Points of interest in tunnels

[Sad Sprinter]

Sometimes when standing by the door window I notice flashes of things in the tunnel as the train races along. A momentary light, something that looks like a passageway, a brief widening in the tunnel section. These little instances seem more frequent on the southern end of the Northern Line for some reason. Are there any other interesting parts of tunnel sections that you know of or seen?

 

[John Webb]

A number of these sorts of glimpses have been revealed on the excellent "Secrets of the London Underground" TV programmes narrated by Tim Dunn assisted by the knowledgeable Siddy Holloway. Frequently repeated on the 'Yesterday' channel and more recently on the 'Eden' channel (the latter not on freeview.)

 

[Mcr Warrior]

There'll be a number of now closed stations around the LU network, one of many such locations being South Kentish Town on the Northern Line, where you might just get a glimpse of a closed platform from a passing train.

Other places of interest might be the locations where lines split, an example (also on the Northern Line) being in the Kennington area where the two main branches (via Charing Cross and via Bank) diverge and where there's now also the new branch to Battersea Power Station.

 

[edwin_m]

A number of these sorts of glimpses have been revealed on the excellent "Secrets of the London Underground" TV programmes narrated by Tim Dunn assisted by the knowledgeable Siddy Holloway. Frequently repeated on the 'Yesterday' channel and more recently on the 'Eden' channel (the latter not on freeview.)

And many are seen in more detail on the Hidden London Hangouts videos.

Hidden London Hangouts | London Transport Museum

Explore our free Hidden London Hangouts series on YouTube and join as a member to enjoy exclusive access to our Hidden London Hangouts team.

www.ltmuseum.co.uk

Between Kennington and Bank there are various remains of the original City and South London tunnels, some of which were enlarged and re-used for what is now the Northern Line but others were replaced by new tunnels nearby. South of Kennington however, I don't think the Northern Line has much in the way of disused infrastructure, apart from the Clapham South shelter which isn't connected to the running tunnels. Lift shafts that were later replaced by escalators are a common disused feature within stations, but I believe the Morden extension stations were built with escalators from day 1.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

And many are seen in more detail on the Hidden London Hangouts videos.

Hidden London Hangouts | London Transport Museum

Explore our free Hidden London Hangouts series on YouTube and join as a member to enjoy exclusive access to our Hidden London Hangouts team.

www.ltmuseum.co.uk

Between Kennington and Bank there are various remains of the original City and South London tunnels, some of which were enlarged and re-used for what is now the Northern Line but others were replaced by new tunnels nearby. South of Kennington however, I don't think the Northern Line has much in the way of disused infrastructure, apart from the Clapham South shelter which isn't connected to the running tunnels. Lift shafts that were later replaced by escalators are a common disused feature within stations, but I believe the Morden extension stations were built with escalators from day 1.

There's some interesting points south of Kennington; the Oval to Stockwell section and points south of Stockwell all seem to have cross passages in the tunnels which can be seen at night when the tunnel lighting is switched on. There's also the digging shaft that was sunk south of Tooting Broadway which may have signs of which in the tunnels.

 

[Basil Jet]

South of Kennington however, I don't think the Northern Line has much in the way of disused infrastructure, apart from the Clapham South shelter which isn't connected to the running tunnels.

Stockwell, Clapham North, Clapham Common, and Clapham South all have similar deep shelters.

 

[Bemined]

Does anything like in Skyfall actually exist somewhere? Passages that connect to underground substations, air vents or something would probably exist, but are there locations where multiple of those passages would link up with each other allowing a James Bond style underground chase?

 

[DavyCrocket]

Does anything like in Skyfall actually exist somewhere? Passages that connect to underground substations, air vents or something would probably exist, but are there locations where multiple of those passages would link up with each other allowing a James Bond style underground chase?

Yes.

 

[Roger1973]

The 'abandoned stations' website has more on abandoned stations on the Underground (including one on the northern line that never opened)

 

[Ken H]

There are loads of junctions in the tunnels. There are step plate junctions where the tunnel diameter gets bigger and bigger till you can have 2 normal size tunnels. There are large tunnels with crossovers so you may see trains going the other way.
At highbury and islington you may see the old tunnels where the Northern City Line (Northbound) was diverted to allow cross platform interchange with the Victoria Line.
Plenty of diagrams if you google.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

Yes.

Where?

There’s also a substation, although I think it’s a substation, tucked behind some houses in Clapham between Clapham Common and Clapham South, away from the tunnel alignment. I wonder what the interconnection looks like in the running tunnels

 

[Ken H]

Where?

There’s also a substation, although I think it’s a substation, tucked behind some houses in Clapham between Clapham Common and Clapham South, away from the tunnel alignment. I wonder what the interconnection looks like in the running tunnels

In the 60's and 70's, LT used to do overhauls at acton. So there are connections between lines to allow trains from any line to get to Acton. The Victoria and Piccadilly have a connection at deep level under Finsbury Park.

 

[trebor79]

In the 60's and 70's, LT used to do overhauls at acton. So there are connections between lines to allow trains from any line to get to Acton. The Victoria and Piccadilly have a connection at deep level under Finsbury Park.

Even has handy signage saying "Piccadilly line" on the tunnel wall if you're quick enough to see/read it.

 

[Fenchurch SP]

There's some interesting points south of Kennington; the Oval to Stockwell section and points south of Stockwell all seem to have cross passages in the tunnels

I re-read this a couple of times before I realised you said cross passages and not passengers!

Also there is an emergency exit between Bethnal Green and Stratford marked by a section of tunnel painted white.

 

[Taunton]

Does anything like in Skyfall actually exist somewhere? Passages that connect to underground substations, air vents or something would probably exist, but are there locations where multiple of those passages would link up with each other allowing a James Bond style underground chase?

You need to get the book "Beneath the City Streets", by Peter Laurie, published a generation ago. He made out to have identified a whole range of secret doors and passages on the Underground network, bends avoiding deep escape routes, etc. Difficult to know what to make of it. Part research, part ridiculous, part fiction, part makes you look out next time - every lift button unlabelled is seen as a route to some government secret room.

More boringly, I find nowadays on the Elizabeth Line east of Whitechapel, at speed, I notice the junction between Stratford and Canary Wharf lines. Up the long train you can see the lurch one way or the other, then feel it, and notice a few tunnel lights around. Called Stepney Green Junction, but I call it Stepney Farm Junction as it is directly beneath the city farm there. which we know. Right underneath all the pigs and goats.

 

[bramling]

You need to get the book "Beneath the City Streets", by Peter Laurie, published a generation ago. He made out to have identified a whole range of secret doors and passages on the Underground network, bends avoiding deep escape routes, etc. Difficult to know what to make of it. Part research, part ridiculous, part fiction, part makes you look out next time - every lift button unlabelled is seen as a route to some government secret room.

There aren't really many "secret doors" on the Underground, though my understanding is the door at Charing Cross *does* exist.

The tunnels do however contain a surprising number of features if one knows where to look. On the older lines like the Northern Line this mainly takes the form of relics from the pioneering days (e.g. old sidings, that sort of thing), whilst on something like the Victoria Line it is mainly construction features like blind shafts, ventilation shafts, etc. The very new lines contain a lot of features for things like electrical services, ventilation etc. Pretty much all of this is all fairly innocent, there really isn't much if any top secret stuff.

 

[D6130]

As the OP didn't specify London Underground tunnels, I'll offer the kink in the middle of Kinghorn Tunnel on the Northern section of the East Coast Main Line....where the navvies blasting the tunnel from both ends failed to meet up quite at the right place in the middle! This resulted in a 20 mph permanent speed restriction for years and years....although, IIRC, it has now been raised to 30.

 

[AlbertBeale]

You need to get the book "Beneath the City Streets", by Peter Laurie, published a generation ago. He made out to have identified a whole range of secret doors and passages on the Underground network, bends avoiding deep escape routes, etc. Difficult to know what to make of it. Part research, part ridiculous, part fiction, part makes you look out next time - every lift button unlabelled is seen as a route to some government secret room.

Most of Peter Laurie's book is pretty accurate; though he did jump to a few unjustified conclusions. There's been more on this topic published in the years since then - in particular research by Duncan Campbell - which updates some of Peter Laurie's stuff.

 

[D6130]

While passing through the Channel Tunnel, you can look out - and listen out - for the UK and French crossovers, which mark the one third and two thirds points in the total length of the tunnel.

 

[Roger1973]

If we are talking stations, then there must be a lot of doors / passage-ways that are no longer in use for one reason or another, and don't have signs on the doors to say what they are, but they aren't really 'secret' as in any sinister way.

This would include links to lift shafts / emergency staircases that are no longer in use because the station has been rebuilt with escalators, signal cabins that are no longer in use because of re-signalling, interchange passageways that have been replaced by something newer and bigger, entrance / exits that have been closed for operational reasons, or because street layout changes have made that entrance redundant.

For example, Turnpike Lane and Manor House stations were built with entrance / exits leading to tram loading islands (before London Transport, the Metropolitan Electric Tramways was broadly in the same ownership as most of the London Underground, and they were keen on trams feeding passengers in to the Underground.) - there's an LT Museum photo of Turnpike Lane here. They lasted (for later trolleybuses and buses) until 1968 (1968 photo here.) I think the ones at Manor House went with the trams in the late 1930s. I understand that the concourse level bits of the passages to these exits are still there behind closed doors.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

While passing through the Channel Tunnel, you can look out - and listen out - for the UK and French crossovers, which mark the one third and two thirds points in the total length of the tunnel.

There's another crossover, the UK Land Crossover, a short way ( about a mile? ) into the tunnel at the Cheriton end which is also relatively easy to recognise although it's not as obvious as the cavern crossovers. It's not a full crossover, though - it only allows access from Running Tunnel North to Running Tunnel South towards the UK.

 

[birchesgreen]

There aren't really many "secret doors" on the Underground, though my understanding is the door at Charing Cross *does* exist.

When i did the Charing Cross Hidden London tour there was a tunnel we were not allowed to go down, even a peek...

 

[m0ffy]

When i did the Charing Cross Hidden London tour there was a tunnel we were not allowed to go down, even a peek...

Totally out of the loop - what’s the theory behind this?

 

[CarrotPie]

There's another crossover, the UK Land Crossover, a short way ( about a mile? ) into the tunnel at the Cheriton end which is also relatively easy to recognise although it's not as obvious as the cavern crossovers. It's not a full crossover, though - it only allows access from Running Tunnel North to Running Tunnel South towards the UK.

It's immediately before/after the tunnel portal (trailing outside the tunnel, facing in the tunnel.

 

[bluegoblin7]

When i did the Charing Cross Hidden London tour there was a tunnel we were not allowed to go down, even a peek...

I wouldn’t read much into it. There’s a lot of passageways HL can’t go down, in most of their locations, for various sensible safety reasons.

The tours are a look behind the scenes, not an access all areas trip.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

Totally out of the loop - what’s the theory behind this?

I started a thread about this a few years ago. There are deep level BT tunnels constructed in WW2 and used in the early Cold War period under Whitehall. The tunnels had a link to the Bakerloo Line platforms at Charing Cross. Someone once said on this forum they worked at Charing Cross station and there was an armed guard behind one of the doors.

What is the large building between Clapham South and Clapham Common that is set some way back from the main road? It’s a TFL building at St Gerard’s Close, looks possibly late 90s construction so I’m guessing some kind of a substation built for the 95 stock trains when new? Whatever it is it’s huge.

 

[bramling]

Totally out of the loop - what’s the theory behind this?

There is reputedly a connection from Charing Cross station into the government’s tunnel system beneath Whitehall. I’ve heard enough from reliable sources to believe this does actually exist, or at least it did.

What is the large building between Clapham South and Clapham Common that is set some way back from the main road? It’s a TFL building at St Gerard’s Close, looks possibly late 90s construction so I’m guessing some kind of a substation built for the 95 stock trains when new? Whatever it is it’s huge.

If it’s what I’m thinking of, it’s simply a substation and vent shaft. It’s older than 1990s though.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

It's immediately before/after the tunnel portal (trailing outside the tunnel, facing in the tunnel.

Are we talking about the same crossover? It's about 90 seconds running time before you emerge from the tunnel after passing it...

 

[birchesgreen]

I wouldn’t read much into it. There’s a lot of passageways HL can’t go down, in most of their locations, for various sensible safety reasons.

The tours are a look behind the scenes, not an access all areas trip.

I know but its fun to speculate

 

[Ex LT]

Stockwell, Clapham North, Clapham Common, and Clapham South all have similar deep shelters.

You forgot Goodge St and on the Central line Chancery Lane.

There is reputedly a connection from Charing Cross station into the government’s tunnel system beneath Whitehall. I’ve heard enough from reliable sources to believe this does actually exist, or at least it did.



If it’s what I’m thinking of, it’s simply a substation and vent shaft. It’s older than 1990s though.

Re the connection at Charing Cross it is still there and in more than one place if you know where to look.

I wouldn’t read much into it. There’s a lot of passageways HL can’t go down, in most of their locations, for various sensible safety reasons.

The tours are a look behind the scenes, not an access all areas trip.

You are right about various safety reasons and all that but there is a tunnel at Charing Cross. Before Westminster was rebuilt there was a connection from the EB platform to the old Scotland yard.

If we are talking stations, then there must be a lot of doors / passage-ways that are no longer in use for one reason or another, and don't have signs on the doors to say what they are, but they aren't really 'secret' as in any sinister way.

This would include links to lift shafts / emergency staircases that are no longer in use because the station has been rebuilt with escalators, signal cabins that are no longer in use because of re-signalling, interchange passageways that have been replaced by something newer and bigger, entrance / exits that have been closed for operational reasons, or because street layout changes have made that entrance redundant.

For example, Turnpike Lane and Manor House stations were built with entrance / exits leading to tram loading islands (before London Transport, the Metropolitan Electric Tramways was broadly in the same ownership as most of the London Underground, and they were keen on trams feeding passengers in to the Underground.) - there's an LT Museum photo of Turnpike Lane here. They lasted (for later trolleybuses and buses) until 1968 (1968 photo here.) I think the ones at Manor House went with the trams in the late 1930s. I understand that the concourse level bits of the passages to these exits are still there behind closed doors.

The only secret ones are either the ones you don't know about or the ones you don't have keys for and I don't mean signal rooms.