Luton DART and Luton Airport Parkway Updates

[Mojo]

Does that mean the end of September?

Does what mean end of September?

 

[43066]

Does what mean end of September?

I assume they mean opening, but the project website stubbornly refuses to commit to a “launch date”, so it’s difficult to know whether it’s actually running late or not!

Based on visual progress it does seem to have stalled. The platform advertising signs have been lit up for months now.

 

[Backroom_boy]

It won't open next month.

The airport owners recently tweeted on the ongoing public realm works, saying they're expected to finish at the end of the summer. Which is basically the end of September.

In addition, Luton Council are inviting people to a business conference on 6 October. Their Eventbrite page includes this phrase (my bolding):

Conference seems to be on the 29th of Nov, but still saying be one of the first on Dart. Has gone very quiet on progress though...

 

[LalRattyMember]

Oh dear - Opening date seems to have slipped backwards again - see Opening announcement for Luton DART Sounds like the announcement is in 2023, which makes one wonder what the actual opening date will be

 

[Techniquest]

I look at that as being a good sign that I'll be back at Luton in 2023 A good excuse to not only go back to Luton Airport after a few years away from there, September 2019 was my last visit, but also to do some 700s before this new airport link thing. Hopefully by the time it opens I'll actually decide where my next non-UK adventure is going to be!

 

[Amos]

Oh dear - Opening date seems to have slipped backwards again - see Opening announcement for Luton DART Sounds like the announcement is in 2023, which makes one wonder what the actual opening date will be

Was reported on bbc 3 counties radio this morning that the announcement of the opening date will now take place next year.

 

[Backroom_boy]

That's disappointing; I guess there is some problem that has been thrown up. Suprising though as it seems relatively uncomplicated system, two independent tracks, no points, one vehicle on each track. Or is Network Rail dragging their feet on their 5% of the project?

 

[LalRattyMember]

That's disappointing; I guess there is some problem that has been thrown up. Suprising though as it seems relatively uncomplicated system, two independent tracks, no points, one vehicle on each track. Or is National Rail dragging their feet on their 5% of the project?

According to the quote from the LuTon Rising CEO on BBC website "Testing of the system is significantly advanced, but there remain several important tasks that we are working to complete with our partners, which relate mostly to complexities and alignment of the system's revenue and ticketing arrangements".

I seem to recall the original plan was to include Oyster/Contactless from London in the ticket offering, so perhaps this is the cause of the "alignment" referred to by Mr Olver.

 

[Haywain]

I seem to recall the original plan was to include Oyster/Contactless from London in the ticket offering, so perhaps this is the cause of the "alignment" referred to by Mr Olver.

Oyster wouldn't be appropriate as it isn't accepted on the train to Luton Airport Parkway. On the other hand, contactless payment would seem to be very straightforward and doesn't need to be linked into the TfL system.

 

[mrmartin]

Seems fairly silly to delay it just for that. Couldn't they open it for free for a few months while they figure that out, as a preview service?

The current bus service is horrible. Really busy, very very slow at loading and unloading and uncomfortable

 

[ijmad]

Seems fairly silly to delay it just for that. Couldn't they open it for free for a few months while they figure that out, as a preview service?

The current bus service is horrible. Really busy, very very slow at loading and unloading and uncomfortable

Or like, just accept the current paper bus tickets...

 

[Bletchleyite]

Oyster wouldn't be appropriate as it isn't accepted on the train to Luton Airport Parkway. On the other hand, contactless payment would seem to be very straightforward and doesn't need to be linked into the TfL system.

It couldn't just be that due to the number of families, and throughput is significant so having a person with a PDQ machine wouldn't really work. But yes, why not a free trial service?

 

[SargeNpton]

Or like, just accept the current paper bus tickets...

Can't be done due to the need to apportion revenue in the back-office systems.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You could, shock horror, employ a couple of people to take cash (or even contactless) on entry at each end? That's how the bus works. If the bus is still there it doesn't need to initially be integrated with anything. Two quid and we let you in.

 

[jon0844]

The queuing for the bus bit is exactly what they want to get rid of.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The queuing for the bus bit is exactly what they want to get rid of.

Yes, but queueing for a people mover is better than queueing for a manky* bus, so why not get started now with a situation that's still better than now?

* Not all buses are manky but these ones definitely are. I use Arriva from the back exit myself.

 

[jon0844]

Yes, but queueing for a people mover is better than queueing for a manky* bus, so why not get started now with a situation that's still better than now?

* Not all buses are manky but these ones definitely are. I use Arriva from the back exit myself.

It would probably make more sense to run the system for free until they can sort the issues. Besides the enthusiasts filling them up early on, it isn't a service that would suddenly become massively overcrowded due to being free (as, say, giving free use of public transport).

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would probably make more sense to run the system for free until they can sort the issues. Besides the enthusiasts filling them up early on, it isn't a service that would suddenly become massively overcrowded due to being free (as, say, giving free use of public transport).

Agreed. Money would be saved by no longer having to pay for the buses anyway, assuming they aren't on a fixed term contract.

 

[LalRattyMember]

Oyster wouldn't be appropriate as it isn't accepted on the train to Luton Airport Parkway. On the other hand, contactless payment would seem to be very straightforward and doesn't need to be linked into the TfL system.

I agree with you, but according to Luton Airport's surface access strategy (PDF download) it does look as if their wish was they could be included in Oyster in some form, in the same way Gatwick Airport is available on Oyster PAYG. If they are still trying for that, I can understand why the timescale may have slipped a bit

From the strategy document "Oyster card services are planned to be introduced at Luton Airport Parkway Railway Station and will also cover the DART system, facilitating seamless journeys between LLA and London. "

 

[edwin_m]

Can't be done due to the need to apportion revenue in the back-office systems.

Couldn't they just continue with however the current through booking via the bus does it? Presumably the national ticketing system attributes some revenue from every ticket booked to/from the airport, and they have someone checking all tickets and selling one to anyone that doesn't have such a ticket. There's extra complication to use automatic barriers that would have to read the ticket, but if that's the only problem it doesn't seem worth delaying entry into service.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I agree with you, but according to Luton Airport's surface access strategy (PDF download) it does look as if their wish was they could be included in Oyster in some form, in the same way Gatwick Airport is available on Oyster PAYG. If they are still trying for that, I can understand why the timescale may have slipped a bit

From the strategy document "Oyster card services are planned to be introduced at Luton Airport Parkway Railway Station and will also cover the DART system, facilitating seamless journeys between LLA and London. "

New Oyster would use the contactless back-end and so be usable on all contactless routes (in essence it would be a prepaid debit card but one that could only be spent on travel, thus avoiding TfL needing to be regulated as if it was a bank*), but I don't know how far TfL is along with that.

* This was I believe the reason Oyster couldn't be used for other things like a coffee or a newspaper.

 

[Haywain]

Agreed. Money would be saved by no longer having to pay for the buses anyway, assuming they aren't on a fixed term contract.

The buses are operated by Thameslink, unlike the DART, so the money saved wouldn’t pay for the DART.

In any event, the DART is not ready for opening yet as work is still going on.

 

[SAPhil]

It would probably make more sense to run the system for free until they can sort the issues. Besides the enthusiasts filling them up early on, it isn't a service that would suddenly become massively overcrowded due to being free (as, say, giving free use of public transport).

Luton Airport and free are not words that are ever associated with each other! It's a nasty money grabbing little airport

 

[LalRattyMember]

Luton Airport and free are not words that are ever associated with each other! It's a nasty money grabbing little airport

Allegedly..... Saved you there

 

[jon0844]

Luton Airport and free are not words that are ever associated with each other! It's a nasty money grabbing little airport

It would still make sense to run the service ASAP, because the quicker you get people to the airport, the quicker you get them into the shopping mall airside.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Luton Airport and free are not words that are ever associated with each other! It's a nasty money grabbing little airport

That has more to do with the nature of its airlines.

 

[Bald Rick]

Luton Airport and free are not words that are ever associated with each other! It's a nasty money grabbing little airport

That has more to do with the nature of its airlines.

It’s more to do with the nature of the U.K. airport business model. Luton was in many respects a pioneer - charge for drop off? We’ll so does Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted now.

Personally I think Luton is a great airport. I haven’t had a notable delay there for well over a decade of using it at least 4 times a year (except covid). It is certainly rather efficient - I gather the most efficient in the U.K. in terms of airport area per annual passenger (a curious metric, but one that I think is worthwhile).

disclaimer - I live under one of the departure flightpaths. It’s much less noisy now too that half the planes are neo - to the extent that I don’t notice it now.

 

[jon0844]

I like Luton a lot too. Stansted historically has regularly delayed me (not landing, but getting bags out and the queues for clearing security) and Gatwick is far - but I'd generally favour all over Heathrow because of its sheer size and the time to get around it (even the long walk from the train depending on terminal). Sadly when other people organise my travel, I don't get a lot of choice.

I am sure the new train to the airport is going to make Luton even more popular, although that might then degrade the experience.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I like Luton a lot too. Stansted historically has regularly delayed me (not landing, but getting bags out and the queues for clearing security) and Gatwick is far - but I'd generally favour all over Heathrow because of its sheer size and the time to get around it (even the long walk from the train depending on terminal). Sadly when other people organise my travel, I don't get a lot of choice.

I am sure the new train to the airport is going to make Luton even more popular, although that might then degrade the experience.

Stansted is terrible. The main strength of Luton is that it isn't operated (in terms of the runway etc) to anything like capacity so recovers easily from delays.

What's quite notable about the Luton people mover is that it'll make it, other than the tiny (and not at all pleasant to use*) London City, by far the easiest airport to get to the City from, particularly when added to the simple operations meaning it's quite quick to get through in most cases (though it could do with upstaffing passport control a bit). Could this mean more interest in "traditional airlines" using it rather than just SleasyRyanWizz?

* LCY was nice to use when it had 10 gates and mostly small sub-50-seat prop aircraft usually not even booked full due to the steep takeoffs and landings. Unfortunately, the number of gates has increased and the size of the planes too but with no meaningful terminal expansion, so it's now horribly overcrowded and quite unpleasant.

 

[Mike395]

Luton is the only UK airport I've never had to queue more than 5 minutes for passport control either (at least, not since e-gates were installed) and getting bags to the carousels seems very efficient too - I reckon once DART opens arriving passengers could easily be at Luton Airport Parkway (having collected hold bags too) within 30 minutes of the plane touching down.

I reckon there's more than ticketing holding it up or they'd open it for the PR boost, even if just with limited hours.