Network Rail blasted over Dawlish sea wall death

[John Luxton]

This was a very sad accident. People have walked along the sea wall for years - the "all options" comment is worrying as it might mean a popular vantage point might end up being closed off as a kneejerk reaction.

Network Rail has been blasted ‘irresponsible’ after the death of a teenager who fell off the sea wall at Dawlish earlier this year. Fourteen-year-old Albina Yevko was killed falling four metres off the unprotected edge of the wall beside the railway line onto concrete below. Hundreds of people have signed an online petition calling for safety measures. Network Rail revealed today that a new risk assessment of the area is under way and ‘all options’ will be considered. Albina and her mother Inna moved to the UK after the Russian invasion of Ukraine and had settled well into life in the town, where Albina attended Dawlish College.

Network Rail blasted over Devon sea wall death

Albina Yevko's mum has demanded change after her 14-year-old daughter died of multiple injuries

www.devonlive.com

 

[richa2002]

Very sad but will no doubt result in the uglification of yet another pleasant location. Why people can't be held responsible for their own actions these days is beyond me but there we go, yet another aspect of miserable, modern living.

 

[HSTEd]

From the article

Cllr Dawson criticised Network Rail for saying it would be too expensive to create a safety railing along the wall “because £3.2 billion in pre-tax profit just isn’t enough for them.”

Has Network Rail ever made a profit that wasn't a Treasury accounting trick?

 

[Wolfie]

From the article

Has Network Rail ever made a profit that wasn't a Treasury accounting trick?

The archetypal big fish in a small pond. HMT won't give a flying **** what Councillor Non-entity Dawson thinks.

 

[EdChap]

Very sad but I do not believe what the Councillor says what Network Rail said. It simply does not ring true.

 

[swt_passenger]

The archetypal big fish in a small pond. HMT won't give a flying **** what Councillor Non-entity Dawson thinks.

Councillor Dawson’s council planning department will probably object to guardrails anyway, because Brunel didn’t use them…

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don't think this is just a railway thing. Several metre unfenced drops from sea walls onto beaches are the norm the whole country over (something I've always found odd, to be honest, just as I find it odd that the railway doesn't fence off all disused platform edges where passengers are present, e.g. the "offside" at Ulverston or the totally disused platforms at Liverpool Lime St or Kings X Suburban). Thus if this sets precedent that's a LOT of fencing that'll need doing.

Or do we fence Beachy Head? Stanage Edge? This could go on forever.

 

[yorkie]

A very sad incident, but we have to be realistic; people like Cllr Rosie Dawson are just not being sensible, pragmatic or proportionate.

It's not practicable, affordable or desirable to attempt to eliminate all risk.

 

[Kite159]

Other than to put up some-sort of safety fence along the length of the Dawlish sea wall (and also the Teignmouth sea wall) to protect people against the sudden drop, what more can Network Rail do (other than closing access to the sea wall? [Paint yellow hazard markers on the ground?]

Like @Bletchleyite mentioned, it's not just in Dawlish where there is a sea wall with a sudden drop towards the beach

 

[najaB]

People have walked along the sea wall for years - the "all options" comment is worrying as it might mean a popular vantage point might end up being closed off as a kneejerk reaction.

It may also mean that after considering all options they decide that all that's needed is a sign.

 

[LYRobert]

- - - - and platform edges. And what about canal locks - we've got one of them in Banbury at Castle Quay shopping mall.

 

[swt_passenger]

- - - - and platform edges. And what about canal locks - we've got one of them in Banbury at Castle Quay shopping mall.

There was definitely a contrived “issue” about that area when Castle Quay first opened. The lock itself gained a relatively low wall on the offside.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Other than to put up some-sort of safety fence along the length of the Dawlish sea wall (and also the Teignmouth sea wall) to protect people against the sudden drop, what more can Network Rail do (other than closing access to the sea wall? [Paint yellow hazard markers on the ground?]

Possibly a white line along the dangerous side? The story seems to relate to someone stumbling off it in the dark - white lines on platform edges exist for that reason.

 

[najaB]

Possibly a white line along the dangerous side? The story seems to relate to someone stumbling off it in the dark - white lines on platform edges exist for that reason.

Maybe some of those solar powered path marker lights?

 

[Doctor Fegg]

- - - - and platform edges. And what about canal locks - we've got one of them in Banbury at Castle Quay shopping mall.

There have been a lot of incidents at the Rochdale Nine locks in Manchester - several mitigations such as higher protective fencing have gone in.

 

[Killingworth]

A very sad incident, but we have to be realistic; people like Cllr Rosie Dawson are just not being sensible, pragmatic or proportionate.

It's not practicable, affordable or desirable to attempt to eliminate all risk.

And yet trip and slip lawyers will keep pushing so that increasingly expensive measures have to be put in place to reduce risk. Any railings then have to be maintained. Closure becomes a cheaper option to avoid potential legal liabilty!

 

[jupiter]

Then there is “history”. After an incident any decent lawyer will ask “has this happened before?”

If the answer is yes, the next question is “what did you do about it?”

Fairly sure the next answer shouldn’t be “nothing”.

 

[Deafdoggie]

A very sad incident, but we have to be realistic; people like Cllr Rosie Dawson are just not being sensible, pragmatic or proportionate.

It's not practicable, affordable or desirable to attempt to eliminate all risk.

Is the correct answer.

 

[Falcon1200]

A very sad incident, but as the family had lived in Dawlish for some time surely they were aware of the sea wall and its hazards? And as others have said, how far can protecting the public go; People do sadly fall into the sea, harbour, rivers (eg the tragic incident on the Wyre earlier this year) etc and lose their lives, does every single such location now have to be fenced off?

 

[yorksrob]

I think @Bletchleyite hits the nail on the head.

There must be thousands of miles of unfenced sea wall around the coast of the UK. It'll be a large undertaking to fence it all. Alternatively, that's a lot of coastline that could be closed off to walkers.

I can't see either option being carried out.

 

[ainsworth74]

Stick a white line on the edge, put up a couple of obvious warning signs at entrances to the sea wall and at the highest risk points perhaps some fencing. Jobs done.

It's quite clearly a horrible tragedy that this girl has died and it is right that ways of mitigating against the risk of a recurrence are looked at. I just hope that sensible heads prevail and put in place some minor alterations to reduce the risk rather than just ban access.

 

[Deafdoggie]

Stick a white line on the edge, put up a couple of obvious warning signs at entrances to the sea wall and at the highest risk points perhaps some fencing. Jobs done.

It's quite clearly a horrible tragedy that this girl has died and it is right that ways of mitigating against the risk of a recurrence are looked at. I just hope that sensible heads prevail and put in place some minor alterations to reduce the risk rather than just ban access.

Last time I was there (this summer) there were signs in place already. How much more can they do?

 

[ainsworth74]

Last time I was there (this summer) there were signs in place already. How much more can they do?

Paint a white line along the edge to aid visibility, assess whether some fencing might be appropriate at the highest risk places on the wall, perhaps install tactile paving as well along the edge to go with the white line? I don't know really, that would be a matter for the people doing the risk assessment. But it doesn't seem silly to undertake such an assessment and then make adjustments following that assessment. The answer could, of course be, that no changes are required but it strikes me that it's worth looking at and there's perhaps a few relevant changes that could be made.

 

[43096]

A very sad incident, but we have to be realistic; people like Cllr Rosie Dawson are just not being sensible, pragmatic or proportionate.

It's not practicable, affordable or desirable to attempt to eliminate all risk.

Maybe it is about time that “Personal Responsibility” legislation was passed into law to stop others being penalised for someone’s stupidity?

 

[Purple Train]

Paint a white line along the edge to aid visibility, assess whether some fencing might be appropriate at the highest risk places on the wall, perhaps install tactile paving as well along the edge to go with the white line? I don't know really, that would be a matter for the people doing the risk assessment. But it doesn't seem silly to undertake such an assessment and then make adjustments following that assessment. The answer could, of course be, that no changes are required but it strikes me that it's worth looking at and there's perhaps a few relevant changes that could be made.

Agreed. I think hiding away by saying that the unfortunate girl "should have taken responsibility for herself" is decidedly unfair on a person who is now unable to present her defence, and would just result in more tragic accidents. Equally, ALARP risk measurement stands for As Low As Reasonably Possible/Practicable (can't remember which); it's not as low as to be eliminated.

However, I cannot agree with people complaining about how fencing in certain places would "ruin" the beauty of the wall. Just some Victorian-style short iron railings would do, and they only need to be about two feet tall. You don't need to erect a ten-foot-tall modern electric palisade with rolls of barbed wire along the top.

 

[yorkie]

Last time I was there (this summer) there were signs in place already. How much more can they do?

For some people, nothing is ever "enough".

Here in York, every few years there is a tragic case of a young person drowning in the river and the families embarking on campaigns for more and more signs, barriers, lights etc. It can be very difficult for friends and family to accept, and it's not uncommon for them to feel a sense of duty to do something to try to prevent future incidents. But our judgement can be impaired when we are upset; that's just part of being human.

Maybe it is about time that “Personal Responsibility” legislation was passed into law to stop others being penalised for someone’s stupidity?

If only! Here in the UK there is no chance of that; we are probably further away from the concept of 'personal resposibility' than perhaps any other country in the world, and various attention seekers and money chasers are doing their best to make our lives even more restrictive; they will never be satisfied, and the more restrictions and measures we put in place, only encourages them to demand even more.

 

[ainsworth74]

Agreed. I think hiding away by saying that the unfortunate girl "should have taken responsibility for herself" is decidedly unfair on a person who is now unable to present her defence, and would just result in more tragic accidents. Equally, ALARP risk measurement stands for As Low As Reasonably Possible/Practicable (can't remember which); it's not as low as to be eliminated.

Precisely, we don't need to go crackers and close the sea wall, install floodlights, employ bouncers or anything quite like that. But simply have a look at what simple, low cost and generally unobtrusive might reduce any obvious risk that's not been controlled for. Again the answer could well be there's nothing else we can do. But I suspect the actual answer will be paint a white line on the edge. Thousands and thousands of people walk the sea wall every week and nearly all without any incident. The risk is already clearly very low doesn't mean we can't make a few minor changes to reduce it further without negatively impacting on the amenity that the wall provides.

However, I cannot agree with people complaining about how fencing in certain places would "ruin" the beauty of the wall. Just some Victorian-style short iron railings would do, and they only need to be about two feet tall. You don't need to erect a ten-foot-tall modern electric palisade with rolls of barbed wire along the top.

Yes that's certainly the sort of thing I had in mind if it's warranted at any point on the sea wall.

 

[Purple Train]

Precisely, we don't need to go crackers and close the sea wall, install floodlights, employ bouncers or anything quite like that. But simply have a look at what simple, low cost and generally unobtrusive might reduce any obvious risk that's not been controlled for. Again the answer could well be there's nothing else we can do. But I suspect the actual answer will be paint a white line on the edge. Thousands and thousands of people walk the sea wall every week and nearly all without any incident. The risk is already clearly very low doesn't mean we can't make a few minor changes to reduce it further without negatively impacting on the amenity that the wall provides.

I presume that the incident occurred at night (I didn't see any details about the incident in the news article behind all the adverts) - how many people do use the sea wall in darkness?

 

[Bletchleyite]

However, I cannot agree with people complaining about how fencing in certain places would "ruin" the beauty of the wall. Just some Victorian-style short iron railings would do, and they only need to be about two feet tall. You don't need to erect a ten-foot-tall modern electric palisade with rolls of barbed wire along the top.

I don't know how bad that bit of Dawlish is for being washed over, but I do note that the decorative railings on top of the new Dawlish wall at the stations have in quite a few places been smashed to bits by washed-up rocks.

I presume that the incident occurred at night (I didn't see any details about the incident in the news article behind all the adverts) - how many people do use the sea wall in darkness?

And of those people, how many don't have a mobile phone with a torch on it?

The article doesn't give much detail but I did see something in it that implied it was at night, I can't recall what though, perhaps a comment about it being unlit?

 

[najaB]

Maybe it is about time that “Personal Responsibility” legislation was passed into law to stop others being penalised for someone’s stupidity?

No. For one thing, who decides that an injury or death is a result of 'stupidity'?