Lumo - passenger experience criticised in Which? review

[reastreetmetro]

I've never travelled on Lumo or any other open access operator for that matter. I was quite surprised by how unpleasant the reviewer's experience was. They compared it to Ryanair but I frequently travel with them and I cannot say it resembles the Lumo experience as described here in any way at all.

Ryanair's seats have never been what I would describe as 'dirty' and the catering is perfectly adequate for a short haul flight. The coffee is surprisingly good as a matter of fact. The staff are nearly always very pleasant and don't threaten passengers over the PA (apart from, I expect, for passenger misbehaviour, safety issues etc.).

Is this a fair review of Lumo? It covers more than one journey it seems so unlikely to have been a one-off experience.

The first announcement aboard my Lumo train from King's Cross to Newcastle is a warning for passengers onboard who were due to travel on the cancelled 5.48am that they will be fined if they don’t get their ‘original ticket accredited first’.

Lumo review: what it's like onboard the UK's first budget train service - Which?

Cheaper tickets and faster sometimes, but busy and dirty too

www.which.co.uk

 

[a_c_skinner]

I've been on Lumo: Morpeth to Edinburgh.

It arrived on time, I had a seat, and it rolled in to EDB on time

That is it. All you need.

 

[Class800]

The mention in the article linked by the OP about a need to get tickets accredited if your train is cancelled is certainly not in keeping with the traditions and usual terms and conditions of rail in the UK

 

[TUC]

Let me guess that the author is a Londoner who travels the world but doesn't get out around the UK much. 'I don’t think it's an overstatement to say that not being able to get a cup of tea on a British train journey feels like a betrayal of the national consciousness.' He should try long journeys on Northern.

 

[AlterEgo]

I’ve only travelled Lumo once and it was very different. I thought it was excellent, although I do recognise the author’s complaint about tired seats. Some of the upholstery hasn’t aged well. But the staff were excellent and the luggage restrictions are a good idea. I found it a lower BS option on that occasion then countless LNER trips, in first or standard.

 

[williamn]

The fact they’ve got their facts wrong about it being faster than LNER doesn’t bode well for the rest of the article!

Have to assume though that stat they said about catering was indeed what they encountered and I have noticed the staining on seats myself. Oddly LNER’s older seats aren’t stained.

 

[3141]

Increasingly, Which? fails to maintain objectivity and allows its reviewers to be subjective and "funny" - or so they imagine it to be, a typical example in this case being the remark that a "seat has more stains on it than a two-year-old’s bib at dinner time". The comparisons with Ryanair promote stereotypes but not necessarily reality. If I were the MD of Lumo I'f be concerned about the allegations of dirty seats and the catering failures, but I'd object to the childish tone of much of the review.

 

[Lewisham2221]

Reads more like a GCSE English coursework piece than a credible review. In fact, it barely reviews anything. The title acknowledges that it's a budget operation, he mentions several times that it's significantly cheaper than it's main rivals, yet still goes on to state "made our trip feel budget". Yes, because it was! Pay budget prices, expect budget experience - it's not the Orient Express!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I would agree with that review - I was not impressed and won't use it again.

 

[Adrian1980uk]

I’ve only travelled Lumo once and it was very different. I thought it was excellent, although I do recognise the author’s complaint about tired seats. Some of the upholstery hasn’t aged well. But the staff were excellent and the luggage restrictions are a good idea. I found it a lower BS option on that occasion then countless LNER trips, in first or standard.

The tired seats is a feature of modern sweat the assets scenarios, less spare stock for engineering etc. means they are used more so going to need refurbs more regularly, don't think that's been accounted for yet in many industries.

 

[mrcheek]

weirdly, the review is generally negative, until the final half sentence, which is generally positive

 

[800001]

The tired seats is a feature of modern sweat the assets scenarios, less spare stock for engineering etc. means they are used more so going to need refurbs more regularly, don't think that's been accounted for yet in many industries.

The tired seats are getting new coverings on all Lumo seats. Should start replacing them shortly.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The tired seats are getting new coverings on all Lumo seats. Should start replacing them shortly.

That will certainly help. Every TOC that's used flat cloth so far except TPE and I think Thameslink have replaced it, and those two are looking increasingly tired. TPE probably get away with it better because the seats, while they aren't moquette, do carry a complex pattern that distracts from stains and spills. Budget airlines tend to go for leather (or fake leather) as it's wipe-clean.

I’ve only travelled Lumo once and it was very different. I thought it was excellent, although I do recognise the author’s complaint about tired seats. Some of the upholstery hasn’t aged well. But the staff were excellent and the luggage restrictions are a good idea. I found it a lower BS option on that occasion then countless LNER trips, in first or standard.

They certainly suit some, but I still think they rather miss the point of the low-cost model by not offering a "buy up" to a larger sized bag. I don't object to paying extra on a budget airline for a large checked bag (which I will almost always do unless it's a one night trip, and thus factor that into the price), but I do object to being simply told I can't have one, which makes Lumo useless for most of my purposes which tend to involve larger rucksacks for outdoor activities.

TBH I dislike them anyway so am unlikely to darken their doors again (being in Milton Keynes I'd go to Scotland via the WCML, probably changing at Manchester Piccadilly due to the service pattern, and if I want Newcastle I'd similarly change at Manchester and enjoy the scenery of the TransPennine route rather than the boring ECML and its high prices) but I do think they could and should do better in this regard - their model isn't really true low-cost-airline and is more just like a slightly cheaper, slightly higher density version of LNER with a slightly overfamiliar/informal staff attitude which no doubt appeals to "Gen Zee" but doesn't to me in the slightest. I do prefer the actual seats, but the whole thing has more of an amateurish feel like Wizzair, probably the worst airline I have ever had the misfortune to use, and the layout itself is like a cattle wagon. At least Ryanair does what it does quite well.

(Recent thread on Lumo and the low-cost model if anyone wants to delve into that: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...operly-is-it-possible-without-check-in.284199)

 

[43096]

The tired seats are getting new coverings on all Lumo seats. Should start replacing them shortly.

Given they are replacing seat covers after only a bit over 4 years, that rather suggests they got it wrong to start with. When will they learn: use high quality moquette - it pays back through lasting much longer.

 

[800001]

That will certainly help. Every TOC that's used flat cloth so far except TPE and I think Thameslink have replaced it, and those two are looking increasingly tired. TPE probably get away with it better because the seats, while they aren't moquette, do carry a complex pattern that distracts from stains and spills. Budget airlines tend to go for leather (or fake leather) as it's wipe-clean.



They certainly suit some, but I still think they rather miss the point of the low-cost model by not offering a "buy up" to a larger sized bag. I don't object to paying extra on a budget airline for a large checked bag (which I will almost always do unless it's a one night trip, and thus factor that into the price), but I do object to being simply told I can't have one, which makes Lumo useless for most of my purposes which tend to involve larger rucksacks for outdoor activities.

TBH I dislike them anyway so am unlikely to darken their doors again (being in Milton Keynes I'd go to Scotland via the WCML, probably changing at Manchester Piccadilly due to the service pattern, and if I want Newcastle I'd similarly change at Manchester and enjoy the scenery of the TransPennine route rather than the boring ECML and its high prices) but I do think they could and should do better in this regard - their model isn't really true low-cost-airline and is more just like a slightly cheaper, slightly higher density version of LNER with a slightly overfamiliar/informal staff attitude which no doubt appeals to "Gen Zee" but doesn't to me in the slightest. I do prefer the actual seats, but the whole thing has more of an amateurish feel like Wizzair, probably the worst airline I have ever had the misfortune to use, and the layout itself is like a cattle wagon. At least Ryanair does what it does quite well.

(Recent thread on Lumo and the low-cost model if anyone wants to delve into that: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...operly-is-it-possible-without-check-in.284199)

Picture of the new seat covering attached from a tweet from there Media Manager

https://x.com/richardsalkeld/status/1906757165508943957?s=46&t=JLp3J2Up_Gl_m9cQz-au6w

Great gatherings in #Newcastle and #Edinburgh today for the @LumoTravel stakeholder events complete with a preview of new look seats coming soon.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes, saw that before and it'll certainly spruce up the interior and hide spills a bit better.

 

[Scotrail314209]

Doing Lumo from London to Edinburgh a few times and it’s not been a bad experience, the fact they are able to fill up a 20:27 departure from London to Edinburgh really speaks volumes about how attractive they are.

The only thing that could change is having more table seats, on a journey I did recently a family was split apart with their children being sat directly behind me without any supervision (followed by lots of noise and a mess which isn’t exactly needed at half 10 at night).

The other issue is with regards to the catering service. I was always booked into Coach A, and I found that the catering service always reached Coach A last as they made their way from C through to E, then all the way back again. They started at Newark and never got through until Darlington.

Maybe a way to avoid this is to have a third member of staff who could start the trolley service while the other two do the ticket checks then one joins them with the trolley later on.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Doing Lumo from London to Edinburgh a few times and it’s not been a bad experience, the fact they are able to fill up a 20:27 departure from London to Edinburgh really speaks volumes about how attractive they are.

The only thing that could change is having more table seats, on a journey I did recently a family was split apart with their children being sat directly behind me without any supervision (followed by lots of noise and a mess which isn’t exactly needed at half 10 at night).

The other issue is with regards to the catering service. I was always booked into Coach A, and I found that the catering service always reached Coach A last as they made their way from C through to E, then all the way back again. They started at Newark and never got through until Darlington.

Maybe a way to avoid this is to have a third member of staff who could start the trolley service while the other two do the ticket checks then one joins them with the trolley later on.

Of course lowering the seating density and adding staff would mean higher fares. That's the trouble with the concept.

I think they fill that service because LNER don't offer it, to be honest - their last is 1900. 2024 is late enough to go for a few drinks after a work trip. They also offer an early northbound out of Kings Cross which LNER don't.

 

[supervc-10]

It looks like the new seat covers are moquette, which would definitely be sensible.

I feel that, like with Ryanair, they're a company that you have to accept limitations with. If you fly how Ryanair want you to, it's cheap and can be wonderful (I only met my husband because of a £35 return trip to Brussels with Ryanair!). Sounds like Lumo is the same - cheaper than LNER, but with caveats - don't count on the trolley, and only bring what they allow.

I actually don't think the 'dirty' seats are any worse than any other company, I just think that flat cloth is a spectacularly dumb decision for a train interior! I bet LNER's seats have just as many coffees spilled over them, just that being moquette they don't show as much. I for one much prefer moquette to pleather.

Edit: I should caveat that I've not yet used Lumo - but we have been talking about a trip to Edinburgh sometime this summer and no doubt Lumo will be an option.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I feel that, like with Ryanair, they're a company that you have to accept limitations with.

Except with Ryanair you don't. You can, at a price, purchase them pretty much up to the same level of service (better in some cases) than a traditional full-service airline - you can purchase a checked bag and a second full size carryon, you can purchase seat selection and legroom and you can purchase a pretty good range of food and drinks. Lumo is a slightly different model - same for everyone, no buy-ups bar a Twix and a coffee and that's if the trolley gets to you.

 

[LA50041]

The attached article to me smacks of a trainee journalist re-hashing a load of stuff they've read online.
My mum uses Lumo between Morpeth and London a number of times a year, and she finds it a lot more reliable and seats more comfortable than LNER, let alone generally cheaper when booking in advance

 

[Uncle Buck]

Increasingly, Which? fails to maintain objectivity and allows its reviewers to be subjective and "funny" - or so they imagine it to be, a typical example in this case being the remark that a "seat has more stains on it than a two-year-old’s bib at dinner time". The comparisons with Ryanair promote stereotypes but not necessarily reality. If I were the MD of Lumo I'f be concerned about the allegations of dirty seats and the catering failures, but I'd object to the childish tone of much of the review.

If I ever read a review of anything where the author seems to be enjoying giving a negative review, or used “funny” terminology, I instantly discount it. A certain percentage of the population are just entitled and self-important. It is an intercity service specifically designed for a budget, not a glamorous service from an Agatha Christie novel. As for Ryanair, every one I have travelled on has been on time, safe and in no sense uncomfortable- what is there to complain about?

Except with Ryanair you don't. You can, at a price, purchase them pretty much up to the same level of service (better in some cases) than a traditional full-service airline - you can purchase a checked bag and a second full size carryon, you can purchase seat selection and legroom and you can purchase a pretty good range of food and drinks. Lumo is a slightly different model - same for everyone, no buy-ups bar a Twix and a coffee and that's if the trolley gets to you.

In which case they should have bought a sandwich at Marks and Spencer’s at the station for, what, five pounds maximum before boarding the train, like an adult.

 

[Scotrail314209]

Of course lowering the seating density and adding staff would mean higher fares. That's the trouble with the concept.

I think they fill that service because LNER don't offer it, to be honest - their last is 1900. 2024 is late enough to go for a few drinks after a work trip. They also offer an early northbound out of Kings Cross which LNER don't.

That is true, it just might be more convenient to stop big groups being split apart (or if they had a seat selector!)

 

[yorkie]

That is true, it just might be more convenient to stop big groups being split apart (or if they had a seat selector!)

It's perfectly possible to select seats for Lumo trains... by using our site!

(or any other Trainsplit derivative)

 

[185143]

If I ever read a review of anything where the author seems to be enjoying giving a negative review, or used “funny” terminology, I instantly discount it. A certain percentage of the population are just entitled and self-important. It is an intercity service specifically designed for a budget, not a glamorous service from an Agatha Christie novel. As for Ryanair, every one I have travelled on has been on time, safe and in no sense uncomfortable- what is there to complain about?


In which case they should have bought a sandwich at Marks and Spencer’s at the station for, what, five pounds maximum before boarding the train, like an adult.

To be fair, if such a service is advertised as part of the service, it's not unreasonable to expect it to be provided.

If you walked into King's Cross station expecting to be able to buy a sandwich and a bottle of coke because you've either done so before, or seen online that there are plenty of station retailers available, but arrived to find they were all closed, you'd be a tad disappointed, no?

 

[Scotrail314209]

It's perfectly possible to select seats for Lumo trains... by using our site!

(or any other Trainsplit derivative)

Very smooth there.

So as not to distract, the main reason why I opt for selecting seats is so that you aren't put on a table with three other strangers (as has happened on a Lumo service before), when there's groups sitting apart.

 

[800001]

Given they are replacing seat covers after only a bit over 4 years, that rather suggests they got it wrong to start with. When will they learn: use high quality moquette - it pays back through lasting much longer.

GWR did exactly the same!

 

[stu227]

I once had the misfortune of travelling London to Edinburgh and back with Lumo. The whole experience was unpleasant, from luggage restrictions, to the scrum to join the train as staff only unlocked the doors a few minutes before departure and the entire experience thereafter.

Despite their claim that folding bikes are welcome, staff looked (and spoke) at me as though I'd grown an extra head, when I asked them where to store my bike in their train which has obviously been set out for zero luggage capacity and maximum profit.

I won't be rushing back. But if folk like trains without any romance and a Ryanair level of service / attitude, then I'm very happy for them to use them - hopefully it'll leave more space in LNER for the rest of us!

 

[AlterEgo]

In which case they should have bought a sandwich at Marks and Spencer’s at the station for, what, five pounds maximum before boarding the train, like an adult.

Lumo also offer some hot food on board, but I think this is hot station fare reheated on board. They have little foil bags to deliver the food in to you. I guess the service when busy can be a bit frantic but I don’t think the article - like any one off review - can do much more than convey one person’s experience.

 

[yorkie]

....The only thing that could change is having more table seats, on a journey I did recently a family was split apart with their children being sat directly behind me without any supervision (followed by lots of noise and a mess which isn’t exactly needed at half 10 at night)...

Lumo aren't going to do this; adding table seats is better for groups (and also adds luggage space, between the seat backs) however it would reduce the seating capacity, and Lumo's aim is to maximise seats.

My advice to a group wanting tables would be to either book with us (or any other Trainsplit site) early, to obtain the few tables that exist (I think this is just one per coach, but I've never used Lumo personally), or travel with an alternative operator.

That said, while tables do help, I don't think parents can be excused for allowing children to misbehave on this basis. Some parents allow poor behaviour even when the children are in full view.