According to messages sent out this morning an Rhtt has caught fire and requested emergency services just outside Epsom. Looks like this diagram.http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/H32919/2014/11/27/advanced
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RHTT fire near Epsom
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Aside from the usual oils for motors and engines, are there any hazmats on the RHTT? Is the sandite flammable (thinking of the adhesive and powdered metal content)? I searched around, but couldn't find a MSDS for it.
SpacePhoenix
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SpacePhoenix
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Nym
Established Member
In the right circumstances, some powdered metals (aluminium being one) will burn easily (spontaneously in the presence of a suitable oxidiser), or even violently.
I imagine that sandite is unlikely to be up there with flash powder or thermite, but it's something I'd be wary of without a MSDS telling me that it's reasonably safe when exposed to a sustained fire.
For the avoidance of unwarranted hysteria, the sandite on the RHTT is probably perfectly safe or low risk. I'm just curious about it.
I would be surprised if something very flammable was spread on the tracks. Sand used to be used for firefighting (which is indirectly why Mr Sands is paged to the site of a break glass fire alarm) and aluminium usually has its surface quickly but quietly oxidise when exposed to air.
Feathers44
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I don't know about "hopefully" but we've had an MPV up and down the line between Epsom and Raynes Park for the last few days now. I've never seen a 73 go by so feel free to weigh up those odds yourself.
I have little doubt that it's inert once spread on the rails, but that does not necessarily mean it's inert prior to spreading. It does contain some sort of adhesive, which could involve the use of a flammable solvent. Again, I don't want to create fear of a risk if none exists, just got curious thinking about it, and the presence of adhesive and powdered metal.
The sand in it may well help to reduce any risk. In firefighting terms, sand is used to smother the fuel, so is only fully effective if the proportion of it is large enough.
Image:
http://i3.getsurrey.co.uk/incoming/article8184147.ece/alternates/s615/JS51785003.jpg
Article here: http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/surrey-news/epsom-train-services-halted-after-8185122 implies fire people thought started in compartment under cab .... seems it stops under a footbridge and the caretaker of a school needed to motivated to help gain access ....
..... The only comment about Ashtead i'd make is it often seems to be the coldest place when the door open .... though this is an opinion only and unlikely to relate the fire.
Definitely an MPV.
http://i3.getsurrey.co.uk/incoming/article8184147.ece/alternates/s615/JS51785003.jpg
Article here: http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/surrey-news/epsom-train-services-halted-after-8185122 implies fire people thought started in compartment under cab .... seems it stops under a footbridge and the caretaker of a school needed to motivated to help gain access ....
..... The only comment about Ashtead i'd make is it often seems to be the coldest place when the door open .... though this is an opinion only and unlikely to relate the fire.
Definitely an MPV.
Deepgreen
Established Member
"A spokesman from Epsom fire station said the fire was in a compartment underneath the driver's cab."
The photo clearly shows the fire damage being under one of the tanks well behind the driver's cab.
The photo clearly shows the fire damage being under one of the tanks well behind the driver's cab.
Deepgreen
Established Member
Yes, Ashtead tends to be coldest on calm nights as the station is in a slight 'frost hollow' (low lying land between higher areas, where cold air sinks and pools).
I used to live there and we used to have more frequent and more severe frosts than surrounding areas.
wensley
Established Member
Train 3S92, can't see the consist at the moment. Thankfully no injuries. it seems to have had a fair imapct on the morning's service so I would imagine there have been a few unhappy commuters!
DarloRich
Veteran Member
If it is a water cannon rhtt then you should be ok - water doesn’t burn 
If it is a water cannon rhtt then you should be ok - water doesnt burn
No, it boils!
Yes the announcement that they are delayed by the train that is supposed to reduce delays must be quite funny.
On the early morning train from Pompey it seems not that unusual to get delayed by a broken/misbehaving MPV .... I certainly do not find it funny. And if I were to be detrain to freeze my extremities off at Ashtead to get a bus to Epsom I would not be in an amused mood ... merely trying to restrain my language
tsr
Established Member
Just the other day (a Saturday, as it so happened, IIRC), I saw two unidentified Class 73s work an RHTT through Ashtead station whilst I was crossing between platforms.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
On the early morning train from Pompey it seems not that unusual to get delayed by a broken/misbehaving MPV .... I certainly do not find it funny. And if I were to be detrain to freeze my extremities off at Ashtead to get a bus to Epsom I would not be in an amused mood ... merely trying to restrain my language
I guess you might be lucky in that Ashtead has a new station building. The small concourse area isn't brilliantly warm but certainly better than nothing.
gage75
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If it is a water cannon rhtt then you should be ok - water doesnt burn
Unless you try to extinguish a thermite fire with it, as the water will explode
Peter Mugridge
Veteran Member
Feathers, TSR, for RHTT via Epsom the 73s work the Ewell East line, the MPVs work the Ewell West line.
There was an MPV in the usual evening diagram ( around 17.30 ) this evening so I guess they've got enough to cover the short term loss without problem.
( We do get other interesting power here on occasion; in the past few days on the Ewell West line we've had 56 301 + 56 312 T&T on the Railvac followed a day later by 31 233 on one of the track monitoring test trains, but I digress... )
There was an MPV in the usual evening diagram ( around 17.30 ) this evening so I guess they've got enough to cover the short term loss without problem.
( We do get other interesting power here on occasion; in the past few days on the Ewell West line we've had 56 301 + 56 312 T&T on the Railvac followed a day later by 31 233 on one of the track monitoring test trains, but I digress... )
I doubt this will make any difference to that given that the two diagrams are sourced from two different depots. The south circuits are run with MPVs from Epsom & Eastleigh & 73s or 20s from Tonbridge. Midlands are being run with MPVs from either Bescot or Kings Norton? with the Colas jobs supposed to cover outwards to South Wales.
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