My idea for a 24/7 Thameslink Cycle Ban

[Wolfie]

Or even if people with back packs - rucksacks took them off when joining a busy service, insted of taking up twice the room and constantly turning round to bash people out of the way. But that is perhaps my personal bete noir

Now this I fully agree with....

 

[jon0844]

I always take my back pack off. As said, it would be rude to leave it on and there's also the obvious security risk. I can't see why anyone would leave it on, bar getting on a near empty train.

 

[Bletchleyite]

the obvious security risk

What security risk do you think wearing a rucksack poses?

It's antisocial if you hit people in the face with it, of course, but *security* risk?!

 

[Dr_Intoxicated]

I always take my back pack off. As said, it would be rude to leave it on and there's also the obvious security risk. I can't see why anyone would leave it on, bar getting on a near empty train.

I would estimate that on the Waterloo and City line at least 25% of people leave them on.

 

[jon0844]

What security risk do you think wearing a rucksack poses?

It's antisocial if you hit people in the face with it, of course, but *security* risk?!

People dipping into one of the many pockets on my bag. I'd have thought that pretty obvious? I often have a laptop (might be a bit hard to nick), tablet, various phones, chargers and other devices in my rucksack. I might even have a MiFi in an outer pocket!

There is a company that has produced a backpack where the pockets are on the 'inside' so nobody can get in. I saw it at the Gadget Show a while back, but don't know if it has gone into full scale production.

 

[transmanche]

What security risk do you think wearing a rucksack poses?

That someone will steal your stuff out of your rucksack, quite literally from behind your back.

 

[DownSouth]

There is a company that has produced a backpack where the pockets are on the 'inside' so nobody can get in. I saw it at the Gadget Show a while back, but don't know if it has gone into full scale production.

Many of the higher-end luggage companies (especially those specialising in camera/laptop bags) already have inside-opening backpacks. The catch is trying to find retailers who stock a full range, instead of just a small selection of what they know will sell well.

I've got one daypack from LowePro that is about 11 years old (which also has padded dividers with velcro attachments to allow rearrangement to get a nice snug fit for different-sized tech gear) and one laptop-optimised pack from Belkin which is about four years old.

The only downside is the branding - if you are carrying a LowePro bag it screams out "expensive camera gear inside" to anyone who sees it, so best to unpick the stitching holding on the patch with the branding before use.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

Ok, maybe the conversation developed, but right now I can't be ar*** to read the rest, but the op wants to ban wheelchairs just because a toc has failed to provide enough carriages.

Maybe the op should get in the real world, and realise that people in wheelchairs or with other mobility issues have just as much right to travel as he or she does. The attitude of I'm alright f*** the rest from the op stinks.

Flip the coin mate and imagine what it would be like if you were confined to a wheelchair for life. For the record I'm not a wheelchair user, but neither am I an ars***** who doesn't give a f*** about others.

Quite the contrary - when a rail system is not fit for purpose and is as over crowded it is in the interests of everyone to restrict access. Maybe one day all the trains and stations will one day be adequate but not in our lifetimes. It will take time before all the world is designed to fit in with people with disabilities and it is just something you have to accept - I found that out wheeling my mother round in her chair for three years before her death. There maybe DAA laws but the reality is whether you, I or anyone else likes it or not there IS a restriction on where and when disabled people can travel and coming out with your dogmatic kneejerk statements shows no overall perception of the realities of life in a wheelchair. To take a wheelchair on very crowded trains not fit for purpose creates a safety issue for both the wheelchair user and those around them.
If you want people who don't really give a **** why not have a go at people refusing to move out of the adequate wheelchair space on buses.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I note that my original title of 'Should There be a ban......' , has been changed to 'My idea......' . I detect the personalisation of the original title is a subtle way in trying to undermine it's credibility by changing it from a generic question into one person's crusade against cyclists. If the infrastructure was there I would probably cycle to work (or a mix of train/cycle) but the reality here is that it isn't - and just like the minority of people going out for a drink or off to a football match there are a minority of cyclists who are an issue. They flout laws - cycle through red lights or on pavements and try to board trains when they are obviously too crowded for them to do so. We accept alcohol bans on certain networks and services because of the anti-social actions of a few so where is the problem with a cycle ban to protect the safety of the travelling public ?
At the least there should be some general guidelines issued regarding cyclists and over crowded trains and prosecutions brought (possibly for ABH) who those who think their 'right' to board a crowded train with a bike entitles them to bruise the shins of people already on board that train.

 

[341o2]

Imagine the outrage! Those poor cyclists who are helping save the environment being penalised for simply trying to save the planet. The usual attempt to deflect by stating that drivers are more dangerous/polluting will then follow.

Exactly. In my local area there are concerns regarding the size and frequency of organised cycle events and the invariable reaction is "x amount of animal deaths caused by cars, zero animal deaths by cyclists"

the other favourite mantra is "obesity crisis, cycling keeps you fit" to the point where you begin to feel that all other methods of weight loss are a complete waste of time.

BTW I ride a mountain bike, so I am not "anti cyclist" but anti the attitude held by some that cyclists can do no wrong and as per previous post, any criticism is brushed aside on the basis that the person voicing such an opinion is "anti cyclist"

 

[jon0844]

I cycle too. I'm sure most people do, or have, or will. It's not something reserved only for militant eco warriors that feel they're superior to everyone else. When they step off their bike, they're just ordinary people again!

Clearly you only spot the bad cyclists, but in many places (certainly London but also any other big town or city) these people are far more common.

 

[DownSouth]

I note that my original title of 'Should There be a ban......' , has been changed to 'My idea......' .

But your original title was just a Daily Mail-esque clickbait headline which didn't actually reflect the content of the post - your original post was indeed a one-man (or one-boy more likely, the standard of both the reasoning and the writing seems a bit more like a 14 year old troll posting from his mum's computer) crusade against cyclists, parents and people with disabilities.

I support the improved title which is a bit closer to reality and reasonably neutral, but to further improve it there should be another change to My idea for a 24/7 Thameslink ban on cycles, pushchairs and wheelchairs (to more fully reflect what people will find when they open the thread) or even My rant on why Thameslink should take cyclists, parents and people with disabilities out the back and shoot them (to reflect what people will find if they open your head).

I detect the personalisation of the original title is a subtle way in trying to undermine it's credibility by changing it from a generic question into one person's crusade against cyclists.

Of course, along with most others I understand that this forum is a benevolent (mostly benevolent at least ) dictatorship and not a democracy. You and I have no right to free speech here.

If you don't want the forum management to disassociate themselves with your opinions, try posting more reasonably and don't go off on irascible crusades that make people want to disassociate themselves with your opinions.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I cycle too. I'm sure most people do, or have, or will. It's not something reserved only for militant eco warriors that feel they're superior to everyone else. When they step off their bike, they're just ordinary people again!

Clearly you only spot the bad cyclists, ...

This is true of everyone. If you're cycling while wearing normal clothes - instead of brightly-coloured sport cycling* kit or a high-visibility jacket** - and you're not doing something to attract attention such as running a red light or salmoning up a one way street, you're invisible.

The key to helping people come into a more full understanding of this lies in facts and statistics.

... but in many places (certainly London but also any other big town or city) these people are far more common.

This is to be expected. London is a city which has gradually evolved over centuries with very little intentional planning and which has grown too big to function properly, so the unfriendly infrastructure and pro-motorist road rules make obeying the road rules unattractive for people who cycle. Where there is quality infrastructure (which can be retro-fitted to a city which previously had a deficit of planning, in the 1960s Amsterdam and Copenhagen were very car-friendly) then there is little incentive to break the rules.

Many of our cities in Australia have similar problems, but instead of the cities originally being unplanned, the problem started in the post-war prosperity of the 1950s when people could suddenly afford cars and the population was still small enough that there was enough space on the roads for them. Adelaide, for example, was very well planned 180 years ago by the professional surveyor Col William Light, and the same layout which currently prioritises private motor transport could easily be adapted to become much more people-friendly if the will was there to do it.



* I do like how the Dutch language has their word for 'cyclist' that they used for a normal person who is riding a bike, and a separate word for a sport cyclist which literally translates into English as "wheel-athlete."
** which should not be compulsory so long as black and grey cars are allowed on the road. The nations with the highest standards of living all have strict liability laws saddling those who are honoured with the permission to drive the bigger vehicles on the roads with the responsibility to use that honour wisely and not crash into the softer road users.

 

[bramling]

I cycle too. I'm sure most people do, or have, or will. It's not something reserved only for militant eco warriors that feel they're superior to everyone else. When they step off their bike, they're just ordinary people again!

Clearly you only spot the bad cyclists, but in many places (certainly London but also any other big town or city) these people are far more common.

I think this is the nub of why this always turns in to a poisonous topic.

Those that don't cycle seem to see those that do as fitting into one of two groups:
(1) Some kind of left-wing environmental loony that cycles to prove some kind of point.
(2) A person or family that goes down to a local trail where you can hire a bike and spends a few hours having a "day out".

The reality is rather different. Whilst the above groups most certainly exist, *most* people use a bike because it's simply the most suitable means for making that particular journey. That might be in combination with a train for commuting (try finding any other way of reliably covering Hitchin to Aldwych, door-to-door, at peak time, in 45 minutes), or in my case for some leisure activities it's simply not practicable to take the car up to somewhere like Manchester for the day especially when I might be visiting a number of places within an area that's just that bit too large to cover on foot. Finally, many bike users also drive a car.

I can't help but zone out whenever the words cyclist or cycle pop up on this forum and elsewhere. Society as a whole needs to mature a little on the subject.

 

[telstarbox]

Good point, I'm a (part time) "cyclist" but also a pedestrian, rail user and occasional road user as a car passenger.