Manchester Metrolink master thread

[Xenophon PCDGS]

TfGM have put a notice on the media centre part of their website concerning the Oldham/Rochdale line to the effect that the existing works timetable at Beal Lane, Shaw has now been extended to Sunday, 4th September.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

TfGM have written to people affected to say that further work on the new Metrolink extension into Oldham town centre will begin on Monday 12th September to divert utility services on King Street, which will require the closure of King Street between Union Street and Barn Street for six weeks.

On the better side of the news is that Oldham Mumps roundabout is now scheduled to be fully re-opened to traffic on Monday, 12th September.

 

[The Snap]

On the better side of the news is that Oldham Mumps roundabout is now scheduled to be fully re-opened to traffic on Monday, 12th September.

I always was fully open to traffic...just the lane closest to the roundabout closed .

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I always was fully open to traffic...just the lane closest to the roundabout closed .

Are you speaking on behalf of the roundabout...I had to read the start of your posting twice

On a more serious note, the information that I posted is taken from the letter sent by Neil Harrison, Stakeholder Communications Manager, Oldham/Rochdale Line.

 

[northwichcat]

One group are wanting the second city crossing to go along Deansgate. Judging from the responses that's not a popular proposal with the public:
http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereve...for-new-metrolink-line-to-run-along-deansgate

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

How would the Deansgate proposals affect the proposed Exchange Square stop? There is no mention of that in this report.

 

[Nym]

And all of the traffic that uses deansgate, where is that doing to go?

Company I'm working with at the moment uses an 18 tonne on a multidrop up that road, that wouldn't fit in with Metrolink...

The only real alternative I can think of to 2CC is an Oxford Road re-build, or sending some tracks down Oxford Road it'self. But if you hunt it down I'm sure you can find a well written proposal (by me) on how to shoehorn 3 metrolink platforms onto Manchester Oxford Road station, loosing platform 5, and extending 1 and 4, shortening 2 and 3 slightly for accessability.

 

[snail]

How would the Deansgate proposals affect the proposed Exchange Square stop? There is no mention of that in this report.

No mention because they intend avoiding it altogether. They want to turn right off Victoria St across the front of the Cathedral then left through Cathedral Gardens/Long Millgate. There is an alternative route which is even more impractical - up the old ramp to Exchange Station then cross in front of the Arena and the old Hunts Bank station and cut through where the refreshment rooms are. Serving Deansgate has some merit (but, yes, is it wide enough and where does the traffic go?) but the route into Victoria looks like it has been thought out on the back of an envelope using crayon.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

There is an alternative route which is even more impractical - up the old ramp to Exchange Station then cross in front of the Arena and the old Hunts Bank station and cut through where the refreshment rooms are.

If you recall, posters such as WatcherZero, on a thread some months ago concerning West-facing sidings for Manchester Victoria station, gave details of a large development on the land occupied by Exchange station that would seem to preclude this route that impinges upon the former Exchange station site.

On the matter of the proposed Exchange Square stop, this appears to be the only planned stop between St Peters Square and Manchester Victoria. There must have been much thought where the site of such a stop should be situated and the planned situation next to the Arndale Centre and is ideal for both commuters and shoppers.

 

[WatcherZero]

If you recall, posters such as WatcherZero, on a thread some months ago concerning West-facing sidings for Manchester Victoria station, gave details of a large development on the land occupied by Exchange station that would seem to preclude this route that impinges upon the former Exchange station site.

On the matter of the proposed Exchange Square stop, this appears to be the only planned stop between St Peters Square and Manchester Victoria. There must have been much thought where the site of such a stop should be situated and the planned situation next to the Arndale Centre and is ideal for both commuters and shoppers.

Im not the Messiah, im just a very naughty boy!

Yeah more stations were considered for the Cross st route, one at the corner of the town hall (rejected because it might stop traffic and was very close to St Peters square especielly after its moved) and one outside the Exchange Theatre (rejected because the Theatre had noise concerns and there wasnt really enough pavement space).

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Metrolink East Manchester Line

Matters are moving forward now eastwards and TfGM have written to all parties concerned to say that as part of the construction works ongoing, they will lay trackwork along the central reservation on Lord Sheldon Way across its junction with Richmond Street from mid-September for a period of six weeks. A weight limit of 7.5 tonnes will continue to be enforced of Richmond Street railway bridge.

 

[krisk]

There is a feeling with this of just get on with it, I go to the cinema in Ashton and it's like for all the work you are doing i'm not seeing people just working on getting this done, it's just lane closures, barriers and not much else, why does it take 3 years to bring Metrolink to Ashton

 

[snail]

There is a feeling with this of just get on with it, I go to the cinema in Ashton and it's like for all the work you are doing i'm not seeing people just working on getting this done, it's just lane closures, barriers and not much else, why does it take 3 years to bring Metrolink to Ashton

Have a read of some Edinburgh tram threads if you are feeling hard done by!

There are roads to be re-configured and services under them to be re-routed (one of the main contributors to the Edinburgh delays). All that takes time but with no visible end product to the 'man in the street'.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

For people living in the area of Newbold, Milnrow and New Hey, TfGM will be holding an afternoon meeting on Thursday,22nd September, from 1530 to 1730 at Newbold Church, Milnrow Road, where members of the Metrolink team will be available to discuss the current construction progress and to answer queries upon the Newbold Metrolink stop. Letters have been sent out by TfGM to over 240 residents and businesses in the Newbold area.

This posting was made on 21st September 2011....not to be confused of the date of posting of the item immediately below


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This item posted on 26th September 2011

In the October 2011 edition of Modern Railways, on pages 20 and 21, there is a 2-page spread captioned "Big Bang progress" containing four good sized photographs of new works and a "Future Network" map.

 

[HSTEd]

You could have trams reverse out of Manchester Picadilly tram stop, head down Whitworth street, turn left and run down Upper Brook Street all the way to Fallowfield, turn west and head back in to terminate next to the Sainsbury's, that would get you the enormous peak loadings of university students coming in from Owens Park as U. Brook street is a hundred yards or even less from most university buildings (I can see it out of my lab window)

You could make far better time down Upper Brook Street than the busses can ever hope to down Rusholme, especially in the rush hours.
But there is already one line going to Didsbury so I can't see another heading out that way any time soon.

EDIT: I make it roughly 5700m of entirely on street running, although traffic tends to be quite free flowing on Upper Brook Street so I think it could work and it probably wouldnt cost a vast sum either, you might even be able to extend it at some point to meet up with the actually building SOuth Manchester line in Didsbury.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I make it roughly 5700m of entirely on street running, although traffic tends to be quite free flowing on Upper Brook Street so I think it could work and it probably wouldn't cost a vast sum either, you might even be able to extend it at some point to meet up with the actually building South Manchester line in Didsbury.

I can see some problems with your proposal:-

1). The cost of construction, based upon the current construction costs

2). The need to purchase extra trams, as the existing fleet will be fully committed once all the existing system expansion works are completed.

3). The disruption that would be caused by the relocation of the utilities services, as all your route is stated to be on-street running.

4). The traffic disruption to both commuter flows and freight traffic caused by having a tramway running on a major route to and from Manchester City Centre.

5). The bus companies would make determined efforts to make their fare structure far more acceptable to the very large student community. which a tram company such as Metrolink could not hope to compete with.

 

[HSTEd]

I can see some problems with your proposal:-

1). The cost of construction, based upon the current construction costs

2). The need to purchase extra trams, as the existing fleet will be fully committed once all the existing system expansion works are completed.

3). The disruption that would be caused by the relocation of the utilities services, as all your route is stated to be on-street running.

4). The traffic disruption to both commuter flows and freight traffic caused by having a tramway running on a major route to and from Manchester City Centre.

5). The bus companies would make determined efforts to make their fare structure far more acceptable to the very large student community. which a tram company such as Metrolink could not hope to compete with.

Well you can move the last eight hundred metres onto the footpath on the trackbed of the Fallowfield Loop line and terminate at the Fallowfield sainsburies.
400 metres if you run it on that footpath just back from the edge of Birchfields park under the trees (assuming you can lay the line with killing said trees) and then move the footpath to the edge of the road.
Which means its now only 80% Street running, but I agree that Stagecoach would probably be able to crush it using its "Unirider" and the fact that it has a huge mass of bus routes that students like to use.

Would probably need the PTE to acquire London level bus powers and have its own student ticket that it could compel Stagecoach to accept that was also for Tram services.

 

[Nym]

The thing is though, and I know this as I've just had to go down to that campus to finish registering and get all my 'Don't tax me' forms. Students won't give up £10/week (The probable difference between fares, especially on operators like Finglands) of their hard scrounged drinking money, to get dropped a massive 300 yds from where they want to be when the bus drops them right there.

The only schools it would go anywhere near would be the new School of Chemistry and the NE part of the UMIST campus.

Also, if you where going to run down there, wrong route I'd say....

Look at the side of the network that is overloaded and try to take services from that...

If we had to go into Fallowfeild (and I don't hate the idea myself, but I would extend it down to Withington at least...)

Pull a new line off after Deansgate-Castlefeild (that needs 4 tracking but thats another matter, a 1min headway on any railway is ridiculous), over Albion St, loose the parking bays for running on Whitworth St West, onto either Gr Malbrough St or Oxford Road (Divert the main flow of non bus traffic to Booth Street East and Cambridge Street), Oxford Road to become Access Only Northbound.
Station at University Precint (^sp), Station at Main Victroria Campus, Station at or in Manchester Royal Infirmary (Tempoary Terminus), out via Hathersage Road onto Upper Brook Street upto Dickinson Road, follow the treeline through Birchfeilds Park to the Armatage Centre, (Station), then theres a choice of routes to take from there...

PS: I havn't really given much thought to this route, just picked a line on overhead photos and from OTG knowlage of the area.

 

[HSTEd]

Yes, that is a far superior route to mine.... and as for it onyl going near the Chemistry building that is probably because Ive gone and designed a route to suit only my needs......

 

[Nym]

That and I wouldn't want trams anywhere near the A&E access on Upper Brook Street...

 

[HSTEd]

That and I wouldn't want trams anywhere near the A&E access on Upper Brook Street...

True, although it would be handy with all those drunk students wandering around there on a friday night

 

[nidave]

I have been reading about the Metrolink expansion on another forum with interest as I love the system and think its great for Manchester.
I love the automated announcers accent.

From reading another forum the reason some of the lines are not part open is the new train management software (TMS or sometimes referred to as TOS) is not ready. they have converted some of the new M500's to the old system (I believe this is AWS (I might have gotten this wrong) and a Line of sight system (in the City Centre)) The new TMS is all Line of sight with controlled junctions where appropriate. There is also a wireless mesh going up which will track the trams and allow the PID's to display accurate information.

This will allow trams to run closer together allowing a greater frequency of trams to get through the same section...

there was a lot of issues with the TMS when the Media City spur opened and it took ages to sort. Currently (as far as I understand) only the eccels line and the Charlton lines use the new TMS and it is required in the City Centre and a few other places (after Victoria) before they can open further.

The old systems are very expensive to retrofit to the new trams and from my understanding it is hard to source some of the components.

I believe all the trams currently in day to day use have all 3 systems in place and change as needed (you see the signs with things like "Change to street running mode")

Source: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=866944
Great read but a HUGE thread.

 

[WatcherZero]

The 'Change to street running mode' is for the T68's, its a switch that extends the retractable wing mirrors (most since replaced with CCTV cameras), turns on the signalling lights and switches down to a lower gear for better low speed/hill peformance.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

There are some planned works in the Droylsden/Audenshaw area, but I must confess that I feel sorry for the residents of 137-163 Droylsden Road who will lose vehicular access to the private driveways of their properties for a period of 10 weeks from 7th October, when track laying works will commence.

 

[nidave]

The 'Change to street running mode' is for the T68's, its a switch that extends the retractable wing mirrors (most since replaced with CCTV cameras), turns on the signalling lights and switches down to a lower gear for better low speed/hill peformance.

I knew there were a few different modes, I have been told in the city center it was an older style line of sight system.. I thought I had got some of the facts not quite right.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The TfGM media board on their website has said that the Metrolink services on the Altrincham, Eccles and South Manchester lines will cease at 2300 on Saturday, 29th October and all day on Sunday, 30th October in order to facilitate work on the crossover at Deansgate-Castlefield. A replacement bus service is said to be running on a 12 minute frequency.

The Bury to Manchester Piccadilly route will function as normal all weekend.

 

[northernrail]

The TfGM media board on their website has said that the Metrolink services on the Altrincham, Eccles and South Manchester lines will cease at 2300 on Saturday, 29th October and all day on Sunday, 30th October in order to facilitate work on the crossover at Deansgate-Castlefield. A replacement bus service is said to be running on a 12 minute frequency.

The Bury to Manchester Piccadilly route will function as normal all weekend.

Theres a cracked rail, speed restrictions in place around the area.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Theres a cracked rail, speed restrictions in place around the area.

Has any reason been given as to why the rail should have suffered this problem in that particular area.

 

[northernrail]

Because the curve at Deansgate/Castlefield has to be one of the worst track pieces anywhere on the system.

 

[HSTEd]

Is anything going on about this tramming the line to Wigan via Walkden thing?

As far as I can tell it could be dedicated right of way from Manchester Victoria all the way to Hindley which would mean that journey times over that section would not suffer significantly and at that point all the remaining heavy rail services could be routed via Bolten and only loose a couple of minutes of travel time due to the slightly longer route.