London to Southend

[SouthStand]

Monday 25 April, I will have a zones 1-6 travelcard and need to get to Southend at some point that day. Best I can find is an Upminster to Southend Victoria super off peak day return for £8.

Can anyone do better?

 

[yorkie]

There is no such thing as a Upminster to Southend Victoria, and I suspect you may encounter difficulties if you attempt to travel via Romford to Southend Victoria. Do you need to get to Victoria? If not, the Upminster to Southend Stations (0411) (which is probably only valid to Central) Super Off Peak Day Return (CBA) at £8.00 is the best ticket, as you say.

If you want maximum flexibility, then Boundary Zone 6 (0072) to Southend Stations (0411) Off Peak Day Rtn (CDR) is £10.70 and is valid at both Southend Victoria and Central for travel via NXEA and c2c, and also on trains that do not call at Upminster.

 

[SouthStand]

Sorry my mistake, it's actually Upminster to Southend Stations for £8.

In general terms, what's the difference between a "boundary zone #" and simply specifying the last station within the zone?

If (for example) there was a non-stop service London to Southend Central, would the boundary zone ticket negate the need for the train to call at the last station in zone 6?

 

[yorkie]

A ticket from Boundary Zone X is an extension to a Travelcard, the equivalent of an excess fare. There is no requirement for the train to call at any station in any Zone. Boundary Zone X tickets are often cheaper than tickets from named stations, but not always. The exact rules on routeing is a matter for debate but in this case, I think it's fair to say that any interpretation would ensure the ticket is valid to Southend Stations or Southend Victoria. If you buy a ticket from Harold Wood to Southend Stations, the price is the same as the Boundary Zone 6 ticket, yet you are restricted to trains at call at Harold Wood and then only on the NXEA route. So it's a "no brainer" to get the Boundary Zone 6 ticket on that line! On c2c the benefits are less, because c2c have lower-priced Super Off Peak tickets available on their route.

 

[clagmonster]

The Boundary Zone ticket is zonal so allows use of trains that don't stop at the last station in the relevent zone.
If you use a ticket from a named station, then the train must stop at said named station. This is detailed in Condition 19 of the National Rail Conditions of Carriage.

 

[yorkie]

I've just realised, the above replies are assuming the OP has a One Day Travelcard and not a Travelcard Season.

If a Travelcard Season is held, then of course the train does not need to call in the case of named stations, but the potential routeing benefits of Boundary Zone 6 tickets still apply. Obviously the potential routeing benefits vary, depending on the destination of the ticket. In this case there is a significant benefit because there are two completely different routes from Boundary Zone 6 to Southend Stations, on different lines.

 

[SouthStand]

Cheers guys, one more question.

If the zonal ticket is a "travelcard extension", is it valid for multiple trips to Southend or just the one return trip?

 

[yorkie]

Cheers guys, one more question.

If the zonal ticket is a "travelcard extension", is it valid for multiple trips to Southend or just the one return trip?

Return tickets are only valid for one return trip. This fact doesn't change just because the origin is a 'zonal' location; it's still only a Return ticket, in the case of the £10.70 fare quoted, an Off Peak Day Return.

The equivalent from Southend would be an "out-boundary" Travelcard issued from Southend Stations to London Zones 1-6, which is effectively a return to Boundary Zone 6 plus an All Zones Travelcard.

 

[clagmonster]

the Upminster to Southend Stations (0411) (which is probably only valid to Central) Super Off Peak Day Return (CBA) at £8.00 is the best ticket, as you say.

I've had a look at the routeing guide. Upminister is a related station to the Southend Group. Therefore, the origin and destination have a common routeing point, so "the permitted route is direct via the shortest distance from the origin to the destination
over which a regular scheduled passenger train service operates. No doubling back (passing through the same station twice on a single journey) is allowed which may require customers to change trains short of the routeing point, unless an easement allows a longer alternative route."
http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/RSPDocuments/instructions.pdf page 2

I can't see any relevent easements, so we are valid only via the shortest route (or by direct trains, as per condition 13).

Distances from the National Rail Timetable are:
Upminster-Romford 3.5 http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse documents/eNRT/Dec10/timetables/Table4.pdf
Romford-Southend Victoria 29 http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse documents/eNRT/Dec10/timetables/Table5.pdf
Total 32.5

Upminster-Laindon-Southend Central 20.5 http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse documents/eNRT/Dec10/timetables/Table1.pdf

So an Upminister-Southend Stations ticket would only be valid via Laindon (or via Grays on a direct train).

The Boundary Zone 6-Southend ticket would be valid via Laindon or Dagenham on the LTS (or via Ockendon on a direct Southend train) or into Southend Victoria on the Great Eastern.