Northern/TPE Platform Extensions

[northwichcat]

There's not even enough 333s to run all the services they were ordered for though. ....
In any case the 333s might not be on their current Airedale/Wharfedale routes in the longer term if usage continues to grow, due to the fact that platforms 1&2 at Shipley can't realistically be extended beyond 6x23m.

Wouldn't a fleet of around 16 units be around the right number for an hourly Manchester-Hull semi-fast, an hourly Manchester-Selby semi-fast and 2 x Huddersfield-Leeds stoppers per hour, allowing for maintenance? And I imagine Metro would want them re-deployed on other Leeds area services if they were to be moved off their current routes.

 

[BantamMenace]

In any case the 333s might not be on their current Airedale/Wharfedale routes in the longer term if usage continues to grow, due to the fact that platforms 1&2 at Shipley can't realistically be extended beyond 6x23m. If services of this length are required regularly then either the 333s need to lose the 4th car or they need to be deployed elsewhere with something coming in to replace them. 323s would be ideal (indeed the original Airedale/Wharfedale electrification plans proposed a further order of 323s that might have saved the Hunslet plant in Leeds) and would bring them 'home'.

If the platforms at shipley could be extended over the bridge then they could easily be doubled in length to around 200m.
Hopefully the harrogate line will be electrified within the next 8-10 years so the 333s can go there and operate a loop-like diagram going Leeds to York via Harrogate and back via Garforth and vice versa. Then with platform lengthening to allow 6-car trains on the Airedale & Wharfedale lines a new fleet of 3 car emus can be ordered to operate from leeds on most electric services including to doncaster, huddersfield, hull, selby, skipton, bradford and ilkley.

 

[noddingdonkey]

I think it's too early to be certain about what TP will get.
There are 3 options: (a) more 319s;

Surely 319s wouldn't be a high enough quality unit for a pseudo-Intercity service like TPE? Something that hasn't even got aircon is a comedown from the 185s

 

[61653 HTAFC]

If the platforms at shipley could be extended over the bridge then they could easily be doubled in length to around 200m.

The Issue at Shipley is in particular platform 2, the length of which is limited by the junctions for the two sides of the triangle heading towards Bradford. It could be solved but would be ridiculously expensive.

Hopefully the harrogate line will be electrified within the next 8-10 years so the 333s can go there and operate a loop-like diagram going Leeds to York via Harrogate and back via Garforth and vice versa. Then with platform lengthening to allow 6-car trains on the Airedale & Wharfedale lines a new fleet of 3 car emus can be ordered to operate from leeds on most electric services including to doncaster, huddersfield, hull, selby, skipton, bradford and ilkley.

One advantage of running the Harrogate services as a Leeds-Leeds loop would possibly be to make more use of the two North/East facing bays at Leeds. This would also prevent the problems of running a 'true' circular service. There would still be a requirement for some to turn back at Knaresborough though, unless the line was doubled from there to York.

To get vaguely back on topic, by the end of CP6 with the knitting all strung up, I could possibly see the 333s being used on Leeds-Doncaster and Leeds-Sheffield via Wakefield Westgate/Rotherham (assuming Sheffield-Moorthorpe junction is done as an add-on) given that Travel South Yorkshire helped keep the 4th cars.
That wouldn't use all 16 though, so I'd expect them to continue on some Airedale/Wharfedale diagrams along with stoppers to Huddersfield/Selby and the Harrogate line assuming that gets wired too. the 321/322s may be sent to join their cousins down south, or more likely stay to work the same diagrams as the 333s (even possibly along with a few extra 321s if they become available).

As for any 3-car units that might be needed to allow 6-car formations, a new order might be the best way forward. There aren't many options from existing stock without shortening some 317/319/321s (with additional work being required at least in the case of 319s and presumably the others too). I mentioned earlier that it'd be nice for the 323s to come 'home' but that's really just romanticism- in reality both Birmingham and Manchester will be fighting over them. Just a shame there weren't more of them built!