Sandhills

[Mikey C]

The walk back to the centre of Liverpool isn't exactly pleasant either, and being on the river front restricts the options.

 

[Djgr]

The walk back to the centre of Liverpool isn't exactly pleasant either, and being on the river front restricts the options.

Google Maps is quoting 34 minutes walk from the stadium to the Pier Head (So in the real world about 25)

That is certainly what I would do rather than faff around having to walk in the wrong direction to Sandhills. Perhaps Sandhills is going to be mainly for those coming to and from the North and East of the city centre?

There is nothing inherently unpleasant about this walk. Whilst there are indeed some quasi derelict sites, there is also quite a lot of redevelopment.

 

[Mikey C]

Google Maps is quoting 34 minutes walk from the stadium to the Pier Head (So in the real world about 25)

That is certainly what I would do rather than faff around having to walk in the wrong direction to Sandhills. Perhaps Sandhills is going to be mainly for those coming to and from the North and East of the city centre?

There is nothing inherently unpleasant about this walk. Whilst there are indeed some quasi derelict sites, there is also quite a lot of redevelopment.

I did the walk a couple of weeks ago while in the area. The pavements might not be able to cope with the numbers for a start.

From memory, walking back from the old White Hart Lane stadium to Seven Sisters after an evening game, I remember everyone walking in the road. Maybe they'll need to shut some of the roads back to Liverpool to traffic for half an hour after the game.

 

[Djgr]

I did the walk a couple of weeks ago while in the area. The pavements might not be able to cope with the numbers for a start.

From memory, walking back from the old White Hart Lane stadium to Seven Sisters after an evening game, I remember everyone walking in the road. Maybe they'll need to shut some of the roads back to Liverpool to traffic for half an hour after the game.

Walking to and from Anfield and Goodison Park to the City Centre is a tried and tested activity every time there is a football match. And of course there are taxis and buses. I don't think Everton's move will lead to a major change in public transport usage.

 

[Richardr]

Are there any stations on other lines within reasonable distance of the new stadium?

 

[Djgr]

Are there any stations on other lines within reasonable distance of the new stadium?

Next stations along are Bank Hall and Kirkdale. Otherwise it's Moorfields

 

[urbophile]

It's not just the football crowds though. The immediate area – the residential parts at least – has become very run down and there is bound to be some regeneration and new-build housing there soon. Also the area to the south of the stadium is rapidly becoming north Liverpool's answer to the Baltic Triangle at the south end. A new station will be build there soon and there will very soon be an equal need for an additional station between Moorfields and Sandhills. That would then split the football crowds and ease the pressure on Sandhills.

 

[rower40]

The Leeds & Liverpool canal is just up the hill a bit. Matchday shuttle boats?

 

[Rail101]

"Lol"

This stadium will be an expensive infrastructure disaster, with the local authorities compelled to fund solutions to numerous very obvious issues, rail being just one.

But none of that mattered. The previous "mayor" was an everton fan. The lump may not have given two hoots about the city, but... It is only by concerted effort that the taxpayer wasn't on the hook for the stadium itself (via a loan) never mind the necessary supporting infrastructure.

Don't worry though: Every penny will be charged to us in the Liverpool region, taking money out of the budget for worthwhile things.

Did none of the media outlets pick up on this when the planning application went in?

 

[Meerkat]

Needs a ferry stop!

 

[Djgr]

Needs a ferry stop!

It looks so close to the waterfront for this to be possible!

 

[Bletchleyite]

If there was suitable funding, the Sandhills site has space on either side to add extra flank platforms. This would allow the central platform to be used on quiet days, and a "Spanish solution" type setup to be used on event days.

As with all things it will come down to cost though.

Build a new platform to the east of the line for city bound, leaving the island for outbound trains with a fence against the city bound line for extra safety.
There is the reversing siding to the south so empty trains could be sent north. What is the capacity of a full and standing 777?

Also consider the accessibility downside of that - it's used as an interchange.

Better would probably be to buy some of the wasteland by the present entrance and operate a queueing system on matchdays for each destination as Chiltern does on matchdays.

 

[AntoniC]

They need to build a tunnel to North Wales so all the Everton fans can drive and park next to the station .
In all seriousness though Sandhills is not an ideal station as it has a long thin island platform and currently only one entance.
There are talks about building a footbridge from the station over the railway to give another access point.
The council parking restriction scheme has also been ill thought out as there are no parking restrictions all year NOT just on match/event days.
The council plan is to allow no parking within a 30 minute walk of Bramley Moore Dock , locals can get two free parking permits, business`s upto 10 at £50 each.
As a Liverpool FC Season Ticket holder I am glad they have got a new stadium as the area around it needed serious regeneration.
Ironically enough it affects LFC Season Ticket holders like me and my dad as we normally drive to Sandhills park up in the industrial estate there and get the Soccerbus - in future it will be the train from Southport to Sandhills and the Soccerbus up to Anfield (and back).

 

[Prime586]

The Echo is reporting plans have been submitted for a new footbridge to 'increase the station's capacity' by providing a direct route from the new fanzone, and also to provide an additional emergency exit route from the platform.

Liverpool Echo: The Bramley-Moore Dock plan to help deal with 'dangerous' transport problems - https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/bramley-moore-dock-plan-help-31046558

What a carbuncle....
It doens't really address the main issue that the platform simply isn't big enough for the expected crowd levels (and this footbridge will impinge on the space that's there).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Presumably the "fanzone" is an off platform queueing area to manage that. And it being ugly hardly matters, the area is a post industrial dump of the highest order.

I could not be more opposed to suggestions that reduce interchange quality and accessibility 363* days a year purely for kickball once a week for half the year.

* Do the Boxing Day services stop there? I forget.

 

[Mr. SW]

Has that bridge been designed by a Reds supporter?

On a more serious note: Did the designer know anything about crowd flow? I've 'enjoyed' the delights of Twickenham and Fulham Broadway on match days and also Westbourne Park at Carnival and they managed. But I accept they are in different situations but crowds are crowds.

Has it been designed by this because of constraints put in place by Network Rail? Or an unwillingness to accept any sort of responsibility?

 

[Bevan Price]

Presumably the "fanzone" is an off platform queueing area to manage that. And it being ugly hardly matters, the area is a post industrial dump of the highest order.

I could not be more opposed to suggestions that reduce interchange quality and accessibility 363* days a year purely for kickball once a week for half the year.

* Do the Boxing Day services stop there? I forget.

Yes - Sandhills is open on Boxing Days.

 

[Prime586]

Has that bridge been designed by a Reds supporter?

It looks like it was designed by M.C. Escher...

All those right angles are just what you need for an emergency exit.

 

[WAO]

Would not two new platforms either side of Boundary Street, 500yards from the stadium, for match days only, be a better solution?

Football is an important economic activity on Merseyside and the stadium would certainly grow in frequency of use, beyond Everton home games.

It might even have a better passenger catchment area than Sandhills!

WAO

 

[Mikey C]

It's a host venue for Euro 2028, so they'll need to resolve things by then. Also to be used for concerts.

 

[chiltern trev]

Better would probably be to buy some of the wasteland by the present entrance and operate a queueing system on matchdays for each destination as Chiltern does on matchdays.

Re Chiltern Wembley Stadium. They have done exactly that. See this YouTube video by Mr drone UK

 

[urbophile]

Much better would be a new station slightly further south, where the railway crosses the Leeds-Liverpool canal. This might be a slightly further walk from the stadium, but offset by the fact that the station would be open every day and serve an established residential area as well as a burgeoning commercial and leisure one. No point on spending almost the same amount on two platforms which would rarely be used.

 

[Meerkat]

The Echo is reporting plans have been submitted for a new footbridge to 'increase the station's capacity' by providing a direct route from the new fanzone, and also to provide an additional emergency exit
route from the platform:

It’s going to be bracing queuing up there in the winter!

Would not two new platforms either side of Boundary Street, 500yards from the stadium

I reckon that’s too close - you need some distance to thin the crowd out.

Much better would be a new station slightly further south, where the railway crosses the Leeds-Liverpool canal.

Bit cramped with residential below and right next door
I was thinking more about Whitley Street. Good access either way, plenty of space, and the formation is in the middle so the platforms can go on the viaduct where the outer tracks were. Also great for the Ten Streets area which I believe is intended to become a boho artistic area.

 

[Mikey C]

Re Chiltern Wembley Stadium. They have done exactly that. See this YouTube video by Mr drone UK

Wembley Stadium station has 2 separate and roomy platforms though, so is much more geared towards big crowds. And with the 2 separate platforms, you can divide people according to destination much more easily (not that many people are going the other way usually!)

 

[Skie]

One idea I saw floated was to fence off the Southport bound platform face and build a new platform on the other side of the bridge on the large chunk of space available there. It'd allow the entire platform to be used for southbound passengers. But it would also require shifting of the signal and points and the area is a little tricky due to the canal bridge and Kirkdale reception line. Should fit, but not as simple as just building a platform.

 

[Prime586]

Also great for the Ten Streets area which I believe is intended to become a boho artistic area.

The Tens Streets already is the boho artistic area - it's all the people and businesses that got displaced from around Wolstenholme Square and the Baltic Triangle by property developers and gentrification (an artist friend who got booted out of his studio by Jamaica Street so the building could be redeveloped refers to the Baltic Triangle as the 'Pulled Pork and Beardwax Quarter', due to the middle class hipsters who took over the area). When Peel really kick off Liverpool Waters, the same thing will happen to to the Ten Streets area, and the current occupants of all those old warehouses will be chased out to another disused industrial zone even further out.

Regarding what to do about Sandhills, they should look at building matchday-only platforms on site of the old station on the other side of the bridge, where there is loads of extra room from the former Dock Branch junction.

I think one of the biggest risks they will have on matchdays will be either the recurring issue of signal failures between Sandhills and Central, or one of the 777s deciding to 'have a rest' between Kirkdale and Central. They were very lucky for the test event on Monday as earlier in the day there was an issue on the way into Central and they were running RRBs with everything from the north (that was running, there were a lot of cancellations) terminating at Sandhills. If that were to happen when a match is on it would be chaos.

 

[childwallblues]

Would not two new platforms either side of Boundary Street, 500yards from the stadium, for match days only, be a better solution?

Football is an important economic activity on Merseyside and the stadium would certainly grow in frequency of use, beyond Everton home games.

It might even have a better passenger catchment area than Sandhills!

WAO

Additional platforms have always been the answer in my view. A new station at Boundary Street which is right across the road from the stadium should have been built when the planning permission was granted. Indeed somewhere I have read for a new station to be built in the Vauxhall area between Moorfields and Sandhills but obviously our great Metro Mayor and his team have never taken this forward. It would have been the ideal solution.

 

[Kite159]

As long as any additional platforms are funded by the developers of the kickball stadium and not from the public purse.

 

[55002]

Walking to and from Anfield and Goodison Park to the City Centre is a tried and tested activity every time there is a football match. And of course there are taxis and buses. I don't think Everton's move will lead to a major change in public transport usage.

It may do, given the parking restrictions the council are bringing in. Vast swathes where no parking allowed from Queens Drive to the waterfront

 

[Meerkat]

As long as any additional platforms are funded by the developers of the kickball stadium and not from the public purse.

Surely the railway makes a stack of money out of football fans crush loaded onto trains?
Be interesting to see how much revenue football fans generate for the whole railway - Saturday trains shift huge numbers of them.