Machine only printed out part of the journey

[joebassman]

Hi

I purchased a split ticket with Trainsplit from wellingborough to mill hill broadway.

However when I collected the tickets at the collection machine at stowmarket station it only printed out the first part of the journey from wellingborough to bedford.

I phoned trainsplit and they said they can't reissue the tickets and to phone the number on the machine. When I went back the machine was out of service and there was no number on there.

I spoke to the ticket office and the lady there said she can't issue another ticket as it was through a different company for a different train company service. She did say they have been having issues with that machine.

She did however write on the back of the ticket that the machine didn't print the full journey and signed and stamped it.

However she said that although that would be fine for a Greater Anglia service, because the journey is with a different train company she can't guarentee it will be ok, but it should be.

I phoned trainsplit again and they said it will be fine as long as I still have the email and if there is any issues with the conductor to take their name and number and get back to trainsplit.

It does have me a little worried though in that could there still be the possibility that they could say I don't have all the tickets for the full journey and prosecute me?

 

[Watershed]

Hi

I purchased a split ticket with Trainsplit from wellingborough to mill hill broadway.

However when I collected the tickets at the collection machine at stowmarket station it only printed out the first part of the journey from wellingborough to bedford.

I phoned trainsplit and they said they can't reissue the tickets and to phone the number on the machine. When I went back the machine was out of service and there was no number on there.

I spoke to the ticket office and the lady there said she can't issue another ticket as it was through a different company for a different train company service. She did say they have been having issues with that machine.

She did however write on the back of the ticket that the machine didn't print the full journey and signed and stamped it.

However she said that although that would be fine for a Greater Anglia service, because the journey is with a different train company she can't guarentee it will be ok, but it should be.

I phoned trainsplit again and they said it will be fine as long as I still have the email and if there is any issues with the conductor to take their name and number and get back to trainsplit.

It does have me a little worried though in that could there still be the possibility that they could say I don't have all the tickets for the full journey and prosecute me?

I would be very concerned as well, and unless the endorsement on the back of the ticket said "valid for travel to Mill Hill Broadway" or something to that effect, I would buy another ticket to ensure I was covered.

I must say I'm rather disappointed by TrainSplit's response to this one - they should not be palming you off to the TVM's operator. The TVM operator is merely an agent acting on behalf of TrainSplit and if they say (as they're quite entitled to do) "speak to the retailer", the buck stops with the retailer.

I would buy the new ticket from TrainSplit and if they refuse to refund it, I would consider raising a partial chargeback (or section 75 claim, in the unlikely event it was for £100+ and you used a credit card) on the original booking.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Can the OP post a photograph of the endorsement?

Theoretically this is permission to travel from an authorised person. But we know what some RPIs are like.

 

[joebassman]

Heres the phots of the tickets she wrote on, stamped and signed

 

[Bletchleyite]

Hmm, that's a bit unhelpful of them, not very easy to read and doesn't do a simple "please pass to X".

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Hmm, that's a bit unhelpful of them, not very easy to read and doesn't do a simple "please pass to X".

Better than nothing, and the station stamp and accompanying scrawl on the back of the ticket(s) is a fair indication that something has gone wrong.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Better than nothing, and the station stamp and accompanying scrawl on the back of the ticket(s) is a fair indication that something has gone wrong.

True. Though putting "split ticket" on there will be seen by some RPIs as a red rag to a bull, and it could be taken as a message to Trainsplit rather than a request to permit travel.

 

[joebassman]

Its also 2 train companies I'll be using, East Midlands for Wellingborough to Luton Airport and Thameslink for the rest of the way. So it'll probably be 2 ticket inspectors I'll have to show it to.

 

[Haywain]

So it'll probably be 2 ticket inspectors I'll have to show it to.

Theoretically it could be but it's unlikely.

 

[Watershed]

Its also 2 train companies I'll be using, East Midlands for Wellingborough to Luton Airport and Thameslink for the rest of the way. So it'll probably be 2 ticket inspectors I'll have to show it to.

I don't think this particularly makes a difference, except that Thameslink is DOO so if you encounter anyone it would be an RPI, rather than a guard as it might be on EMR.

Mill Hill Broadway is barriered as with many Thameslink stations, so that's (potentially) the third place you might need your ticket.

The endorsement is clear about what happened, but it doesn't unambiguously give permission to travel between Bedford and Mill Hill Broadway. If TrainSplit continue to refuse to assist, I think I would ask a member of staff at Stowmarket (or Wellingborough, on the day) whether they will endorse the ticket explicitly for travel between Bedford and Mill Hill Broadway. And if the answer there is still no, then at that point I would buy another ticket and seek to recover that from TrainSplit.

 

[joebassman]

I did try phoning thameslink but the lady who answered had difficulty understanding me as I don't think English was her first language judging by her accent and was a little blunt. In the end she said it would be ok as long as I brought a print out of the confirmation email. But she didn't give me much confidence.

I'll try leaving a negative review on trust pilot about transplit's refusal to help. Sometimes that works with some companies.

 

[Watershed]

I did try phoning thameslink but the lady who answered had difficulty understanding me as I don't think English was her first language judging by her accent and was a little blunt. In the end she said it would be ok as long as I brought a print out of the confirmation email. But she didn't give me much confidence.

I'll try leaving a negative review on trust pilot about transplit's refusal to help. Sometimes that works with some companies.

I wouldn't waste your time with Trustpilot to be honest. I would just email them directly and, if necessary, use the chargeback/S75 options as outlined above.

 

[CyrusWuff]

I must say I'm rather disappointed by TrainSplit's response to this one - they should not be palming you off to the TVM's operator. The TVM operator is merely an agent acting on behalf of TrainSplit and if they say (as they're quite entitled to do) "speak to the retailer", the buck stops with the retailer.

A TVM print failure is the TVM operator's problem, not the retailer's, and there's a documented procedure in Knowledgebase that the member of station staff should have followed to resolve the situation, with no extra cost to the OP apart from the time needed to do it.

Sadly the existence of Knowledgebase, let alone the procedure in question, seems to be rarely mentioned in retail training.

 

[Watershed]

A TVM print failure is the TVM operator's problem, not the retailer's, and there's a documented procedure in Knowledgebase that the member of station staff should have followed to resolve the situation, with no extra cost to the OP apart from the time needed to do it.

Sadly the existence of Knowledgebase, let alone the procedure in question, seems to be rarely mentioned in retail training.

That may be the industry's internal position, but that is certainly not the contractual position from the customer's point of view. However, I agree that if the correct procedures had been followed, the OP would not now find themselves in this predicament.

 

[Haywain]

Perhaps @Adam Williams might be able to assist?

 

[Raileasy]

Hi @joebassman

I have just replied to your email and have issued you with a new booking reference to collect the missing ticket.

That said, it is quite clear the TOC member of staff did not follow the correct procedures in this instance but we are glad we could assist.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Hi @joebassman

I have just replied to your email and have issued you with a new booking reference to collect the missing ticket.

That said, it is quite clear the TOC member of staff did not follow the correct procedures in this instance but we are glad we could assist.

Admittedly had I been the Ticket Office staff in this situation all I would have been able to do is the same- stamp the back of the tickets, endorse them and hope for the best.

My TOC doesn't have a set procedure in place to deal with this scenario.

I do remember something happening to me over a decade ago at a (at the time) Virgin managed Station ticket office and the staff gave me a printed card and stapled my tickets to it.

 

[joebassman]

Hi @joebassman

I have just replied to your email and have issued you with a new booking reference to collect the missing ticket.

That said, it is quite clear the TOC member of staff did not follow the correct procedures in this instance but we are glad we could assist.

Thank you

 

[Dai Corner]

Is it not within the scope of ticket office staff to phone the retailer and obtain a new booking reference to enable them to issue the missing ticket?

 

[ainsworth74]

Admittedly had I been the Ticket Office staff in this situation all I would have been able to do is the same- stamp the back of the tickets, endorse them and hope for the best.

My TOC doesn't have a set procedure in place to deal with this scenario.

Can you not follow the procedure in the Knowledgebase?

 

[voyagerdude220]

Can you not follow the procedure in the Knowledgebase?

I've only ever heard about the Knowledgebase from posts on here- I wouldn't even know how to access it.

 

[ainsworth74]

I've only ever heard about the Knowledgebase from posts on here- I wouldn't even know how to access it.

Sigh of course. Why would your TOC want you to have access to the materials that would allow you to do you job...

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've only ever heard about the Knowledgebase from posts on here- I wouldn't even know how to access it.

Wow, that highlights a serious gap in booking office staff training. Every member of booking office staff should know what it is, where it is, be able to access it while working and use it on a daily basis to provide quality advice to customers.

 

[Haywain]

that highlights a serious gap in booking office staff training.

In that TOC, yes.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Sigh of course. Why would your TOC want you to have access to the materials that would allow you to do you job...

I know the feeling. I've previously asked my Line Manager if there was any way staff like myself could have a more formal/official method of giving passengers authority to travel in lieu of an actual ticket in situations like this and they explained we couldn't. Currently I usually stamp pax tickets or simply paper but I'd feel happier giving them something more official as such.

 

[janb]

Can you not follow the procedure in the Knowledgebase?

No. I do have access to the Knowledgebase but at home now so working from memory but I believe it references some software that we don't have. And ringing a phone number with information that we don't have.

It seems like something somebody wrote one day but never actually implemented on the ground (at least not widely).

 

[transportphoto]

The defined process in iKB is as follows:

Some, but not all tickets are printed/part printed.
Duplicate tickets can only be issued if a ToD CTR reference number can be supplied and the CTR successfully recalled for ticketing. Any part printed tickets must be handed over by the customer.
If there is a print failure during ticket printing at the SSTVM, a message will appear on the screen advising the customer to collect their tickets from the Ticket Office.

a)Collect from the customer all the tickets that were printed.
b)If possible, recall the CTR and check the status of the ToD booking using a TIS.
c)If the CTR cannot be recalled by the ticket office TIS, station staff should use the Live Sales Management (LSM) Console to review the status of the ToD booking.
d)If the LSM Console displays the status of the CTR as set to ‘P’ (print failure) the users of some TIS may be able to over-ride this status and re-issue the full set of tickets.
e) If the LSM Console reports the status as ‘Locked’ then;
(a) Users authorised to unlock CTRs should request an ‘Unlock’ using the LSM console.
(b) Users not authorised to unlock CTRs should call the LSM helpdesk. Requests to unlock CTRs will be managed by Smart421’s technical support team. The service is available seven days a week between the hours of 08:00 and 18:00 and can be contacted on [redacted phone number].
When calling the LSM Helpdesk, station staff must have the following information available in order to proceed.
1. Name
2. Location (Station).
3. Answer to a secret question which has been defined by the TOC.
Unlocking should allow the ToD to be recalled and the tickets issued.
f)Ask the customer to complete Parts 1 & 2 of a ToD Duplicate Tickets Record Form.
g)If possible, check how many tickets were printed, using the SSTVM Supervisor Terminal. Keep evidence of this and submit with the operator’s balance sheet at the end of the shift.
h)If there is more than one journey booked under a single CTR, then the operator must select the ticket/tickets to be issued.
i)Complete Part 3 of the ToD Duplicate Tickets record Form with the details of the tickets issued.
j)Ask the customer to sign the ToD Duplicate Tickets Record Form in Part 4.
k)Provide the authorisation in Part 5.
l)Give the complete set of new tickets to the customer.
m)Mark the part printed tickets as cancelled and attach to the ToD Duplicate Tickets Record form.
n)Retain the ToD Duplicate Tickets Record Form at the TOC central accounting point.

I do have access to the Knowledgebase but at home now so working from memory but I believe it references some software that we don't have. And ringing a phone number with information that we don't have.

I feel like @janb has hit the nail on the head with the comment regarding details not available to staff on the ground.

 

[blakey1152]

Heres the phots of the tickets she wrote on, stamped and signed

Blimey, did the ticket office clerk used to be a doctor? LOL

 

[yorkie]

Hi

I purchased a split ticket with Trainsplit from wellingborough to mill hill broadway.

However when I collected the tickets at the collection machine at stowmarket station it only printed out the first part of the journey from wellingborough to bedford.

I phoned trainsplit and they said they can't reissue the tickets and to phone the number on the machine. When I went back the machine was out of service and there was no number on there.

I spoke to the ticket office and the lady there said she can't issue another ticket as it was through a different company for a different train company service. She did say they have been having issues with that machine.

The ticket office are wrong; it is a Greater Anglia machine and Greater Anglia need to sort it.

She did however write on the back of the ticket that the machine didn't print the full journey and signed and stamped it.

However she said that although that would be fine for a Greater Anglia service, because the journey is with a different train company she can't guarentee it will be ok, but it should be.

Again the ticket office is wrong from the point of view that they do have authority as an authorised person to authorise travel in this manner and this does apply to other TOCs.

The ticket office should be given the means to reprint the tickets, but if they haven't, then endorsing seems the appropriate way forward. It is binding on other TOCs.

I phoned trainsplit again and they said it will be fine as long as I still have the email and if there is any issues with the conductor to take their name and number and get back to trainsplit.

It does have me a little worried though in that could there still be the possibility that they could say I don't have all the tickets for the full journey and prosecute me?

If asked for your details, provide them and seek assistance here.

As more journeys become e-ticket enabled, these issues will happen less frequently. But in the meantime these problems with the Ticket On Departure (TOD) system remain a big problem for some people.

I must say I'm rather disappointed by TrainSplit's response to this one - they should not be palming you off to the TVM's operator. The TVM operator is merely an agent acting on behalf of TrainSplit and if they say (as they're quite entitled to do) "speak to the retailer", the buck stops with the retailer.

I would buy the new ticket from TrainSplit and if they refuse to refund it, I would consider raising a partial chargeback (or section 75 claim, in the unlikely event it was for £100+ and you used a credit card) on the original booking.

This isn't fair on the retailer; Greater Anglia are at fault here.

Is it not within the scope of ticket office staff to phone the retailer and obtain a new booking reference to enable them to issue the missing ticket?

Providing the ticket office pays for the ticket, that would be fine, yes. I suspect the operator of the machine doesn't want to pay for their error though!

No. I do have access to the Knowledgebase but at home now so working from memory but I believe it references some software that we don't have. And ringing a phone number with information that we don't have.

It seems like something somebody wrote one day but never actually implemented on the ground (at least not widely).

This is very typical of the approach taken to customer service at many of the TOCs, sadly. Your employers are putting you in a difficult position. I'd be taking this up with my manager if it was me.

I know the feeling. I've previously asked my Line Manager if there was any way staff like myself could have a more formal/official method of giving passengers authority to travel in lieu of an actual ticket in situations like this and they explained we couldn't.

Sounds like either this manager, or their boss, or someone higher up in the company, isn't doing their job properly. It shouldn't be acceptable that they are putting you in this position, but it is entirely within my expectations for the rail industry, I am sad to say.

 

[[.n]]

Also seems like limited hours for the telephone helpline, and that procedure is so long winded "secret question"!!!!!