My Idea To Reopen Folkestone Harbour

[Doomotron]

Folkestone Harbour station has recently been made into a footpath to bring people back to the Harbour Arm. However, wouldn't having a train station bring in more people? I think that the line and the station should be reopened as a train station for the Arm and a new junction to allow trains to not have to reverse that faces west built as well. Maybe even reopening Folkestone East as well (I mean, the platforms are still mostly intact including one shelter that's fully intact). I also think that the fast tracks at West would be reintroduced and the other island platform at Central reopened.

The services from FH would go like this:
- 1tph to London Charing Cross
-1tph to London St Pancras International
-1tph Folkestone Central shuttle
-(maybe) 1tph Thameslink service, as an extension to the Maidstone East service

What do you think?

 

[Class465fan]

Still don't see the reason why they've closed down the station and boarded it up? Could've been a good use to the people that lives there. And yes i think those services could work

 

[NSEFAN]

Folkestone Harbour station has recently been made into a footpath to bring people back to the Harbour Arm. However, wouldn't having a train station bring in more people? I think that the line and the station should be reopened as a train station for the Arm and a new junction to allow trains to not have to reverse that faces west built as well. Maybe even reopening Folkestone East as well (I mean, the platforms are still mostly intact including one shelter that's fully intact). I also think that the fast tracks at West would be reintroduced and the other island platform at Central reopened.

The services from FH would go like this:
- 1tph to London Charing Cross
-1tph to London St Pancras International
-1tph Folkestone Central shuttle
-(maybe) 1tph Thameslink service, as an extension to the Maidstone East service

What do you think?

For the extra services, the paths may not exist. Alternatively, you have to cancel services to other destinations, so who loses out? Even for the Thameslink extension, there is probably not enough stock. Whilst the area may be regenerated, I would say at best a shuttle to Folkestone East would be sufficient, which would more likely be a tram rather than heavy rail. The sole reason to have heavy rail is for boat trains, for which there is no market anymore.

 

[MarkyT]

The curves on the old platforms are extremely tight. Far too tight for new build, and now it's been closed the station probably couldn't be reopened as it will have lost its 'grandfather rights'. Not saying it's viable, but assuming the station issues could be sorted by some means, trains serving the branch might be Chatham line Dover terminators running on to Folkestone Harbour direct via a remodelled junction at Folkestone East.

 

[tellytype]

You'd have a job re-opening it now since it has only just had millions spent on being turned into a rather nice pedestrian walkway from Tram Road, over the swing bridge & down through the old station & out on to the harbour arm, which is now a bit like a pier would have been in the old days

https://www.kentlive.news/news/kent-news/photographs-show-stunning-transformation-folkestone-1408937

Having worked on that harbour arm in the Hoverspeed days its not entirely an unwelcome improvement, but I can't see it being much fun come November time!

 

[DPWH]

It maybe could do with a tea room. I don't think it needs trains.

 

[Doomotron]

For the extra services, the paths may not exist. Alternatively, you have to cancel services to other destinations, so who loses out? Even for the Thameslink extension, there is probably not enough stock. Whilst the area may be regenerated, I would say at best a shuttle to Folkestone East would be sufficient, which would more likely be a tram rather than heavy rail. The sole reason to have heavy rail is for boat trains, for which there is no market anymore.

As for the Thameslink services, the Maidstone East services would be extended, calling at Ashford International, Folkestone West, Central, East and Harbour. No new stock (should) be needed, although if it is, there are a couple of 700s in Dollands Moor. I have no idea why they're there.

 

[jopsuk]

As for the Thameslink services, the Maidstone East services would be extended, calling at Ashford International, Folkestone West, Central, East and Harbour. No new stock (should) be needed, although if it is, there are a couple of 700s in Dollands Moor. I have no idea why they're there.

The full planned Thameslink service is not yet running (and wasn't yet planned to be running even without the problems).

 

[RichJF]

As for the Thameslink services, the Maidstone East services would be extended, calling at Ashford International, Folkestone West, Central, East and Harbour. No new stock (should) be needed, although if it is, there are a couple of 700s in Dollands Moor. I have no idea why they're there.

I still think Folkestone is too far away for Thameslink. It's better for reliability to contain it to Ashford and give the Maidstone line over to Thameslink.

Folkestone badly needs the Harbour Arm regeneration. It's a project that will improve the town & bring an attraction to the seafront that has been run down for many years.

The 700s in Dollands Moor are for the fully expanded TL network that's not yet operational.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Folkestone Harbour station has recently been made into a footpath to bring people back to the Harbour Arm. However, wouldn't having a train station bring in more people? I think that the line and the station should be reopened as a train station for the Arm and a new junction to allow trains to not have to reverse that faces west built as well. Maybe even reopening Folkestone East as well (I mean, the platforms are still mostly intact including one shelter that's fully intact). I also think that the fast tracks at West would be reintroduced and the other island platform at Central reopened.

The services from FH would go like this:
- 1tph to London Charing Cross
-1tph to London St Pancras International
-1tph Folkestone Central shuttle
-(maybe) 1tph Thameslink service, as an extension to the Maidstone East service

What do you think?

Pointless

 

[Spartacus]

Pointless

Quite. It was already as quick to walk across town than wait for the train to reverse, never mind taxi if you didn't want to walk. Taking luggage to the ferry meant it was worth getting the train throughout, but the withdrawl of that meant the purpose for being went.

 

[DarloRich]

It is a lovely romantic idea but is there really any point? I can think of better things to spend the money on.

 

[fergusjbend]

The west-facing junction with the SE mainline leads to a reversing siding and thence to the harbour branch. This was designed as a safety precaution to prevent any train from approaching the branch at speed and being unable to slow down on the steep gradient to the harbour. Presumably the same considerations would apply today and make it very unlikely that the branch could be used for anything other than a shuttle to Folkestone Central.

 

[bussnapperwm]

For the extra services, the paths may not exist. Alternatively, you have to cancel services to other destinations, so who loses out? Even for the Thameslink extension, there is probably not enough stock. Whilst the area may be regenerated, I would say at best a shuttle to Folkestone East would be sufficient, which would more likely be a tram rather than heavy rail. The sole reason to have heavy rail is for boat trains, for which there is no market anymore.

Had it still been open, would a Class 139 shuttle to Central have worked for the Harbour branch?

 

[swt_passenger]

Had it still been open, would a Class 139 shuttle to Central have worked for the Harbour branch?

It was one of a few suggestions considered as part of the closure procedures. With no likelihood of any cross channel ferry services returning to the harbour the DfT, local authority and NR appeared to have quickly realised that closure was inevitable.

The time for this discussion would have been about 2014, the branch is a historic footnote now.

Anyone wishing to read the closure consultation, feedback and ratification can find them here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/folkestone-harbour-closure-of-branch-line-and-station

 

[Romilly]

In a recent published decision by the Information Commissioner, the current position of the Folkestone Harbour Company was explained as follows:

FHC explained that its current activities are much less than they have been in the past when Folkestone was the embarkation port for Sealink Ferries sailing across the Channel to France. They are now limited to running the small harbour at Folkestone and overseeing the fishing fleet of around 10 vessels and about 40 small craft which moor there. There has been no other commercial shipping business for over ten years.

That seems to reinforce the views of those who see no prospect of the rail-link re-opening.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

In a recent published decision by the Information Commissioner, the current position of the Folkestone Harbour Company was explained as follows:



That seems to reinforce the views of those who see no prospect of the rail-link re-opening.

The line was redundant , in real terms , after the cessation of regular trans Channel services. The odd use of the VSOE train was only sustainable in the short term. The condition of the branch was patchy and the area was in need of resignalling - at a cost of about £10M+

The closure process was led by an ex Folkestonian , who despite being sympathetic , realised there was no future.

 

[Harbornite]

Why bother? There's a reason why the line is not in use any more...

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Why bother? There's a reason why the line is not in use any more...

See above comments .....DBS of course challenged it , but then they would ....

 

[Harbornite]

See above comments .....DBS of course challenged it , but then they would ....

Indeed, I was just emphasising the point that the line had no real use any more.

 

[MarkyT]

How about a people mover! (I'll get my coat)

 

[swt_passenger]

How about a people mover! (I'll get my coat)

It was mentioned in the consultation, as per my earlier reply, post #15.

 

[B&I]

Might be an interesting spot for a heritage line, with a battery-converted tram or an old EMU running on it. Implausible, but I'm feeling imaginative in this sunny weather

 

[MarkyT]

It was mentioned in the consultation, as per my earlier reply, post #15.

I note that was specifically a Parry People Mover solution on rails with some shuttles extended via a retained junction along the main line to Folkestone Central for interchange. Complicated and costly I suspect! A fully independent light rail system might be easier with a bit of tramway extended along Marine Parade to the Leas lifts, but wouldn't have the main line interchange.

 

[Spartacus]

Might be an interesting spot for a heritage line, with a battery-converted tram or an old EMU running on it. Implausible, but I'm feeling imaginative in this sunny weather

I believe someone did want to run it as a heritage line, though they wanted to council to buy it, restore the infrastructure, then gift it to them. And I’d like the council to buy me a nice Jag XE.....

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Took a walk down it today - a good effort and an asset to the town. Probably a steady footfall exceeded in the days of a handfull of boat trains ....

 

[6Gman]

How about a people mover! (I'll get my coat)

What about a cable car?

They could move the one from Worcester.

 

[Harbornite]

What about a cable car?

They could move the one from Worcester.

Or just extend it!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Or just extend it!

Talk to Boris / Mayor Kahn - they have a seriously underused one "somewhere in East London" ...