Remember the days of: Virgin's overcrowded 2+5 hst formations

[MCR247]

Can you not just link to it?

 

[fgwrich]

Virgins HSTs were 7 coaches to the end although there were occasions when 'fun sized' sets appeared in desperate times to avoid cancelling a train - the shortest reported was a 2+2 set

Ah

While i think of it, FGW has ocasionally run a couple of Fun Size sets, the most recent was either last year on the cotswold line with 43+tgs+ts+43

http://www.hondawanderer.com/43042_Moreton-in-Marsh_2008.htm

 

[tbtc]

I remember "Cross Country" (in British Rail days) used two coach HSTs on the Edinburgh - Manchester Airport trains instead of 158s at times, happened more than once

 

[poshbakerloo]

How are the XC Voyagers (or Super Voyagers) any different? Everytime I see one come through Birmingham, it's packed.

Every time I've been thru Birmingham, its been packed!!! :-x

 

[Edvid]

Does anyone have access to the post-December 2009 AXC HST diagrams?

 

[route:oxford]

Ah

While i think of it, FGW has ocasionally run a couple of Fun Size sets, the most recent was either last year on the cotswold line with 43+tgs+ts+43

http://www.hondawanderer.com/43042_Moreton-in-Marsh_2008.htm

Could imagine the acceleration of that set being pretty good.

What would be the maximum permitted speed given the limited braking capacity?

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

I remember "Cross Country" (in British Rail days) used two coach HSTs on the Edinburgh - Manchester Airport trains instead of 158s at times, happened more than once

From a mate.... 43078 and 43070 on 1S54 0556 MIA - EDB at Manc Airport

 

[jopsuk]

definitely more than two carriages there

 

[MCR247]

Does anyone have access to the post-December 2009 AXC HST diagrams?

I emailed XC a while ago and the person who replied said they're looking into it and will reply when they can get the info

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

definitely more than two carriages there

They weren't always 2+2, it was usually what was spare on Longsite or Craigentinny.

 

[jopsuk]

Fair enough.

Did we come to any conclusion about the 2+5 formations? As far as I can figure from this thread, there were never any "booked" workings for that formation, and I know Virgin never did refurb any of the sets to be "Prentendogers"*- was this just the OP wibbling?

As an an aside, what's the longest HST formation that's run? Is it the 2+9s on the east coast, or have any test trains run longer?


Whilst on short formations, why were the eight buffer-fitted power cars never reverted to being sleek once they were finished with as DVTs?

*if the refurbed Mark 3 + DVT set in Pendolino/Voyager livery is a "Pretendolino", surely this is a suitably ugly way to refer to what Virgin were to call "Challenger" sets?

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

Fair enough.

Did we come to any conclusion about the 2+5 formations? As far as I can figure from this thread, there were never any "booked" workings for that formation, and I know Virgin never did refurb any of the sets to be "Prentendogers"*- was this just the OP wibbling?

As an an aside, what's the longest HST formation that's run? Is it the 2+9s on the east coast, or have any test trains run longer?


Whilst on short formations, why were the eight buffer-fitted power cars never reverted to being sleek once they were finished with as DVTs?

Challenger sets never happened where as 2+5 HSTs did run, not sure on their booked working as before my time.

I know there has been 2+10 HSTs not sure on anything longer, may well have been mind.

Never any real reason to revert the buffer ones back to standard. Didn't effect speed or acceleration noticeably. The TDM was taken out when the wiring was re done and that's about it.

 

[87015]

Fair enough.

Did we come to any conclusion about the 2+5 formations? As far as I can figure from this thread, there were never any "booked" workings for that formation, and I know Virgin never did refurb any of the sets to be "Prentendogers"*- was this just the OP wibbling?

Yes there were. A fair number of sets were reduced to 2+5 and booked on the Birmingham-Manchester/Blackpool circuit - this went on for at least the September 2002 to May 2003 timetable.

A couple of 2+5 sets hung on until t least very late 2003 (after the official VXC HST farewell in Sep 2003) due to Voyager inadequacies, I had a set on 18/12/03 on a New St-Man P turn which from memory was 2+5 and solid HST at the time.

They were unrefurbished but referred to as Challengers by on trains by some staff and stations screens, don't know if this was official or unofficial.

 

[craig87034]

Went through my logs today and found 9th December 2000 43092 and 088
0640 Blackpool-Portsmouth Load 3

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

Going back to longest formations, there was a 4+16 when an FGW 2+8 rescued another 2+8....

And going back to Challenger, it actually ran for 1 TT period. Apparently, it even got to the point that spare Virgin cars on depots couldn't be cross swapped so trains ran OEO despite spare cars on depot as they were the wrong Virgin fleet as Virgin had two distinct fleets (Challenger was maintained by Alstom and Pioneer by Bombardier).

 

[Royston Vasey]

Never any real reason to revert the buffer ones back to standard. Didn't effect speed or acceleration noticeably. The TDM was taken out when the wiring was re done and that's about it.

I gather they are also much easier to marshal and rescue with conventional buffing gear.

Speaking of which, a GC set has rescued a GC set in the past "4+12", it's on Youchoob here

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

I gather they are also much easier to marshal and rescue with conventional buffing gear.

Yea, there's that too. Rescuing is a bugger nowadays anyway IMO. Seems to take far too long, buffers or not. Granted it's easier, but still hassle.

 

[Geezertronic]

Can't they couple Pendolino's together? I know it is physically possible but could they run in theory in double formation? Such an occasion would certainly save a path during track/OHL problems.

The recent OHL faff down by Bletchley could have seen double Pendolino's cruise through joining and splitting at Rugby and Watford (or just north of Euston)? Or do the signal lengths stop this from happening?

 

[12CSVT]

A super voyager is just a glorified dmu
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


When ever I travel by Voyager or Super Voyagers I like to get there in good time, so I can get a good seat. Most seats are reserved though, so I think I should start to reserve seats.

A voyager a 'GLORIFIED' DMU ? I'd rather travel in a 101 Metro-Cammell

 

[ainsworth74]

Why resurrect another dead thread?

 

[43167]

I remember the 2+5 period. Challenger sets on North East-SouthWest route, while the Pioneer Sets were on the North West-South Coast route. Virgin admitted they made an error and at the next timetable change they went back to 2+6.

 

[387star]

I take it a CrossCountry HST set (abelt with added East Coast buffet car) is on hire to East Coast due to the mk4 overhauls, likewise the EMT set?

Will the CrossCountry trains be reformed in to 8 coach sets and what is happening to the removed coaches?

 

[ainsworth74]

I take it a CrossCountry HST set (abelt with added East Coast buffet car) is on hire to East Coast due to the mk4 overhauls, likewise the EMT set?

This is the first I've heard about it, I was under the impression that there is only an EMT set on hire not a XC.

 

[sprinterguy]

There was a Crosscountry HST on hire to EC earlier in the year, covering apparently for tests involving a 225 set being used for IEP research That has since been returned to Crosscountry, I think it also had an added East Coast FO vehicle and was made up to an 8 coach set. As far as I'm aware there's just the EMT set on hire to East Coast at the moment.

 

[matt]

There is also an xc set on hire to ec at the moment