Scotrail Class 385 Discussion

[47271]

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/scotrail-380’s-first-class.157361/

The First Class discussion was done to death in the above thread before Christmas. They were going to tart up a section of the 380s, and then they weren't...

I'm also frustrated by the ineptitude of Scotrail's comms on short forming E&G peak time services. Okay, they've publicised a list of the services dropping down from six coaches. But would it not be more helpful, and positive, to remind users of the hourly electric service that runs with seven coaches? This is nowhere to be seen in the coverage I've read today. I know which trains I'd be heading for if I needed to make a peak time journey at the moment.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They are doing, aren't they - aren't they reducing the Anytime fare that way to encourage it, too?

 

[47271]

They are doing, aren't they - aren't they reducing the Anytime fare that way to encourage it, too?

You mean the electric service via Bathgate I think, I mean the hourly seven car 380 on the E&G? And yes, they've reduced the fare on the Bathgate route. The Bathgate publicity has been okay, I agree, it's appearing on platform info screens for example.

Although one of Stopper's latest posts on here suggests that they might be running more but shorter 380 services, if so it's a true measure of their desperation.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You mean the electric service via Bathgate I think, I mean the hourly seven car 380 on the E&G?

Oh, sorry, didn't know there was a 7 car 380 running.

 

[Stopper]

It appears the xx:00 E-G services are still 7 carriages. There also seems to hve been one xx:15 diagram travelling back and forward (every 2 hours from each end) which has 4 carriages. Not sure where those came from.

 

[Fleetwood Boy]

Shame you can’t actually buy the cut price via Airdrie fare from any ticket machines. Or at least you couldn’t last Friday, may be fixed by now.

 

[92002]

On E-G trains on Friday, they were announcing that First class was suspended until further notice.

SGS.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/stuartstransport

There has been no first class on the line since the December timetable change.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There has been no first class on the line since the December timetable change.

Is it declassified on 170 worked trains, then? Damn, should have sat there last week!

 

[92002]

That's assuming that the 170 actually has first class. Quite often they don't.

 

[ScotTrains]

It would be nice if they could have kept at least one train per hour with 1st class. Scotrail could then retain the lucrative revenue from 1st class passengers.

 

[InOban]

Delivery paths for this week have appeared, much later than usual. If they have a modification to make, I would have thought that they would keep them until done. It's always possible that they have made a prototype mod and wish to check them on the E-G. We'll see.

 

[hexagon789]

There has been no first class on the line since the December timetable change.

Seems somewhat reminiscent of the situation prior to the introduction of the 158s in 1990, the Class 47/7 push-pull sets were replaced by Standard Class only 156s, I think that remains the 'low point' stock-quality wise on the E&G, but it's not far off the moment.

 

[MatthewRead]

Seems somewhat reminiscent of the situation prior to the introduction of the 158s in 1990, the Class 47/7 push-pull sets were replaced by Standard Class only 156s, I think that remains the 'low point' stock-quality wise on the E&G, but it's not far off the moment.

I thought it was 150/2's that initially replaced the 47's

 

[route101]

Seems somewhat reminiscent of the situation prior to the introduction of the 158s in 1990, the Class 47/7 push-pull sets were replaced by Standard Class only 156s, I think that remains the 'low point' stock-quality wise on the E&G, but it's not far off the moment.

In theory a 156 could turn up on a E & G service , im sure it happened during disruption a few years back . As for 158s you used to get a 170 plus 158 late in the evening or a 158 after 7pm , though not for a long time.

 

[glasgowtripper]

To be honest, myself and others who travel from Glasgow to Edinburgh everyday would welcome a entire standard class only train, if additional seats were a result of this.

It isn’t an intercity service unfortunately, it’s a long range commuting service.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Agreed, it's inter-city, but it isn't InterCity. It's a bit like Liverpool to Manchester but with a lot more demand really.

 

[hexagon789]

Agreed, it's inter-city, but it isn't InterCity. It's a bit like Liverpool to Manchester but with a lot more demand really.

Inter-Urban perhaps?

 

[gsnedders]

In theory a 156 could turn up on a E & G service , im sure it happened during disruption a few years back . As for 158s you used to get a 170 plus 158 late in the evening or a 158 after 7pm , though not for a long time.

Pretty sure I ended up on a 158+156 operated service in the past couple of years; I remember doing a double-take at Haymarket and checking that it wasn't a Shotts service.

 

[dm.701]

In theory a 156 could turn up on a E & G service , im sure it happened during disruption a few years back . As for 158s you used to get a 170 plus 158 late in the evening or a 158 after 7pm , though not for a long time.

I remember back around 2008 getting a 158/170 combo on the E & G at night once. It did seem to occur fairly often back then. Shame the chances of this happening now are extremely slim. I always like when a 158 turns up on a ScotRail Express service and I'm back in the '90s. To think Glasgow/Edinburgh - Aberdeen/Inverness services were regularly formed of 2 car 158s. The mind boggles!

 

[hexagon789]

I remember back around 2008 getting a 158/170 combo on the E & G at night once. It did seem to occur fairly often back then. Shame the chances of this happening now are extremely slim. I always like when a 158 turns up on a ScotRail Express service and I'm back in the '90s. To think Glasgow/Edinburgh - Aberdeen/Inverness services were regularly formed of 2 car 158s. The mind boggles!

The mind boggles indeed, but I think the 75 mph 156s on such workings were really the worst, they are good units but 75 mph running on lines passed for 100 was just ridiculous.

To get back on topic, I hope the issues with the 385s are resolved soon. The train shortage is not going to be pretty and the shorter it goes on for the better.

 

[dm.701]

Hoping to catch the last of the 170s on the E & G soon so hopefully not too many 380s running just yet!

Speaking of the 385s, according to Realtime Trains a new 385 operated Glasgow QS - Edinburgh via Falkirk Grahamston service is being introduced running via Cumbernauld and replacing the current Dunblane - Edinburgh calls at Polmont and Linlithgow. It departs Glasgow at 26 and 56 past the hour.

See: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/G23418/2018/05/28/advanced

 

[Southsider]

Are 385s still running in test mode in Scotland or has that been suspended?

 

[gordonjahn]

I remember back around 2008 getting a 158/170 combo on the E & G at night once. It did seem to occur fairly often back then.

That was probably because late-night services called at Bishopbriggs which could only hold 5 coaches - platforms were extended to take 6 coach (2x170s) in 2009 which would explain why the 158/170 combo disappeared.

 

[Altnabreac]

That was probably because late-night services called at Bishopbriggs which could only hold 5 coaches - platforms were extended to take 6 coach (2x170s) in 2009 which would explain why the 158/170 combo disappeared.

Yes. One reason why I think it is short sighted that they have not extended Bishopbriggs and Lenzie to take 8 coach trains to allow flexibility of calls for late night services / disrupted services etc. I really think we should be working towards a standard of 8 x 23m trains being able to use stations in the central belt and any new stations / extensions etc should now be to that standard.

 

[route101]

Hoping to catch the last of the 170s on the E & G soon so hopefully not too many 380s running just yet!

Speaking of the 385s, according to Realtime Trains a new 385 operated Glasgow QS - Edinburgh via Falkirk Grahamston service is being introduced running via Cumbernauld and replacing the current Dunblane - Edinburgh calls at Polmont and Linlithgow. It departs Glasgow at 26 and 56 past the hour.

See: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/G23418/2018/05/28/advanced

I thought that service was not starting till December.

 

[Macwomble]

I thought that service was not starting till December.

Certainly can't start anytime soon...the wiring ain't finished.

 

[gordonjahn]

Yes. One reason why I think it is short sighted that they have not extended Bishopbriggs and Lenzie to take 8 coach trains to allow flexibility of calls for late night services / disrupted services etc. I really think we should be working towards a standard of 8 x 23m trains being able to use stations in the central belt and any new stations / extensions etc should now be to that standard.

I asked TS and the EGIP team several times about platform extensions, including whether SDO will be implemented to allow BBG and LNZ to retain their morning, evening and late-night services direct to/from EDB with longer stock formations, and included concerns on perturbation too - in the 2010 very wintery period on the E&G only EDB-GLQ services were running, but as all-stops, providing at least some service.

The answer was:

Thank you for your email dated 16 July 2013 regarding the Edinburgh Glasgow Improvement Programme (EGIP) and stopping services at Lenzie station.

The platform at Lenzie currently accommodates 6 car trains and we have no plans to extend this further, there will however be no dimunation in the existing service levels to Lenzie station.

Decisions regarding train configurations for specific services will be a matter for the new Scotrail franchisee who will be responsible for procuring the rolling stock.

Transport Scotland will work with Scotrail and Network Rail to develop a robust contingency plan that deals with perturbation issues along the route in the event of any disruption to normal services.

No real promises or answers to the question. Someone told me (somewhere - I forget where) that the platforms will end up lengthened but at Lenzie it probably involves moving signals and possibly a cross-over at the south-west end, or extending platforms over the road bridge at the north-east end.

The only way we'll end up back at the current level of interoperability between lines will be, as you suggest, a move towards 8x 23m support across E&G and EDB/GLQ to Stirling/Alloa/Dunblane services.

 

[InOban]

Looks like tonight's delivery again cancelled.

 

[NotATrainspott]

There are 7/8 car SDO stopping points at Edinburgh Park, IIRC. With SDO, there's not as much need to extend the platforms. Unless there are places where SDO can't work, the business case for other platform extensions is probably pretty low. Even Edinburgh Park might not justify them - the Dalmeny Chord might see the E&G expresses diverted via Edinburgh Gateway with its 265m-long platforms.

 

[PHILIPE]

Looks like tonight's delivery again cancelled.

Possibly weather related as Scotlands railways are starting to close down.