London Overground line names announced

[TRAX]

But less informative because numbers do not show where a line actually serves! Whereas North London Line, in particular, describes very well where the line (mostly) goes, and has been in use for decades.

Really, do you think people in Paris don’t know where lines 4 and 13 go ?

Once you learn it, you know… and numbers are easier to learn and remember…

 

[JJmoogle]

Scarcely believe there's a kerfuffle about this, they were gonna get named something, now they have

 

[hux385]

Personally I'd rather all the remaining monarchy themed lines got renamed to something more normal! As has been said upthread, a lot of historic tube lines already had a political slant.

I'm a big fan of these new names, I really like how a concious effort has been made to be inclusive. #wokeandproud

 

[vuzzeho]

I don't hate it, actually. I do think 'suffragette' is a bit too on the nose (I was talking with a non-railway friend and she told me she thought it was a bit much) but generally, I don't mind. For the concerns that younger generations won't know how to say suffragette - it's taught in KS3 History. I actually think most of them are really nice, actually and they'll stick, in time. Maybe it's time to let go of the old unofficial/BR-era names (Goblin was cute, though.)

 

[Andyh82]

Is anyone else just bored of how every single thing needs to turn into a culture war

You know there will be debates all over the media with people on the far extremes of opinion

Why can’t something just happen without extra meanings these days - call it east London line, because it goes through east London etc

 

[yorksrob]

The one thing I am a bit concerned about is the use of the different colours - in that they may distract from the established colour scheme on the London Underground - particularly if they end up on the same map.

 

[Ashley Hill]

What location does the Jubilee Line refer to?

Indeed,should have stuck with the Fleet Line.

 

[vuzzeho]

The one thing I am a bit concerned about is the use of the different colours - in that they may distract from the established colour scheme on the London Underground - particularly if they end up on the same map.

I agree, I think maybe they could've had it as an orange strip bordered by the respective line colours (though that would probably look pretty ugly with the chosen colours, actually.)

 

[yorksrob]

I agree, I think maybe they could've had it as an orange strip bordered by the respective line colours (though that would probably look pretty ugly with the chosen colours, actually.)

It's difficult really because they do cross over eachother a bit.

 

[DC1989]

All awful and overly political. I see a future where the next conservative mayors changes some names to the Churchill Line, the Thatcher line and the Spitfire line

Whilst separating the lines to some degree was needed, the excess of colours make this a bit of a mess. Although I suppose most people get around using Citymapper/TFL app/Google Maps.

I appreciate many people don't want numbers in London but I do think naming them OG1, OG2, OG3 etc and keeping them all orange would have been best.

 

[vuzzeho]

It's difficult really because they do cross over eachother a bit.

True... Weirdly enough, the way they've done it makes it look like the Elizabeth line is an Overground line.

 

[kristiang85]

These were the names Boris Johnson apparently rejected under his mayoralty on grounds of cost and lack of necessity, and potential confusion. Very sensible names that Khan should have used if he really wanted to go ahead with this, but I know there no virtuosity in that. As it happens, for once in my life, I agree with Boris that this is completely unnecessary. Or at the very least they should have been designated with numbers and the colour left alone. It really isn't a good look either spending all this on something that's overall pointless, and actively going to annoy many people, when TFL are pleading poverty all the time.

"Lioness" is extreme shoehorning, unless they have a training ground on the line I'm not aware of?! Not to mention the Mildmay debacle of it not even being on that line.

The overall underground/overground map is going to look a complete mess now. It used to be so much easier to differentiate the different modes.

 

[PGAT]

As a colourblind person the Mildmay and Elizabeth Lines look like the same colour

 

[yorksrob]

True... Weirdly enough, the way they've done it makes it look like the Elizabeth line is an Overground line.

I suppose it is part of the same group !

 

[DC1989]

True... Weirdly enough, the way they've done it makes it look like the Elizabeth line is an Overground line.

Elizabeth line should definitely be full purple block

Number 1 - it looks much better
Number 2 - it's too important - it's probably on track to be the busiest line or at least top 3 if it isn't already

It's a bit different having a suburban line going from Romford to Upminster being in faint lines than one going through the heart of the city !

 

[jon0844]

True... Weirdly enough, the way they've done it makes it look like the Elizabeth line is an Overground line.

It sort of is.

 

[Revilo]

Personally I'd rather all the remaining monarchy themed lines got renamed to something more normal! As has been said upthread, a lot of historic tube lines already had a political slant.

I'm a big fan of these new names, I really like how a concious effort has been made to be inclusive. #wokeandproud

The monarchal names are not political, the monarch represents the nation and its history so are as inclusive as possible.

In contrast the names now proposed are exclusive. The woke left sees everything through identity labels and categories, thus being exclusive. If only the lines has been named after geographic features they could have been inclusive and memorable. Instead, they seek to make political points.

 

[stuu]

"Lioness" is extreme shoehorning, unless they have a training ground on the line I'm not aware of?!

Wembley is quite famous

lioness is a bit ephemeral, but no worse than naming a line after someone surviving for 25 years

 

[thomalex]

These were the names Boris Johnson apparently rejected under his mayoralty on grounds of cost and lack of necessity, and potential confusion. Very sensible names that Khan should have used if he really wanted to go ahead with this, but I know there no virtuosity in that. As it happens, for once in my life, I agree with Boris that this is completely unnecessary. Or at the very least they should have been designated with numbers and the colour left alone. It really isn't a good look either spending all this on something that's overall pointless, and actively going to annoy many people, when TFL are pleading poverty all the time.

"Lioness" is extreme shoehorning, unless they have a training ground on the line I'm not aware of?! Not to mention the Mildmay debacle of it not even being on that line.

The overall underground/overground map is going to look a complete mess now. It used to be so much easier to differentiate the different modes.

Talking about confusion I'm curious how this will be referred to on signage, tannoys etc.

My personal preference for naming these lines would be to use letters, so you'd have Overground A line, Overground B line etc. To me this is very clear that they are Overground lines but with some distinction for the different routes. The same could also easily be applied to the DLR. "This is the Overground B line to New Cross"

With these will it be Overground Windrush line, the Windrush line of the London Overground, or are we just going with Windrush line? Certainly seems less clear to me.

 

[kristiang85]

Wembley is quite famous

lioness is a bit ephemeral, but no worse than naming a line after someone surviving for 25 years

Why not the Wembley line then? All this naming does is seek division.

 

[JJmoogle]

I don't really understand how any of these 'seek division', after a couple of weeks they'll just be the names

 

[norbitonflyer]

Not the names I'd have chosen, (actually I think some of them are better than my suggestions) and they will take some getting used to, but could have been a lot worse. It's a shame though that Brunel didn't get a mention for the lines through the Thames Tunnel, and that Windrush actually rushes through Brixton without stopping.

Or at the very least they should have been designated with numbers and the colour left alone.

Having all the lines the same colour was the bit that really did need fixing. The current map looks like an explosion in a speghetti factory

"Lioness" is extreme shoehorning, unless they have a training ground on the line I'm not aware of?!

Wembley stadium?

Not to mention the Mildmay debacle of it not even being on that line.

Mildmay Park is on the line.

The overall underground/overground map is going to look a complete mess now. It used to be so much easier to differentiate the different modes.

On the contrary. It will be easier to distinguish individual lines. Knowing whether it is Underground or Overground or Crossrail is less importantb than disentangling it from other lines.

 

[vuzzeho]

The monarchal names are not political, the monarch represents the nation and its history so are as inclusive as possible.

In contrast the names now proposed are exclusive. The woke left sees everything through identity labels and categories, thus being exclusive. If only the lines has been named after geographic features they could have been inclusive and memorable. Instead, they seek to make political points.

Is the Windrush generation not part of this country's history? Isn't the HIV/AIDs epidemic and the country's response part of our history? What about the country's sporting history? And the suffragette movement is a massive part of this country's history and background with equality. The idea that the fact that these names have links to the country's history with racial, sexual and gender issues makes them worse is confusing. The monarch's existence is political too - but you don't argue that's exclusive. The UK, especially London, have been formed by these movements and moments in history, and suggesting that it's 'woke' and 'not inclusive' just seems to try to stand against that fact.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Elizabeth line should definitely be full purple block

Number 1 - it looks much better
Number 2 - it's too important - it's probably on track to be the busiest line or at least top 3 if it isn't already

It's a bit different having a suburban line going from Romford to Upminster being in faint lines than one going through the heart of the city !

No. It is shown the same as the other National Rail lines on the Underground map, as it should be. The distinction from LUL operated lines can be important.

True... Weirdly enough, the way they've done it makes it look like the Elizabeth line is an Overground line.

It is, in most respects. It's a National Rail Line, operated on a Concession basis for TfL.

‘Lea Valley lines’ was already a sufficient name for those out of Liverpool Street. Geographic, rolls off the tongue.

But wrong, as the Lea valley Line has always been the original one between Tottenham Hale and Cheshunt via Ponders End (still operated by Anglia, so you won't see it on a Tube Map). The Lea Valley "Group" also included the Seven Sisters Line and the Chingford Line (which should really have been given separate names)

 

[Brush 4]

The meaning will be lost on most of the public anyway. I doubt if Jubilee Line means much to those under 50 (it was 47 years ago) Same with Elizabeth Line eventually.

If personal bias has to be involved, which it never should, my names are Ban Golf Courses Line. Build Only Affordable Houses Line. Ban Private Equity Takeovers Line. Stop Outsourcing Line. Renationalise Line. Fund NHS Properly Line.

 

[U-Bahnfreund]

Talking about confusion I'm curious how this will be referred to on signage, tannoys etc.

...

With these will it be Overground Windrush line, the Windrush line of the London Overground, or are we just going with Windrush line? Certainly seems less clear to me.

There's a video by TfL what shows how it will be like, with an example journey from Euston to Hackney Wick:

 

[Otis]

As a colourblind person the Mildmay and Elizabeth Lines look like the same colour

I second that, to the extent that to this colourblind person, Liberty and Weaver look the same, and Suffragette and Windrush look the same.

It's very poor design, you need something other that colour to distinguish between line (the equivalent of putting a different marker on series on a line graph).

 

[DarloRich]

If it annoys the snowflakes then it seems like money well spent.

This is the best statement on the thread! I agree.

There is such negativity. This board is SO conservative.

Is that what transport strategy has come to? Deary me. People really need to leave politics where it belongs.

I assume you would make the same statement if the lines were called, say, Churchill, Thatcher, Farage & Mosely lines.

What is wrong, objectively, with the names? "WoKeIsM" isn't enough.

2 need explaining to me ( Mildmay & Freedom) but once done so the first seems fair enough and quite nice touch.

Suffragete ( they even got the colours right!) & Windrush shouldn't need any comment beyond the slight silliness of the Windrush line not stopping in Brixton. ( it should also be noted that many on the MV Empire Windrush had served in the British armed forces in World War Two AND all had a right to reside in the UK via the 1948 British Nationality Act )

The Freedom line is odd but hopefully means something to people in that area and I think the Lionesses line is a little bit modern. They have done superbly well recently but if they ( like all sports teams) flop then what?

Nice nod to the Hugeuenots too.

one person gets it! The level of historical ignorance and confusion on this thread is shocking.

Harlequin Line - Euston to Watford

no one has ever called it that have they? Surely such a line goes to Twickenham!

 

[norbitonflyer]

I second that, to the extent that to this colourblind person, Liberty and Weaver look the same, and Suffragette and Windrush look the same.

It's very poor design, you need something other that colour to distinguish between line (the equivalent of putting a different marker on series on a line graph).

For the most part the colours seem to have been chosen to make them easily distinguishable from Tube lines of the same or similar colour, meeting at right angles if at all.

Lioness - (yellow). Not-quite-meets the Circle at Euston. Yellow-and-brown alongside each other for much of its length.
Mildmay - (blue). Crosses the Piccadilly near South Acton, West Brompton, and in Islington Barnsbury, which is a bit of a blue tangle because the Victoria Libne is also in the area.
Windrush - (red) - crosses the Central Line near Shoreditch
Weaver - (maroon) Meets the Met at Liverpool Street
Suffragette - (green) Crosses the Ditsrict at Barking
Liberty - (grey) nowhere near any other line except Elizabeth and District


There is though an unholy mess around Stratford, with the Mildmay, DLR and Elizabeth Lines all in blue-ish open lines.
Also, on my screen, the Emerson - sorry, Liberty - Line looks like a branch of the Elizabeth Line.

 

[birchesgreen]

Names are a bit meh but i'm glad they have done this.

They probably need to do it with the DLR too.