Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[NorthEastern]

I believe the 1 ran from Easter Road to the Corstorphine area in the early 1950s so it might have been helpful to emphasise the Clermiston aspect for former 21 passengers around Leith and Davidson's Mains. But persisting with a Clermiston identifier on the 1 might have led to confusion on the 32, which never had a proper destination and simple said 'Circle'. Not sure if an 'Inner' and 'Outer' qualifier on blinds would help either, because each route has an inner and outer but you could imagine the 32/52 route as an outer circle for the whole city.
If I remember correctly there was a layby at Wester Hailes on the 32 route served by buses going in both directions, which may have accelerated migration to different route numbers for the counter-clockwise service.
But in general these circular routes are too difficult for most people to understand so I hardly think their loss from Edinburgh will be mourned. I think they even had a special higher fare for passengers who used the bus for its entire route, which seems like the proverbial 'tax on the foolish'.

Thanks, that’s interesting about the higher fare. Anyone else recall that? The complete circuit was like an alternative City Tour of all the dodgy parts of Edinburgh that tourists never ventured into.

 

[route101]

I could be wrong but I was reading the service changes on the website, it failed to mention the X4 and the 400 changing to the 18.

 

[ecb124]

I could be wrong but I was reading the service changes on the website, it failed to mention the X4 and the 400 changing to the 18.

Not quite sure what you mean by this, the X4 is the first change under the east coast buses tab, and the 18 is there under the Lothian tab "Service 18
Revised service and timetable. Formerly operating as Skylink 400, this service will now be part of the 'city' network"

 

[Bus9120UK]

I could be wrong but I was reading the service changes on the website, it failed to mention the X4 and the 400 changing to the 18.

You may have looked at the East Lothian Council tenders article by mistake?

 

[route101]

Not quite sure what you mean by this, the X4 is the first change under the east coast buses tab, and the 18 is there under the Lothian tab "Service 18
Revised service and timetable. Formerly operating as Skylink 400, this service will now be part of the 'city' network"

I was looking at a page dated 24th March 2024! Found the correct page.

 

[ecb124]

I was looking at a page dated 24th March 2024! Found the correct page.

Ah, makes more sense lol

 

[Kilmux]

I believe the 1 ran from Easter Road to the Corstorphine area in the early 1950s so it might have been helpful to emphasise the Clermiston aspect for former 21 passengers around Leith and Davidson's Mains. But persisting with a Clermiston identifier on the 1 might have led to confusion on the 32, which never had a proper destination and simple said 'Circle'. Not sure if an 'Inner' and 'Outer' qualifier on blinds would help either, because each route has an inner and outer but you could imagine the 32/52 route as an outer circle for the whole city.
If I remember correctly there was a layby at Wester Hailes on the 32 route served by buses going in both directions, which may have accelerated migration to different route numbers for the counter-clockwise service.
But in general these circular routes are too difficult for most people to understand so I hardly think their loss from Edinburgh will be mourned. I think they even had a special higher fare for passengers who used the bus for its entire route, which seems like the proverbial 'tax on the foolish'.

 

[Siemens Trains]

Thanks, that’s interesting about the higher fare. Anyone else recall that? The complete circuit was like an alternative City Tour of all the dodgy parts of Edinburgh that tourists never ventured into.

The higher fare is shown in the attached leaflet from 1980 (effective from 1976). It also lists the applicable circle service numbers, some innies & outies.
At that time the maximum fare was 25p on linear routes.
As you say, it seems bizarre to charge an extra 20% for the dubious privilege of sitting for an hour on a bus.

 

[JKP]

The higher fare is shown in the attached leaflet from 1980 (effective from 1976). It also lists the applicable circle service numbers, some innies & outies.
At that time the maximum fare was 25p on linear routes.
As you say, it seems bizarre to charge an extra 20% for the dubious privilege of sitting for an hour on a bus.

Am not sure why you think this is so unusual. Am sure it was (and i’m sure still is) common place to charge more for a complete circuit of a route. After all you are occupying a seat where it would be reasonable to expect that seat to be occupied by one or more people on that circular journey. 30p seems reasonable to me.

 

[CraigLockhart]

Thanks, that’s interesting about the higher fare. Anyone else recall that? The complete circuit was like an alternative City Tour of all the dodgy parts of Edinburgh that tourists never ventured into.

They actually did do a tour called the sea the city and the hills back in the late 70s/early 80s which if I recall went through the likes of Gilmerton and Gracemount on its route round the city. It ran with white double decker Atlanteans if I recall. It may have even gone through Niddrie.

 

[DunsBus]

Am not sure why you think this is so unusual. Am sure it was (and i’m sure still is) common place to charge more for a complete circuit of a route. After all you are occupying a seat where it would be reasonable to expect that seat to be occupied by one or more people on that circular journey. 30p seems reasonable to me.

The 19 was a circle as well. I'm sure the 30p full-route premium was also charged on that.

They actually did do a tour called the sea the city and the hills back in the late 70s/early 80s which if I recall went through the likes of Gilmerton and Gracemount on its route round the city. It ran with white double decker Atlanteans if I recall. It may have even gone through Niddrie.

Thankfully, it didn't go through Niddrie, but through Duddingston.

 

[Numpt33]

The higher fare is shown in the attached leaflet from 1980 (effective from 1976). It also lists the applicable circle service numbers, some innies & outies.
At that time the maximum fare was 25p on linear routes.
As you say, it seems bizarre to charge an extra 20% for the dubious privilege of sitting for an hour on a bus.

Whatever happened to dogs' fares?

 

[DunsBus]

Whatever happened to dogs' fares?

The dogs' fare was abolished at deregulation, if I remember correctly. Prior to then it cost you eight pence to take Fido or Rover - or whatever your pet pooch was called - on the bus.

 

[EdinRH]

They actually did do a tour called the sea the city and the hills back in the late 70s/early 80s which if I recall went through the likes of Gilmerton and Gracemount on its route round the city. It ran with white double decker Atlanteans if I recall. It may have even gone through Niddrie.

It was still running in 1990. It went through Newhaven and Leith as well as somewhere in the vicinity of the Pentlands: basically the outskirts of the city.

Wasn't there also a Murder and Mystery Tour which ran on Friday nights in the early 1990s and included a meal at the Hawes Inn in South Queensferry?

 

[ScotRail158725]

Noticed the B9TLs finally getting global stickers, placed to the sides of the advert frames, looks a bit out of place since they cant put them in the same place as the other vehicle types

 

[Graeme Duncan]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker 671 is on service 33 and 1003 on service 35 so I am assuming they are now at Longstone.

 

[Bus9120UK]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker 671 is on service 33 and 1003 on service 35 so I am assuming they are now at Longstone.

671 was on a peak Central trip.

 

[ScotRail158725]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker 671 is on service 33 and 1003 on service 35 so I am assuming they are now at Longstone.

1003 been at Longstone a few days now

 

[stevenedin]

842 now withdrawn and at Marine

 

[LothianBusesPh]

842 now withdrawn and at Marine

Furthermore, 498 is now at Seafield Works for repaint into East Coast Buses livery, alongside 197.

 

[stevenedin]

Furthermore, 498 is now at Seafield Works for repaint into East Coast Buses livery, alongside 197.

197 was just repainted into Lothian livery not long ago. I take it that 195-198 are all moving back to East Coast Buses?

 

[computerSaysNo]

Furthermore, 498 is now at Seafield Works for repaint into East Coast Buses livery, alongside 197.

197 was just repainted into Lothian livery not long ago. I take it that 195-198 are all moving back to East Coast Buses?

In my opinion it would be significantly better for East Coast to get some of the B8RLE Evoras instead (a number look to be routinely used for the route 38, so transferring those shouldn't impact the route 30 much), and transfer either the extra B7RLE Eclipses to Longstone or transfer them to Marine to displace 7900H vehicles to go to Longstone. The B8 Evoras would be much better suited to East Coast as they've got high back seats, USB charging, and a gearbox better suited to higher speed running. The B7 Eclipses, from what I remember, have low back seats; I don't believe they have USB charging either?

 

[ScotRail158725]

842 now withdrawn and at Marine

withdrawing them at a much slower rate than 441-465 have been transferring over.

In my opinion it would be significantly better for East Coast to get some of the B8RLE Evoras instead (a number look to be routinely used for the route 38, so transferring those shouldn't impact the route 30 much), and transfer either the extra B7RLE Eclipses to Longstone or transfer them to Marine to displace 7900H vehicles to go to Longstone. The B8 Evoras would be much better suited to East Coast as they've got high back seats, USB charging, and a gearbox better suited to higher speed running. The B7 Eclipses, from what I remember, have low back seats; I don't believe they have USB charging either?

What difference does the USB charging and high back seats make if they’re at East Coast or not? Im pretty sure the gearboxes wont make much difference either on the routes they’re on

Side question, do Lothian Country still get MOTs at Longstone, i seen a green and white livery there yesterday

 

[TheEastCoaster]

What difference does the USB charging and high back seats make if they’re at East Coast or not? Im pretty sure the gearboxes wont make much difference either on the routes they’re on

Possibily for a more luxery travelling experience? they are the best single deckers in service.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Side question, do Lothian Country still get MOTs at Longstone, i seen a green and white livery there yesterday

457 and 936 have been there in recent days.

 

[ScotRail158725]

457 and 936 have been there in recent days.

1034 too according to the trackers

 

[stantheman]

What will happen to 351 to 400 when all 50 electrics are delivered?

 

[stevenedin]

938 seems to be at Marine has it been withdrawn or just there for a visit?

 

[Bus9120UK]

938 seems to be at Marine has it been withdrawn or just there for a visit?

The entire East Coast buses fleet will be at Marine reguarly. That's where they are maintained

 

[LothianBusesPh]

197 was just repainted into Lothian livery not long ago. I take it that 195-198 are all moving back to East Coast Buses?

Perhaps there wouldn't be enough buses to cover Marine if that happened.