrade part of the preceding paragraph.
The word "this" does not apply to the "other essential repairs".

The statement is NOT saying the "deep cleaning, painting, installing a new floor and wall tiling" are part of the "other essential repairs" discovered late on.

It seems obvious to me that while removing the escalators or other work they will have discovered something that was essential to repair - a nasty/likely example would be structural. It is an old building that has undergone several alterations. There would have been serious alterations to insert the escalators and shafts about 100 years ago.

It could also be that removing the old tiling or floor has uncovered surprises that would never be found by any amount of planning.

The only way to discover the unexpected in such a compact station would be to close the station so as to be able to remove the escalators, floor and tiles. Therefore to discover the unexpected would require a prolonged closure of the station prior to executing the works. That was never going to happen as it would add significantly to the amount of closure time for the project.

 

[thomalex]

I went through the station southbound yesterday and quite a number of tiles had been hacked off the walls.

 

[AndroidBango]

I went through the station southbound yesterday and quite a number of tiles had been hacked off the walls.

Is that related to the cleaning of the extensive graffiti the week before last (I think)?

 

[Mojo]

Is that related to the cleaning of the extensive graffiti the week before last (I think)?

l wouldn’t have thought so; it’s very easy and quick to clean off graffiti from tiles, as proven from the number of times stations get hit on Christmas Day.

 

[Edvid]

According to a Ham & High article the recent delay was necessitated by unstable concrete being discovered during demolition of the ticket office, and that it would not have been possible to identify it in prior surveys.

Cause of Kentish Town Tube station reopening delay revealed​

15th March

By Nathalie Raffray
@HamandHigh
Senior Reporter

TfL has finally revealed the problem that caused the delay in reopening a busy underground station.

Kentish Town Tube station has been closed since June 26 last year to replace old escalators, remove the "redundant" ticket office and realigning ticket barriers.

The work was due to be completed by early summer, but reopening was pushed back to September after TfL "identified assets that require essential repair".

Conservative mayoral candidate Susan Hall had written to the Labour mayor Sadiq Khan seeking answers about the “absurd” delay.

After questions from this paper, TfL said that work demolishing the old ticket office has revealed unstable concrete - but this was not reinforced autoclaved aerated concrete (RAAC), and that asbestos was not found.

There has been frustration after the delay was announced. Shopkeepers said the prolonged closure was harming trade.

Police are also investigating after platform walls were plastered with graffiti.

In her letter, Ms Hall outlined concerns from residents and businesses, including those of women she had spoken to who have been forced to walk a longer distance home from Camden Town station in the dark.

She said: “To close the station for more than a year in the first place, to replace two escalators and carry out basic maintenance work, seems mindbogglingly lengthy and to extend that further with such little detail or reassurance is unacceptable.

“With the further inconvenience of nearby Tube stations regularly having to close due to overcrowding, alongside the extended closure of local bus stops, the range of public transport options available for residents are seriously lacking, not least for women who are now having to walk much longer distances home in the dark after work."

A spokesperson for TfL said the concrete problem found during ticket office removal was "not a safety issue" but did mean work had to be carried out to secure it.

They added: "There are issues with the ceiling that couldn’t have been identified by surveys beforehand, so dealing with that has caused the delay."

Regarding any safety issues, the spokesperson said there is an "extensive" local bus network serving the area including the 134 from Archway and 88 and 214 from Highgate village and Parliament Hill, all running towards Camden Town Station.

They also advise customers to use Kentish Town Thameslink station, or nearby Tufnell Park Tube station for Northern line services.

"We work extremely closely with our policing partners to help keep all those using the public transport network safe," they added.

The spokesperson said TfL will publicise the reopening date of the station as soon as it is in a position to do so.