Northern Ad hoc cancellations

[northwichcat]

Nothing unusual with that line being the first in line to get axed. Typical use when it runs probably will fit comfortably in a taxi

I can't find the posts but there were some people questionning whether Northern bother with replacement transport when they don't run the services, so I thought I'd post it while it was showing on Journey Check.

 

[yorksrob]

This is the second time this week my train's been cancelled.

Has another signalman gone missing in Barnsley ?

 

[Exiled Lanc]

This is the second time this week my train's been cancelled.

Has another signalman gone missing in Barnsley ?

ASLEF overtime ban Dec 1st - Dec 9th, possibly the reason.

 

[yorksrob]

ASLEF overtime ban Dec 1st - Dec 9th, possibly the reason.

Possibly.

Mine seems to be a popular one for the chop generally.

 

[Rail Quest]

ASLEF overtime ban Dec 1st - Dec 9th, possibly the reason.

The 06:30 Chester to Stockport has been cancelled all week so far and I'm assuming this is the cause. It ran without issues the past couple of weeks after months of literally never running

 

[Danfilm007]

The 06:30 Chester to Stockport has been cancelled all week so far and I'm assuming this is the cause. It ran without issues the past couple of weeks after months of literally never running

Strangely they are running the 2nd morning Stockport more regularly now - for a while it seemed neither would run!

 

[northwichcat]

Strangely they are running the 2nd morning Stockport more regularly now - for a while it seemed neither would run!

When they removed the second one from the timetable it led to a lot of compliants from parents about children having to arrive at school before the gates opened, or alternatively arrive late.

 

[td97]

Most useless service of the year award goes to Northern, running a Blackpool to Manchester Airport service as Oxford Rd to Piccadilly only... and 33 minutes late

Realtime Trains | 1Y61 2143 Manchester Oxford Road to Manchester Piccadilly | 15/12/2023

Real-time train running information for 1Y61 2143 departure from Manchester Oxford Road to Manchester Piccadilly on 15/12/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

A very poor performance on the Manchester Airport to Blackpool North line, with 10 full cancellations per direction and the last northbound service of the day at 2148 (2217 is curtailed to start at Piccadilly). 2248, 2317 and 2346 all fully cancelled.

Update, at 2252 Northern managed to reinstate the 2346 from Piccadilly (0009) to Preston only.

 

[RAPC]

Blackpool to Manchester has been struggling most of the week. Staff said it was hit more than usual due to a lack of 331s, as well as the more regular staff availability issues. I travelled a couple of times earlier this week and peak trains were short formed with 3 carriages instead of 6, which were full and standing even when services around them were running. Glad I missed the times when 3 carriages instead of 6 were running and with earlier services cancelled too.

 

[northwichcat]

Most useless service of the year award goes to Northern, running a Blackpool to Manchester Airport service as Oxford Rd to Piccadilly only... and 33 minutes late

Looks like it ran from Blackpool to Manchester Oxford Road but as an empty movement. Presumably no guard?

I'd guess a crew change was planned at Oxford Road but as it was so late the service was then terminated at Piccadilly to recover time.

Although, a bit pointless when a Southport train terminated at the adjacent platform 1 minute earlier. So a bit tight for anyone trying to make a connection!

 

[Bantamzen]

Well this week on the Aire and Wharfe triangle has been an utter you-know-what-show. Admittedly there have been problems with flooding and the wiring. But even with these on mind the time it has taken to get anywhere near recovery has been shocking. And today even without major issues Northern are doing their up most best to mess things up with a Skipton train sitting on front of an Ilkley train waiting for a member of crew.

Honestly, the time may well have come that I have to stop relying on trains because they have become less predictable than the weather...

 

[317 forever]

Blackpool to Manchester has been struggling most of the week. Staff said it was hit more than usual due to a lack of 331s, as well as the more regular staff availability issues. I travelled a couple of times earlier this week and peak trains were short formed with 3 carriages instead of 6, which were full and standing even when services around them were running. Glad I missed the times when 3 carriages instead of 6 were running and with earlier services cancelled too.

I don't know whether this train was supposed to be 3 carriages or 6. It's just that my 7.33 from Manchester Piccadilly to Bolton on Saturday November 25th - part of a Manchester Airport to Blackpool North train - was just 3 carriages.

 

[Kite159]

It's not just Northern which is suffering from a large number of cancellations. I was on a 196 last night towards Worcester and the 'onward connection' screen at Droitwich was showing 6 services, 5 of which were cancelled. This was nearly 10pm.

 

[Jamesrob637]

It's not just Northern which is suffering from a large number of cancellations. I was on a 196 last night towards Worcester and the 'onward connection' screen at Droitwich was showing 6 services, 5 of which were cancelled. This was nearly 10pm.

Maybe this thread should extend beyond Northern

 

[Urban-Savage]

Northern have been particularly dreadful today
Barely managed to run a service out / into Liverpool today
Ridiculous long gaps between any train that did actually manage to run
This really can’t continue to be acceptable
Even during the week it’s barely functional. I’ve actually lost track of all my delay repays lol

 

[BPN2022]

Northern have been particularly dreadful today
Barely managed to run a service out / into Liverpool today
Ridiculous long gaps between any train that did actually manage to run
This really can’t continue to be acceptable
Even during the week it’s barely functional. I’ve actually lost track of all my delay repays lol

Probably linked to the Sunday issues, before Christmas and small matter of Liverpool v Man Utd

 

[td97]

Northern have been particularly dreadful today
Barely managed to run a service out / into Liverpool today
Ridiculous long gaps between any train that did actually manage to run

Hardly anything has run on these routes listed on Journeycheck. The other North West routes haven't fared much better.

• Cancellations to services between Blackpool South and Colne
  
  Cancellations to services between Manchester Victoria and Clitheroe
  
  Cancellations to services between Blackpool North and Liverpool Lime Street
  
  Cancellations to services between Blackpool North and Preston
  
  Cancellations to services between Manchester Oxford Road and Liverpool Lime Street via Warrington Central
  
  Cancellations to services between Preston and Blackpool South
  
  Cancellations to services between Manchester Victoria and Southport
  
  Cancellations to services between Bolton and Preston
  
  Cancellations to services between Manchester Victoria and Blackburn via Todmorden

It's a complete failure of management and stakeholders that this issue has persisted for so long (5+ years), yet is still unfixed. Especially frustrating for passengers that the recent conductor pay rise is for maintaining the status quo rather than implementing some sort of Sunday working agreement (of course, I would expect a higher % pay rise for this).

I started a thread 2 years ago which is the same story repeated. That thread quotes another one dating to 2018.

Northern unable to deliver Sunday service

Title says it all. Recent Sundays, especially since the timetable change, have been atrocious for travel across North West Northern routes. All Manchester to Wigan via Bolton/Westhoughton cancelled. Manchester to Southport via Atherton and Clitheroe trimmed back to 5 services each of which only...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Moonshot]

Hardly anything has run on these routes listed on Journeycheck. The other North West routes haven't fared much better.


It's a complete failure of management and stakeholders that this issue has persisted for so long (5+ years), yet is still unfixed. Especially frustrating for passengers that the recent conductor pay rise is for maintaining the status quo rather than implementing some sort of Sunday working agreement (of course, I would expect a higher % pay rise for this).

I started a thread 2 years ago which is the same story repeated. That thread quotes another one dating to 2018.

Northern unable to deliver Sunday service

Title says it all. Recent Sundays, especially since the timetable change, have been atrocious for travel across North West Northern routes. All Manchester to Wigan via Bolton/Westhoughton cancelled. Manchester to Southport via Atherton and Clitheroe trimmed back to 5 services each of which only...

www.railforums.co.uk

Absolutely no incentive for guards to work Sundays

 

[td97]

Absolutely no incentive for guards to work Sundays

I know, especially with better paid RDW midweek, and that the backdated 2022 pay rise lump sum has recently landed in bank accounts.

 

[jonnyfan]

I can imagine an emergency timetable will be needed for Xmas eve and new year's eve for Northern services in the North West, guard availability will be at rock bottom.

 

[Geeves]

If they had sense they would've paid the outstanding backpay as a separate payment on the 1st because virtually everything is going to be taxed to hell OT wise so what is the point of agreeing to work?

If you believe the rumours next years pay deal includes Sundays being brought into the working week on all grades with what ever pay rise that would entail.

We will see.

 

[AMD]

I would note that the union asked if there was to be any additional payment for working the 24th this year, as has happened at least once in the past, however a senior manager came out with a point blank no. The only conductors in (on the west) next Sunday will be the usual 'grabbers' or management.

 

[northwichcat]

I would note that the union asked if there was to be any additional payment for working the 24th this year, as has happened at least once in the past

That statement could do with some context. Are you talking about 2006 or 2017? Since the original Northern franchise was formed, those are the only years when Christmas Eve has fallen on a Sunday. It skipped Sunday once due to how a leap year fell.

Just looking at the Mid Cheshire line for next Sunday it's currently showing the last service in both directions not operating, but other services operating as normal - Sunday services start around 3 hours later than Mon-Sat services.

 

[43066]

I would note that the union asked if there was to be any additional payment for working the 24th this year, as has happened at least once in the past, however a senior manager came out with a point blank no. The only conductors in (on the west) next Sunday will be the usual 'grabbers' or management.

£100 additional for booking on xmas eve or NYE this year where I am (admittedly that’s for drivers, guards may be less). Odd that similar isn’t in place across the board.

 

[Jamesrob637]

That statement could do with some context. Are you talking about 2006 or 2017? Since the original Northern franchise was formed, those are the only years when Christmas Eve has fallen on a Sunday. It skipped Sunday once due to how a leap year fell.

Just looking at the Mid Cheshire line for next Sunday it's currently showing the last service in both directions not operating, but other services operating as normal - Sunday services start around 3 hours later than Mon-Sat services.

As normal as that line can get for a Sunday...

 

[LowLevel]

£100 additional for booking on xmas eve or NYE this year where I am (admittedly that’s for drivers, guards may be less). Odd that similar isn’t in place across the board.

Same payment for all front line grades as far as I know.

 

[northwichcat]

As normal as that line can get for a Sunday...

What I was meaning is it's less services than usual to cover for 24 December, with no-one needed to take out trains (in service) at around 6am and the early finish just meaning one service in each direction goes, as Sundays normally have an early finish.

£100 additional for booking on xmas eve or NYE this year where I am (admittedly that’s for drivers, guards may be less). Odd that similar isn’t in place across the board.

With 24 December being a Sunday it's not in my normal work week (I don't work on the railways). However, if my employer said I could have £100 extra for doing a 24 Dec shift (on top of being paid for working the Sunday) I'd bite their hand off and make sure I had it in writing before accepting - as it would sound too good to be true.

 

[43066]

Same payment for all front line grades as far as I know.

Good to hear - just as it should be!

With 24 December being a Sunday it's not in my normal work week (I don't work on the railways). However, if my employer said I could have £100 extra for doing a 24 Dec shift (on top of being paid for working the Sunday) I'd bite their hand off and make sure I had it in writing before accepting - as it would sound too good to be true.

It’s common in all sorts of industries to incentivise people to work overtime, work anti social hours etc. I’m not sure why people expect the railway to be any different.

However inevitably people will also want to spend time with loved ones/friends over the festive season, so there is a need for more of an incentive at this time of year - especially where the employer has chosen to keep Sundays outside the working week thus being entirely reliant on overtime to provide the service, as seems to be the case with Northern. It would be interesting to know whether the refusal to provide an incentive comes from management or the DfT.

 

[Llandudno]

I can imagine an emergency timetable will be needed for Xmas eve and new year's eve for Northern services in the North West, guard availability will be at rock bottom.

I suspect last minute rail replacement buses and taxis will be somewhat problematic to source on Christmas Eve and New Year’s Eve….

 

[trainophile]

As least we know we're safe from more strikes until the end of the year now it's less than 14 days away. Presumably that includes overtime bans, although obviously we're at the mercy of people being prepared to volunteer for it.