No flexi season ticket from Crewe to Milton Keynes?

[MalaiseForever]

Hi all,

Is anybody able to shed light on why there is no Flexi season ticket between Crewe and Milton Keynes? I was under the impression you could buy a Flexi season for any route, but clearly this is not the case.

I have tried to find out from London Northwestern Railway and Avanti to no avail, they are both either unable or unwilling to answer. Same goes for my corporate season ticket portal, they don't know either.

Any insight into the situation would be gratefully received.

Many thanks

 

[Bletchleyite]

Generally seasons are for shorter distance journeys. There won't be a flexi-season for e.g. Manchester-London either, though I seem to recall there is a weekly.

 

[JonathanH]

Is anybody able to shed light on why there is no Flexi season ticket between Crewe and Milton Keynes?

The multiple of seven day season to anytime return for both the 'via Rugby' and 'WMR / LNR only' flows is less than 2 so the flexi season would be more expensive than a monthly season ticket.

 

[jfollows]

Because the other season tickets Crewe-Milton Keynes are already discounted more than the "Flexi' season ticket would be:
Standard Open Return £187.80
1 month season £775.30
"via Rugby” ie Avanti services

 

[Watershed]

Hi all,

Is anybody able to shed light on why there is no Flexi season ticket between Crewe and Milton Keynes? I was under the impression you could buy a Flexi season for any route, but clearly this is not the case.

I have tried to find out from London Northwestern Railway and Avanti to no avail, they are both either unable or unwilling to answer. Same goes for my corporate season ticket portal, they don't know either.

Any insight into the situation would be gratefully received.

Many thanks

It's down to the relative cost of the existing full-time season ticket and the Anytime Return - and essentially the fact that a Flexi Season would be more expensive than a full-time season ticket. The distance, as @Bletchleyite suggested, has nothing to do with it; there are some very long distance Flexi Seasons available.

I explain fully in this post, but Flexi Seasons are priced based on a default discount of 12.5% per journey compared to the equivalent Anytime Return. In this case that would be £164.325 per journey for the 'via Rugby' (interavailable) fare, or £69.0375 per journey for the cheaper 'WMR & LNR only' fare. That would mean the (8 day) Flexi Seasons would cost £1314.60 and £552.30, respectively.

Now, the monthly season tickets cost £775.30 (via Rugby) and £539.60 (LNR only). So clearly it would be nonsensical to sell a ticket costing £1314.60 which is valid for 8 days' travel within 28 days, when for £775.30 you can buy a ticket valid for an entire month. Ditto with the LNR ticket.

Ultimately this is down to the rather stingy 12.5% discount on offer for Flexi Seasons - in combination with the fact that Anytime Returns on this journey are ludicrously expensive (whilst only the season tickets are priced at a more reasonable level). The latter is despite the fact that there are virtually no journeys where it would ever make sense to buy an Anytime Return, as an Anytime Single for the outward journey and Off-Peak Single for the return would be much cheaper, since there are no evening restrictions on the Off-Peak fare.

Nevertheless, the pricing for Flexi Seasons is blindly based on the cost of an Anytime Return and therefore there is no Flexi Season is available for this journey.

 

[mmh]

Generally seasons are for shorter distance journeys. There won't be a flexi-season for e.g. Manchester-London either, though I seem to recall there is a weekly.

This is not correct. I've had a Llanfairfechan to London season ticket, and a former colleague had an Edinburgh to London season.

 

[Haywain]

a former colleague had an Edinburgh to London season.

There hasn't been an Edinburgh to London season for the last 20 years.

 

[mmh]

There hasn't been an Edinburgh to London season for the last 20 years.

Hmm, are you sure about that? I think it was in 2004. It could only have been between 2001 and 2005 given the dates we worked together.

Regardless, it is still incorrect that seasons are only available for "shorter" journeys (whatever they are), and the OP has an answer to his question.

 

[Haywain]

Hmm, are you sure about that? I think it was in 2004.

Certain. When I joined what is now LNER in 2001 the longest distance season on the East Coast route from London was to Berwick-upon-Tweed, and that has remained the case ever since.

 

[Watershed]

Certain. When I joined what is now LNER in 2001 the longest distance season on the East Coast route from London was to Berwick-upon-Tweed, and that has remained the case ever since.

There are also no Edinburgh-London season tickets in the NFM64 (September 1996) fares data. Now, it's theoretically possible that they existed at some point before this, or after 1996 and before 2001. But it's exceptionally unlikely.

 

[jfollows]

When the Flexi thing was first announced I looked into it out of interest for Wilmslow-London, same as for Crewe-Milton Keynes, no way. A month's season ticket Wilmslow-London (£1500.70) costs 4.3 times the standard open return fare (£349.80). This sort of ratio has always been pretty much the case for season tickets for this journey; once in my life I might have thought about doing it but now I've grown old and sensible there's no way I would!

EDIT The Crewe-Milton Keynes ratio is even better at just over 4x the cost for a monthly ticket versus one open return.

 

[realemil]

When the Flexi thing was first announced I looked into it out of interest for Wilmslow-London, same as for Crewe-Milton Keynes, no way. A month's season ticket Wilmslow-London (£1500.70) costs 4.3 times the standard open return fare (£349.80). This sort of ratio has always been pretty much the case for season tickets for this journey; once in my life I might have thought about doing it but now I've grown old and sensible there's no way I would!

EDIT The Crewe-Milton Keynes ratio is even better at just over 4x the cost for a monthly ticket versus one open return.

I'm not sure what your point is that you're attempting to make?

If a person travels every 5 out of 7 days, in their 1-month period of the season ticket, they save a lot of money?

The 'standard open return' ticket only entitles you to one journey in each direction versus a season ticket which gives you unlimited journeys between both points.

Me traveling 5 days a week would cost me £1749 per week, one ticket per day, compared to the £1500.70 fare which gives me, unlimited travel for a month.

 

[jfollows]

The point we're all making, repeatedly, is that the Flexi season isn't anywhere near as "good" as the politicians made it out to be - and, specifically, if one were offered from Wilmslow to London it'd cost about £2,450 for 8 days in a month whereas the existing season ticket rate for 31 return journeys (or more) if you're so minded in a month is almost £1,000 cheaper at £1,500.70. So there isn't a Flexi season ticket for Wilmslow-London, just like there isn't for Crewe-Milton Keynes which is what the OP asked.

So for anyone travelling 8 days in a month, the monthly season ticket is the cheapest option in these cases.

And for anyone travelling ~20 days in a month, 5 days every week, the same price offers a theoretical daily rate of even less.

And, equally, there are routes for which the Flexi season might work:
Wilmslow-Manchester 1 month £157.90
Wilmslow-Manchester 8 days out of 28 days £70.50
WIlmslow-Manchester 8 days anytime day return £75.20

Personally, I'd still go for the £75.20 option and buy a ticket each day I travelled, because the saving isn't worth the hassle. But for some people there might be a small saving.

 

[mmh]

There are also no Edinburgh-London season tickets in the NFM64 (September 1996) fares data. Now, it's theoretically possible that they existed at some point before this, or after 1996 and before 2001. But it's exceptionally unlikely.

There are also no Edinburgh-London season tickets in the NFM64 (September 1996) fares data. Now, it's theoretically possible that they existed at some point before this, or after 1996 and before 2001. But it's exceptionally unlikely.

Got to love the forum at times, insistent that you didn't do something 25 years ago which you know you did.

 

[Watershed]

Got to love the forum at times, insistent that you didn't do something 25 years ago which you know you did.

I'm not saying that it didn't happen, just that it's not in the fares data. So if someone was sold an Edinburgh to London season it would have been custom priced, as with a season ticket from one side of London to the other with zonal validity.

 

[Starmill]

Custom seasons were probably a lot more common before about 2000. Before the advent of digital retailing it used to be broadly permitted for ticket offices to issue things that were sensible even if the paper manuals didn't give a price. The most common example is probably first class on journeys where no fares were ever set, despite the accommodation being provided, such as the as Hull to Crewe.

Custom Travelcards are even available still today. Also there's a 7 Day from London to St Ives, if you really want one.

 

[Deerfold]

Hmm, are you sure about that? I think it was in 2004. It could only have been between 2001 and 2005 given the dates we worked together.

Regardless, it is still incorrect that seasons are only available for "shorter" journeys (whatever they are), and the OP has an answer to his question.

They didn't just keep buying ALRs did they? The current season ticket to Berwick isn't much cheaper than doing that - and ALRs used to be virtually restrictionless.
I used to have a season London to Leeds which, if I'd been paying full price would have been about 60% of the price of doing that.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Got to love the forum at times, insistent that you didn't do something 25 years ago which you know you did.

Are you sure you didn't have an All Line Rover ? it would most likely have been cheaper

 

[MalaiseForever]

Thanks for the all discussion folks. Some interesting points which make sense and have answered my question. I’ll just get the monthly one and make more use of it than twice a week.

 

[Deerfold]

Are you sure you didn't have an All Line Rover ? it would most likely have been cheaper

Is there an echo in here?

 

[Haywain]

Got to love the forum at times, insistent that you didn't do something 25 years ago which you know you did.

Nobody is saying you couldn't have had a Llanfairfechan to London season, but we are saying your colleague can't have had an Edinburgh to London season.

 

[Jan Mayen]

I'm sure I read in the Guinness Book of Records that the longest season ticket was Inverness to London. This was back in the 1970's mind you.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Is there an echo in here?

Sorry didn't read your pst before posting.