Last RailAir Cancelled - Getting A Taxi Refund

[lxfe_mxtterz]

Hi all - apologies for the lengthy post.

Wasn't sure whether to post this in Disputes & Prosecutions or Buses & Coaches...

I'm in a difficult situation here and am looking for the best way to get reimbursed for a taxi as a result of First Bus' appalling, shambolic service.

Last night, myself and another passenger were at Heathrow Central Bus Station intending to catch the last departure of the day, the 23:15, RA2 service to Guildford.

The driver of the RA1 service to Reading, which was boarding at the time, informed us that the RA2 had broken down on its way to the bus station, that an engineer was on the way, and that a replacement coach would be sent out.

Following this, there was zero information provided whatsoever once the RA1 had departed. We tried to speak to the rude and incredibly unhelpful Heathrow Bus Station assistant who told us to "Get a taxi" and walked away from us.

None of the telephone lines were open at that time of night, and the only member of staff was Mr Dismissive at the bus station.

Given this, we decided to travel to Terminal 5 (the next stop on the RA2) where we hoped to find people who were more willing to help us. Unfortunately, we narrowly missed the last Underground service, and were told that the next bus wasn't for another hour, but met an incredibly kind lady who paid for a taxi to Terminal 5 for us.

Upon arrival at Terminal 5, we met another passenger who had been waiting for the last RA2, and he echoed the same information we were given by the RA1 driver at the Heathrow Central Bus Station.

We managed to find some helpful British Airways staff who actually listened to us and tried to give us some advice, despite not having anything to do with the buses, unlike the appointed "bus station assistant" earlier.

They said that we should be able to get our taxi costs reimbursed, but having spent what feels like half of my life on First Bus' complaints page, most of the time they don't even bother to respond, and when they do, they lead you on a wild goose chase to try and get a refund thinking that you'll conclude it's too much hassle and forget about it.

Alas, after two hours of weighing up our options (and waiting for that "replacement coach" which, of course, never turned up), I eventually decided to pay for a taxi for the three of us to Guildford, stopping at Woking en route - with the intention of claiming this back from the bus company.

This cost me almost £50 - bearing in mind I had already paid for a RailAir ticket which I couldn't use.

So we, as paying passengers, have been abandoned, lied to and left to sort out our own transport.

I'm wondering if anybody on here is able to give me advice on how to go about battling for this taxi refund (along with a refund on our unused tickets) - do I have a legal leg to stand on in the event that I have to escalate this matter?

Any advice greatly appreciated - many thanks.

 

[Titfield]

Sorry to hear of your misfortunes.

Firstly its worth pointing out that you would not normally get both the taxi fare and the coach tickets refunded. The issue is about obtaining reimbursal your additional costs. However they may decide to refund the coach tickets as well as a gesture of goodwill given the inconvenience. (I would ask for this given the circumstances).

I would email [email protected] keeping the account as concise and as factual as possible.

Whilst the service was undoubtedly very poor focusing on what you want (the taxi refunded and possibly the cost of the coach tickets reimbursed as a gesture of goodwill) is the best course of action. Sadly the Ts and Cs appear to be very much on the side of the bus company.

I would scan the taxi receipt and attach the scan.

Obviously keep copies.

You could refer the matter to bus users uk if you do not get satisfaction but give First Bus a reasonable period of time to respond.

 

[WesternLancer]

Something I don't know much about but are 'Railairlink' coaches 'sponsored' in any way by the train company they relate to (and as a consequence appear in the national Rail timetable)?

If they do - does that mean that passengers booked on them benefit from the same terms and conditions that rail passengers have? Which may be better than the terms offered by the bus company, and have better recourse to agencies like Passenger Focus when pursuing matters if rebuffed at an early stage.

Hopefully other forum members with more expertise could clarify my thoughts here.

EDIT - strikethrough as others have clarified below that this is not the case

 

[Titfield]

I wondered about that but have come to the conclusion that the short answer is no. There are specific ts and cs relating to fares (some but not all railcards are accepted, national bus concessionary passes are not) but nothing else I can find that suggest these services are quasi rail services and thus rail ts and cs apply.

I had my own complaint about Rail Air resolved earlier this year when I complained that the website did not make clear that pre purchased tickets are cheaper than paying on the coach. Having said that the difference was marginal (£1) but the underlying purpose for my complaint was not the money but ensuring accuracy.

A small number of bus and coach services appear in rail company timetables I think because historically these were once replacements for withdrawn rail services but this is not the case in this instance.

 

[AlterEgo]

Indeed these are not rail services at all, and are on departure boards and sites like RTT for convenience. The NRCoT places no obligations on the bus operator and you are bound by their terms and conditions.

 

[Haywain]

Something I don't know much about but are 'Railairlink' coaches 'sponsored' in any way by the train company they relate to (and as a consequence appear in the national Rail timetable)?

If they do - does that mean that passengers booked on them benefit from the same terms and conditions that rail passengers have? Which may be better than the terms offered by the bus company, and have better recourse to agencies like Passenger Focus when pursuing matters if rebuffed at an early stage.

Hopefully other forum members with more expertise could clarify my thoughts here.

They will be sponsored by a train company but are, I believe, a normal bus service at the same time. In any event, if a through rail/bus ticket wasn't held any recourse available to rail passengers isn't likely to apply.

 

[Watershed]

As far as I understand, whilst they appear in the National Rail timetable and there are through fares (as well as fares in the National Rail systems which purely allow travel on RailAir), they are still not rail services and thus the usual provisions, such as Delay Repay don't apply. The NRCoT explicitly envisages that tickets may include contractual rights involving third parties and make clear that in this case, the third party's terms apply.

Of course, regardless of what their conditions of carriage may say, FirstBus couldn't exclude the basic implied terms that arise in any consumer contract (that the service paid for is to be provided, and with reasonable care and skill, inter alia). In these circumstances, I would have said there is no need to rely on any particular contractual terms to be entitled to reclaim the cost of the taxi; it is a basic matter of consumer and contract law.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks to those who have posted above to respond to my point and correct me / clarify the situation with these types of services.

 

[lxfe_mxtterz]

Thanks all for the information, and thanks in particular for your advice @Titfield - re the email address you have provided, may I ask where you found it? I'm not doubting you in any way, it's just that I'm having trouble finding that particular address on their website (it prompts a contact form instead) and I don't want to send my complaint to the wrong place.

EDIT: Found it on one of their emails!

 

[James Wake]

However the last service should run, late if necessary, so I would certainly put some weight behind that as well in your complaint. However lately with driver shortages I think the operators are being let off quite lightly, however a breakdown they could’ve replaced, the RA2 can run with buses instead of coaches and it runs from Slough, so not far from Heathrow

 

[Titfield]

However the last service should run, late if necessary, so I would certainly put some weight behind that as well in your complaint. However lately with driver shortages I think the operators are being let off quite lightly, however a breakdown they could’ve replaced, the RA2 can run with buses instead of coaches and it runs from Slough, so not far from Heathrow

We do not know if the last service actually ran beyond the two hours the OP stated he and others waited for it. I have known operators decide not to operate the last service in circumstances such as this in the belief that by the time the service will actually run, any passengers for the service will have long since "made alternative arrangements".
By the time the coach was fixed, the driver may be out of hours which could possibly act as a further factor in the decision making process. This does not justify not operating the service of course.

 

[James Wake]

We do not know if the last service actually ran beyond the two hours the OP stated he and others waited for it. I have known operators decide not to operate the last service in circumstances such as this in the belief that by the time the service will actually run, any passengers for the service will have long since "made alternative arrangements".
By the time the coach was fixed, the driver may be out of hours which could possibly act as a further factor in the decision making process. This does not justify not operating the service of course.

Looking at bustimes.org, it backs up that the coach broke down on the way to Heathrow, it actually got to the Compass Centre, and it does seem like it was not replaced. Of course being in schedules I know about drivers hours, however I do agree with you that reasons like that don’t justify not operating the last service

 

[miklcct]

I have known operators decide not to operate the last service in circumstances such as this in the belief that by the time the service will actually run, any passengers for the service will have long since "made alternative arrangements".

It is reasonable if the route in question has late night alternatives, for example, when the last London Bus 16 breaks down the passengers can be put on an N16.

However, if the route in question is the only bus route serving a particular neighbourhood (which I'm not sure if the RailAir service is the case or not), I will have no choice but to wait for a replacement, unless the distance is short enough to walk (e.g. 2 km).

 

[Titfield]

It is reasonable if the route in question has late night alternatives, for example, when the last London Bus 16 breaks down the passengers can be put on an N16.

However, if the route in question is the only bus route serving a particular neighbourhood (which I'm not sure if the RailAir service is the case or not), I will have no choice but to wait for a replacement, unless the distance is short enough to walk (e.g. 2 km).

There are alternatives: taxis or private hire (minicabs). I have known "stranded passengers" at airports go back into terminals and approach those clustered around arrivals if they are going their way and can give them a lift.

As I am sure many transport operators would confirm. When a service doesnt turn up some passengers decide to make their own alternative arrangements. The longer the wait the greater the uncertainty, the greater the number of passengers who take matters into their own hands.

 

[Sultan]

It is reasonable if the route in question has late night alternatives, for example, when the last London Bus 16 breaks down the passengers can be put on an N16.

However, if the route in question is the only bus route serving a particular neighbourhood (which I'm not sure if the RailAir service is the case or not), I will have no choice but to wait for a replacement, unless the distance is short enough to walk (e.g. 2 km).

The RA2 Railair Service is the only bus serving this route from Heathrow - Woking - Guildford. It even has additional local stops, such as Woking McLaren (for the employees there, and the occasional F1 driver flying in) - Occasionally some of them just use it to get to Woking, about 2 miles away.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Even though it was bought as part of a through journey, the FirstBus Conditions of Travel come into play here (per Condition 4.4 of the NRCoT, which states "Some Tickets entitle you to goods or services from another party (for instance the right to travel on bus services). Where this is the case, your Ticket is also evidence of a contract between you and that other party, whose own conditions will apply when using their services.")

The relevant condition being 2.2: "To the extent possible, we will advise Customers of any disruption to our services. However, in the event of cancellation, delay, diversion or termination of any of our services, or of our services being unavailable to you as a result of the vehicle being fully loaded, at capacity or for any other reasons, we shall not be liable for direct or indirect losses, damages, cost or inconvenience that you suffer as a result, save to the extent that any losses are covered by fixed compensation schemes which are specified locally."

Or to summarise: If a journey is cancelled, tough.

Not saying the OP wouldn't get something as a gesture of goodwill, but there's no entitlement to it.

 

[Haywain]

Even though it was bought as part of a through journey,

Was it part of a through journey?

 

[CyrusWuff]

Was it part of a through journey?

Good point. I've assumed it is, given the OP identified it specifically as the RailAir service, but it's equally likely they'd bought a ticket through the FirstBus website or app, or could have intended to buy on board.

Whatever the ticketing situation, it's the FirstBus CoT that apply for the bus/coach leg, rather than the NRCoT.

 

[Watershed]

The relevant condition being 2.2: "To the extent possible, we will advise Customers of any disruption to our services. However, in the event of cancellation, delay, diversion or termination of any of our services, or of our services being unavailable to you as a result of the vehicle being fully loaded, at capacity or for any other reasons, we shall not be liable for direct or indirect losses, damages, cost or inconvenience that you suffer as a result, save to the extent that any losses are covered by fixed compensation schemes which are specified locally."

They may say that, but purporting to exclude all liability in the event of not providing the contracted service won't pass muster as a term in a consumer contract.

 

[lxfe_mxtterz]

Was it part of a through journey?

Please do excuse my ignorance, but I'm unsure what is meant by "through journey" - for what it's worth, the ticket I held was a return bought onboard the coach that same morning.

As of posting this message, I have written a complaint to the email address kindly provided by @Titfield, so it's just a waiting game now...

 

[Haywain]

Please do excuse my ignorance, but I'm unsure what is meant by "through journey" - for what it's worth, the ticket I held was a return bought onboard the coach that same morning.

A through journey would include an element of rail travel, as opposed to just the bus travel.