RailUK Tickets overcharging? (Update: this is not the case)

[sheff1]

I searched for a day return journey from Burton on Trent to Sutton Coldfield on 27 Dec with a railcard. RailUK Tickets came back with a split at Gravelly Hill £10 + £1.95 = £11.95.

The through fare is only £10. Not impressed.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would appear this is correct - Burton on Trent to Sutton Coldfield is not valid via Birmingham, or at least the NRE planner won't give me a fare that way. You have to travel via Tamworth and Lichfield.

 

[yorkie]

The thread title and opening post are factually incorrect

The through fare has the common Routeing point of Lichfield Trent Valley and there is no easement around this.

This is an RDG data error. It is not Trainsplit overcharging.

 

[Starmill]

Unfortunately, Burton-on-Trent and Sutton Coldfield have a common routing point, Lichfield Trent Valley. Therefore the only permitted route is the shortest route. This is via Shenstone.

 

[yorkie]

Chiltern offers limited split ticketing and is selling this for £22. Now who is overcharging?

Edit: NRE won't even offer a fare for that journey

 

[sheff1]

So other booking engines are undercharging then ? I will buy from one of them.

Maybe best to delete the thread if it factually incorrect ?

 

[yorkie]

If you have found a website that erroneously allows travel via Birmingham on the through ticket, feel free to let us know what it is. Any such website (I've not found one yet but then I've not looked extensively) would need it's Routeing engine to be fixed as it can't cope with the common Routeing point rule, which is a fundamental failure.

(Alternatively you may wish to keep that secret as it could be useful for anyone who uses such a website to obtain cheaper fares than should otherwise be the case!)

 

[Nova1]

If you have found a website that erroneously allows travel via Birmingham on the through ticket, feel free to let us know what it is. Any such website (I've not found one yet but then I've not looked extensively) would need it's Routeing engine to be fixed as it can't cope with the common Routeing point rule, which is a fundamental failure.

(Alternatively you may wish to keep that secret as it could be useful for anyone who uses such a website to obtain cheaper fares than should otherwise be the case!)

LNER website seems to want you to change in Birmingham

It's been a long day today guys, my mistake, sorry

 

[yorkie]

View attachment 125691

LNER website seems to want you to change in Birmingham

Edit,: that's to Gravelly Hill which is valid via Birmingham under the shortest route rule.

 

[Wallsendmag]

If the LNER site does it, National Rail should too

 

[bcarmicle]

View attachment 125691

LNER website seems to want you to change in Birmingham

Looksl ike that's to Gravelly Hill, not Sutton Coldfield?

 

[Bletchleyite]

If the LNER site does it National Rail should too

National Rail does not show valid routes via Birmingham for Burton to Sutton Coldfield - see my post near the top, was the first thing I checked when seeing this thread pop up.

Edit: and nor does LNER. The above indeed has been wrongly looked up for Gravelly Hill instead.

Looksl ike that's to Gravelly Hill, not Sutton Coldfield?

Yep, that's it.

 

[Wallsendmag]

National Rail does not show valid routes via Birmingham for Burton to Sutton Coldfield - see my post near the top, was the first thing I checked when seeing this thread pop up.

Edit: and nor does LNER. The above indeed has been wrongly looked up for Gravelly Hill instead.



Yep, that's it.

We share the same journey planner

 

[Mojo]

We share the same journey planner

You appear to have missed the point - the LNER website does not offer that itinerary, the above screenshot was to a completely different station than the journey being discussed.

 

[Wallsendmag]

You appear to have missed the point - the LNER website does not offer that itinerary, the above screenshot was to a completely different station than the journey being discussed.

I saw that after I posted

 

[zero]

The OP never said they wanted to travel via Birmingham, they just noted that there was a £10 return fare (CDR) and Trainsplit was not selling it.

When I search for this route on other dates, Trainsplit does not offer the £10 fare because it has found a cheaper split at Shenstone, two CDRs at £5.20 + £2.90 = £8.10 (not including the splitting fee).

For some reason, on 27 December Trainsplit still finds the split at Shenstone, but instead of the two CDRs it only offers the 4 equivalent singles.

To me this appears to be a bug as I can't see why the return tickets would not be usable on the 27th, but maybe someone else can delve further..

 

[Benjwri]

For some reason, on 27 December Trainsplit still finds the split at Shenstone, but instead of the two CDRs it only offers the 4 equivalent singles.

To me this appears to be a bug as I can't see why the return tickets would not be usable on the 27th, but maybe someone else can delve further..

Are you sure you changed your return date? It offers me two CDRs for the 27th, only way I can get it to offer four singles is selecting a different day to return.

 

[zero]

Are you sure you changed your return date? It offers me two CDRs for the 27th, only way I can get it to offer four singles is selecting a different day to return.

Yes, I am sure, but trying again now trainsplit yields the expected results.

So it could have been a temporary glitch which the OP also experienced, as I presume the OP would not have clicked through to the more expensive option if they saw the £8.39 result

 

[Sniffingmoose]

Go to the ticket office in Burton on Trent or to the TVM if ticket office closed. Living in Burton, I have never had to buy a ticket online as the staff are superb and will give you the cheapest deal. I am sure it will be £10 day return via Birmingham off peak with a railcard but that's after 09:30 M-F and also not valid in the evening peak. Restriction BX. You don't really want to change twice at Tamworth and Lichfield if you can help it.

 

[tspaul26]

Go to the ticket office in Burton on Trent or to the TVM if ticket office closed. Living in Burton, I have never had to buy a ticket online as the staff are superb and will give you the cheapest deal. I am sure it will be £10 day return via Birmingham off peak with a railcard but that's after 09:30 M-F and also not valid in the evening peak. Restriction BX. You don't really want to change twice at Tamworth and Lichfield if you can help it.

However:

Unfortunately, Burton-on-Trent and Sutton Coldfield have a common routing point, Lichfield Trent Valley. Therefore the only permitted route is the shortest route. This is via Shenstone.

 

[Sniffingmoose]

I have been traveling that route via Birmingham regularly for 20 years, Burton on Trent to Erdington without problems. Burton to Erdington is the same price as Sutton Coldfield and Birmingham New Street for a day return. So is the routing guide incorrect?

However if you buy Burton to Lichfield Trent Valley you are asked do you want to travel via Birmingham? Going to Lichfield via Birmingham costs more than changing at Tamworth.

 

[tspaul26]

I have been traveling that route via Birmingham regularly for 20 years, Burton on Trent to Erdington without problems.

So, not Burton to Sutton then.

Burton to Erdington is the same price as Sutton Coldfield and Birmingham New Street for a day return.

Irrelevant.

So is the routing guide incorrect?

No.

However if you buy Burton to Lichfield Trent Valley you are asked do you want to travel via Birmingham? Going to Lichfield via Birmingham costs more than changing at Tamworth.

This is because there are two sets of routed fares for this flow.

 

[Starmill]

I have been traveling that route via Birmingham regularly for 20 years, Burton on Trent to Erdington without problems. Burton to Erdington is the same price as Sutton Coldfield and Birmingham New Street for a day return. So is the routing guide incorrect?

However if you buy Burton to Lichfield Trent Valley you are asked do you want to travel via Birmingham? Going to Lichfield via Birmingham costs more than changing at Tamworth.

The calculation for permitted routes is always ticket specific.

 

[Sniffingmoose]

So tell me why National Rail Enquiries gives you a route via Birmingham for Burton to Sutton Coldfield at £10 off peak day return with a railcard?

 

[Alex365Dash]

So tell me why National Rail Enquiries gives you a route via Birmingham for Burton to Sutton Coldfield at £10 off peak day return with a railcard?

Are you sure they do?

Image shows Burton-on-Trent (BUT) to Sutton Coldfield (SUT) via Birmingham, no fares available, multiple tickets required.

Image shows BUT to SUT via Tamworth and Lichfield (not Birmingham), quotes the £10 Off-Peak Day Return.

 

[Sniffingmoose]

Try again for mid January. I got a day return £10 on 15th January but I could not get a Day Return before the new year so something strange is going on.

 

[yorkie]

Go to the ticket office in Burton on Trent or to the TVM if ticket office closed. Living in Burton, I have never had to buy a ticket online as the staff are superb and will give you the cheapest deal. I am sure it will be £10 day return via Birmingham off peak with a railcard but that's after 09:30 M-F and also not valid in the evening peak. Restriction BX. You don't really want to change twice at Tamworth and Lichfield if you can help it.

The ticket office issue invalid itineraries?

Try again for mid January. I got a day return £10 on 15th January but I could not get a Day Return before the new year so something strange is going on.

What days/times did you search for a day return, which you were unable to get results for exactly?

If you can type out the intended itinerary that would be useful, thanks.

 

[Harold Hill]

This time last week I looked for a first-class return from Temple Meads to Paddington for the following day. With my Railcard the cheapest direct offer was £130 so I looked at Parkway, pleasantly surprised to find same thing for £79! £6 return from BRI to BPW and there you are, £85.

 

[yorkie]

This time last week I looked for a first-class return from Temple Meads to Paddington for the following day. With my Railcard the cheapest direct offer was £130 so I looked at Parkway, pleasantly surprised to find same thing for £79! £6 return from BRI to BPW and there you are, £85.

Trainsplit will look at this automatically, so no need to do separate searches. If you want to see all overtaken but cheaper journeys, press the 'Cheapest' button.

TOC websites won't tell you this; TOCs would rather you paid the extra.

 

[Harold Hill]

Trainsplit will look at this automatically, so no need to do separate searches. If you want to see all overtaken but cheaper journeys, press the 'Cheapest' button.

TOC websites won't tell you this; TOCs would rather you paid the extra.

But it didn't ...