Planning a trip across Great Britain - general questions

[aem7ac]

Hello,
I would like to apologize if this is the wrong thread to ask this in.
I am currently planning a trip in mid June that will take me across England and Scotland by rail for roughly a week.
As a tourist from the states, I am trying to make plans for some additional time I have listed as spare.
I currently am spending a day in London for general tourist sites. The next day I am heading to Doncaster/York via LNER for InterCity 225s, before moving north to Edinburgh the following morning. I will spend a night in Dundee, trying to document ScotRail's Inter7City short-form HSTs. After that, I plan to take the Caledonian Sleeper south from Glasgow Central back to London Euston, leaving 2 free days in the London area before I return to the US.
I'm trying to plan additionally to at least attempt and see the following:
-Chiltern 68/Mk3+DVT Sets
-Class 73s
-Class 90s
-Class 373s
-Class 319s
Any tips on how to possibly fit these into my pre-existing itinerary? Any recommendations on best chances and spots to find any of these in the London area if applicable?
Thank you.

 

[Iskra]

If you get the Highland sleeper from the Aberdeen Line or Inverness lines, you will probably pay a similar fare, but you will be additionally hauled by Caledonian Sleeper class 73/9 locomotives (probably a pair, but sometimes one 73/9 and one other locomotive such as a class 66/67/47). Then the locomotives change over to class 92 at Edinburgh. If you would like to see and indeed ride behind a 73, this would be a great way of doing it

Also, you may need more than one day in London for the tourist sites or to recover from an Eastbound Transatlantic and the jet lag.

 

[aem7ac]

If you get the Highland sleeper from the Aberdeen Line or Inverness lines, you will probably pay a similar fare, but you will be additionally hauled by Caledonian Sleeper class 73/9 locomotives (probably a pair, but sometimes one 73/9 and one other locomotive such as a class 66/67/47). Then the locomotives change over to class 92 at Edinburgh. If you would like to see and indeed ride behind a 73, this would be a great way of doing it

Also, you may need more than one day in London for the tourist sites or to recover from an Eastbound Transatlantic and the jet lag.

Thank you! I neglected to mention I do have two days in London before I depart north. My mistake.
I've already booked my Caledonian Sleeper reservation out of Glasgow on the lowland, unfortunately. Hopefully I can see the Highland Sleeper or at least its power stabled while I am in Scotland.

 

[Iskra]

Thank you! I neglected to mention I do have two days in London before I depart north. My mistake.
I've already booked my Caledonian Sleeper reservation out of Glasgow on the lowland, unfortunately. Hopefully I can see the Highland Sleeper or at least its power stabled while I am in Scotland.

If you contact Caledonian Sleeper, I'm sure they'd help you rebook onto one of the Highland legs if that's what you wanted, they are usually quite helpful.

 

[Intercity110]

For class 90s you’ll need the west coast’s freight (the one out of euston to glasgow).

 

[30907]

AIUI LNR class 319 are due to come off-lease on 31 May, so your best chance is Liverpool-Wigan, which is a fair trek from either York or London.

Not up on class 90, but there's plenty of freight in the Wembley area on the WCML.

373s are regular on Eurostar but set swaps are frequent so it's pot luck. You can see them from the upper concourse at St P, or en route to Ashford.

And not much Chiltern 68 working from May - 2 diagrams only

 

[aem7ac]

AIUI LNR class 319 are due to come off-lease on 31 May, so your best chance is Liverpool-Wigan, which is a fair trek from either York or London.

Not up on class 90, but there's plenty of freight in the Wembley area on the WCML.

373s are regular on Eurostar but set swaps are frequent so it's pot luck. You can see them from the upper concourse at St P, or en route to Ashford.

And not much Chiltern 68 working from May - 2 diagrams only

Any clue what 2 diagrams those may be? Thank you!

 

[aem7ac]

For class 90s you’ll need the west coast’s freight (the one out of euston to glasgow).

Thank you!

 

[hexagon789]

Any clue what 2 diagrams those may be? Thank you!

Rail Tour Info keeps lists of current loco-hauled workings, these are the Chiltern ones: http://www.railtourinfo.co.uk/locohauled8a.html

 

[aem7ac]

Thank you everyone for all the help and resources.
I wanted to ask about a few more things.
Would Wembley generally be a good spot for photographing WCML freight action? After a bit more research I think it is possible to get Freightliner 90s there along with other operators.
Would also like to try to find something EWS liveried. I learned from another thread earlier today that there are roughly 80 or more DB 66s still in EWS livery, so I am trying to fit a good spot for DB Cargo workings that are 66-hauled that could fit easily into my itinerary.
Any tips on possible 37s? I see they are mostly on ROG passenger stock moves, so it may be more of a chance working.
Same question about Class 20s. Don't know if they work much anymore but if I recall DRS had some at least until fairly recent.
Additionally, is there anywhere I can find Class 325 workings?
Sorry if any inaccuracies above, I don't know that much specific about trains across the pond.
I apologize for all the questions.
Thank you in advance!

 

[30907]

I don't know North West London, but I'm fairly sure Wembley Cehtral itself is poor, but some of the stations on the Overground route out towards Watford, or footbridges near them, would be a better bet. I hope other members can improve on that!

 

[Iskra]

Thank you everyone for all the help and resources.
I wanted to ask about a few more things.
Would Wembley generally be a good spot for photographing WCML freight action? After a bit more research I think it is possible to get Freightliner 90s there along with other operators.
Would also like to try to find something EWS liveried. I learned from another thread earlier today that there are roughly 80 or more DB 66s still in EWS livery, so I am trying to fit a good spot for DB Cargo workings that are 66-hauled that could fit easily into my itinerary.
Any tips on possible 37s? I see they are mostly on ROG passenger stock moves, so it may be more of a chance working.
Same question about Class 20s. Don't know if they work much anymore but if I recall DRS had some at least until fairly recent.
Sorry if any inaccuracies above, I don't know that much specific about trains across the pond.
Thank you in advance!

Class 37's also feature on railtours quite commonly (often assisting steam locomotives), so checking the Railway Herald website railtours section may help you there. Alternatively, there are often 37’s parked up on the West side of Doncaster station or at the South West of York station. They feature prominently on Network Rail test trains; subsequently there are loads parked up at the NR base at Derby along with HST power cars.

325’s are mainly on the West Coast although you may see one stabled at Tyne Yard South of Newcastle.

Class 20’s are now retired with DRS, there are a handful still in use on the network but mainly occasionally on railtours or at very specific locations. A preserved line may be your best bet for a class 20.

 

[aem7ac]

Class 37's also feature on railtours quite commonly (often assisting steam locomotives), so checking the Railway Herald website railtours section may help you there. Alternatively, there are often 37’s parked up on the West side of Doncaster station or at the South West of York station. They feature prominently on Network Rail test trains; subsequently there are loads parked up at the NR base at Derby along with HST power cars.

325’s are mainly on the West Coast although you may see one stabled at Tyne Yard South of Newcastle.

Class 20’s are now retired with DRS, there are a handful still in use on the network but mainly occasionally on railtours or at very specific locations. A preserved line may be your best bet for a class 20.

That makes the 37s quite a lot easier for me. Good to know. Thank you!
For the WCML 325s, would those pass the spots on the Overground network?

I don't know North West London, but I'm fairly sure Wembley Cehtral itself is poor, but some of the stations on the Overground route out towards Watford, or footbridges near them, would be a better bet. I hope other members can improve on that!

Thank you! I'll look around for some other spots toward Watford.

 

[Snapper37]

If you have not come across real time trains then check out this website. https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/

Will display freight and mail trains and some operators will show allocated power. Will give you a good idea of what is around.

 

[Ken H]

That makes the 37s quite a lot easier for me. Good to know. Thank you!
For the WCML 325s, would those pass the spots on the Overground network?

Thank you! I'll look around for some other spots toward Watford.

Thrre is a footbridge over the west coast line near Stonebridge Park here
Dropped pin

51°32'53.7"N 0°17'23.8"W · 51.548240, -0.289938

maps.app.goo.gl

Dont hang around there too late into the evening. Nearest station is Wembley Station on the line out of Marylebone.

Crosses the Watford DC lines, the West Coast Line and a big tube depot.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

That makes the 37s quite a lot easier for me. Good to know. Thank you!
For the WCML 325s, would those pass the spots on the Overground network?

Thank you! I'll look around for some other spots toward Watford.

Previous threads mention South Kenton - island platform , staffed station, decent 1930's housing area - very busy location. (Met / Chiltern Line crosses over the WCML also . for added interest)

 

[aem7ac]

If you have not come across real time trains then check out this website. https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/

Will display freight and mail trains and some operators will show allocated power. Will give you a good idea of what is around.

Thank you! I've been checking it for a while for passenger ops, but I did not realize it also lists freight and/or mail.
I know the freight code is ZZ, but is there anything more I can decipher from that? Like any additional information on operator and such from the headcode?

Thrre is a footbridge over the west coast line near Stonebridge Park here
Dropped pin

51°32'53.7"N 0°17'23.8"W · 51.548240, -0.289938

maps.app.goo.gl

Dont hang around there too late into the evening. Nearest station is Wembley Station on the line out of Marylebone.

Crosses the Watford DC lines, the West Coast Line and a big tube depot.

Previous threads mention South Kenton - island platform , staffed station, decent 1930's housing area - very busy location. (Met / Chiltern Line crosses over the WCML also . for added interest)

These both appear to be great spots. Thank you!

 

[Intercity110]

Thank you! I've been checking it for a while for passenger ops, but I did not realize it also lists freight and/or mail.
I know the freight code is ZZ, but is there anything more I can decipher from that? Like any additional information on operator and such from the headcode?


These both appear to be great spots. Thank you!

You can use a website like railCam (£4 a month but gets you signalling diagrams TOPS allocations (these are what train’s running the service) and cameras across the uk) or rail-record which is free to give you the freight operator (and occasionally the kind of service).

 

[aem7ac]

You can use a website like railCam (£4 a month but gets you signalling diagrams TOPS allocations (these are what train’s running the service) and cameras across the uk) or rail-record which is free to give you the freight operator (and occasionally the kind of service).

Just want to make sure I'm understanding this right: if I pay the 4 quid for railCam, I get access to TOPS allocations? Thank you.

 

[Intercity110]

Just want to make sure I'm understanding this right: if I pay the 4 quid for railCam, I get access to TOPS allocations? Thank you.

Some, where they’ve been submitted, yes.

 

[aem7ac]

Hello again,
Sorry if this is the wrong forum to post this in but I thought I would just continue on this thread.
I've noticed that there is scheduled to be a railtour from UK Railtours using a pair of 73/9s out of London Waterloo to Exeter St. Davids on one of the days I am in London. I was wondering if anyone would be able to recommend spots to see this tour, as I am trying to photograph 73s.
Thank you!

 

[30907]

..l a railtour from UK Railtours using a pair of 73/9s out of London Waterloo to Exeter St. Davids on one of the days I am in London. I was wondering if anyone would be able to recommend spots to see this tour, as I am trying to photograph 73s.

The classic spot out of Waterloo is Raynes Park (down platform in the morning!) as there are no Fast line platforms there. The line tends to be on embankment, except just West of Clapham Jn where Strath Terrace Bridge might be a possibility.

 

[aem7ac]

The classic spot out of Waterloo is Raynes Park (down platform in the morning!) as there are no Fast line platforms there. The line tends to be on embankment, except just West of Clapham Jn where Strath Terrace Bridge might be a possibility.

Just making sure - down would be outbound/from Waterloo?
As an American I'm not too familiar with the down/up terminology.

 

[Ken H]

Just making sure - down would be outbound/from Waterloo?
As an American I'm not too familiar with the down/up terminology.

Trains go up to London, and down leaving London
Tracks are called up and down, so you will see names like up fast, and up slow

Trains that dont go to London. like Cross Country it is more complicated
A Penzance - Edinburgh train will leave Penzance on the up line, but when it gets to York it will be on the down. What the tracks are called on lines at dont go to London will depend on railway history.

All this is complicated by people in the south who talk of going up to London, while northern people go down to London and talk of 'down south'.

TfL lines are named after the direction they go in.

 

[30907]

Just making sure - down would be outbound/from Waterloo?
As an American I'm not too familiar with the down/up terminology.

Yes. But it's pretty obvious where to go for best lighting.

 

[aem7ac]

Yes. But it's pretty obvious where to go for best lighting.

Good point. Thank you for the help!

 

[aem7ac]

Trains go up to London, and down leaving London
Tracks are called up and down, so you will see names like up fast, and up slow

Trains that dont go to London. like Cross Country it is more complicated
A Penzance - Edinburgh train will leave Penzance on the up line, but when it gets to York it will be on the down. What the tracks are called on lines at dont go to London will depend on railway history.

All this is complicated by people in the south who talk of going up to London, while northern people go down to London and talk of 'down south'.

TfL lines are named after the direction they go in.

Did not see this the other day. Thank you for the help!

 

[aem7ac]

Hi all, thank you for all of your help. I got back from my trip this past Sunday, 18/06, and I am proud to say it was a success. I was able to photograph many of the trains I had asked about here. I’m posting some of my photos in the photography section of the forum. Either way, I’m glad with the way it all turned out, and I couldn’t have done it without the help of the people who replied to this thread. Once again, thank you!