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Scottish MP Arrested over Covid Rule Breach

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matt

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Margaret Covid Ferrier has been arrested for alleged culpable and reckless conduct


Scottish MP Margaret Ferrier has been arrested by police after she admitted using public transport while infected with Covid-19.
Ms Ferrier apologised for what she called a "blip" in September.
She was suspended from the SNP group at Westminster, and leaders including First Minister Nicola Sturgeon urged her to quit as an MP over the row.
 
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duncanp

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Curious timing that this happens on the day of Sturgeon’s latest lockdown.

Yes, especially when the Metropolitan Police decided to take no action against Mrs Ferrier back in October.
 

DB

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What's the point of arresting her? All they can do is fine her, so if they have decided to proceed it should simply be a case of sending the case to court.

It's not that they are deliberately making a point, of course...
 
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What's the point of arresting her? All they can do is fine her, so if they have decided to proceed it should simply be a case of sending the case to court.

It's not that they are deliberately making a point, of course...

I think that's just standard procedure under Scots Law - the person is arrested by Police then formally charged whilst in Police custody, a report is then sent to the Procurator Fiscal
"Being arrested" sounds more dramatic than it often is, you get images of folk being forced to the ground, cuffed and thrown in a van. This was probably a pre-arranged appointment at her local police station

I note she's not been issued an FPN for the alleged offence by the police so it looks like they want her in court
The reported charge is "Culpable and Reckless Conduct" - so that's not a straight-forward penalty under the Coronavirus Regulations
 

Kite159

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No doubt she will get off with a small fine (say £1000) and told not to do it again.

Or it gets quietly dropped after another few months
 

SS4

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Has anyone else been arrested for breaking covid rules though? You can't treat someone differently because of their occupation

No doubt she will get off with a small fine (say £1000) and told not to do it again.

Or it gets quietly dropped after another few months

Isn't that the rule for everyone?
 

takno

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No doubt she will get off with a small fine (say £1000) and told not to do it again.

Or it gets quietly dropped after another few months
That's the most likely outcome. If they take it to a contested trial it will likely get thrown out, given that it's a far more serious charge than I'm aware of anybody else in Scotland facing for the same behaviour. You can't have one rule for MPs and one rule for everybody else.
 

JamesT

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Yes, especially when the Metropolitan Police decided to take no action against Mrs Ferrier back in October.

I believe the Met decided no offence had been committed in England at the time. If it had been a few days later then her trip would have broken the regulations which were then brought in.
 

brad465

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If she does get fined or some other minor penalty (relatively speaking), would her constituents be able to issue a recall against her? (i.e. force a by-election).
 

scotrail158713

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About time! (Disappointing to realise there’s no party popper-like emojis to put in here as well though :D)
 

Logan Carroll

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I wonder if she still has a future in politics?. I see no reason why she shouldn’t be able to still stand again. Her actions were careless but no need for arrests to be made. People seem to want to hang others for slight misteps over confusing and self contradictory guidelines.
 
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SteveM70

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Surely this is a case of shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted...

Isn’t that the case with the overwhelming majority of arrests?


What's the point of arresting her? All they can do is fine her, so if they have decided to proceed it should simply be a case of sending the case to court.

Pour encouragez les autres (and to say “hey Boris, this is what you should’ve done with yer mate Dom”)
 

island

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I don't know if the rules are the same in Scotland as in England, but an arrest for the offence doesn't seem to me to be PACE-compliant as the offence could be charged by postal requisition.
 

A S Leib

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If she does get fined or some other minor penalty (relatively speaking), would her constituents be able to issue a recall against her? (i.e. force a by-election).
If they are convicted in the UK of an offence and sentenced or ordered to be imprisoned or detained and all appeals have been exhausted (and the sentence does not lead to automatic disqualification from being an MP);
If they are suspended from the House following report and recommended sanction from the Committee on Standards for a specified period (at least 10 sitting days, or at least 14 days if sitting days are not specified);
If they are convicted of an offence under section 10 of the Parliamentary Standards Act 2009 (making false or misleading Parliamentary allowances claims)

Then the MP can be recalled and there is six weeks, once opened, for 10% of eligible registered voters to sign the recall petition, and if this happens the local returning officer informs the Speaker of the House of Commons that the recall petition has been successful.
 
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I don't know if the rules are the same in Scotland as in England, but an arrest for the offence doesn't seem to me to be PACE-compliant as the offence could be charged by postal requisition.

PACE does not apply in Scotland - I think The Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act 2016 covers most of the same areas (power of arrest etc)
 

Elwyn

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I used to work in law enforcement in Scotland many many years ago (pre the 2016 legislation that Ian has referred to). My rusty recollection supports what Ian Cunningham has said.

PACE doesn’t apply in Scotland, and cases are processed rather differently (though the final outcome in court could be similar). In England if you are going to arrest there needs to be appropriate cause, but you normally do it at the outset of the investigation, and various powers to search etc can be triggered by that action. In Scotland they normally don’t arrest at the outset. You are interviewed and reports gathered, where necessary a search warrant may be obtained, and the case will be discussed with the Procurator Fiscal who will decide whether to take it to court. Once all enquiries are complete and Fiscal's approval given, you are then arrested and charged. That arrest is a specific Scottish legal requirement that brings the investigation to a close, after which the police can’t normally make any further enquiries. In England that would be the point at which you are charged. But that Scottish arrest, usually in a police station, is a very different legal concept to a PACE arrest.

(In Scotland there is a separate power to detain someone, where appropriate, that parallels an English arrest, but that’s a separate story).
 

Butts

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I'm not surprised she hasn't resigned.

Originally part of the 2015 SNP tsunami she lost her seat in 2017 and won it back in 2019.

The lady is 60 and will no doubt get a good pay out if she can hang on till the next Election.

She doesn't appear to be a high flyer academically or workwise and this is probably the first time in her life she has been exposed to a gilded experience.

Once you've had your nose in the trough ( especially late in life) it must be difficult to give it all up - whatever party you represent.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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I used to work in law enforcement in Scotland many many years ago (pre the 2016 legislation that Ian has referred to). My rusty recollection supports what Ian Cunningham has said.

PACE doesn’t apply in Scotland, and cases are processed rather differently (though the final outcome in court could be similar). In England if you are going to arrest there needs to be appropriate cause, but you normally do it at the outset of the investigation, and various powers to search etc can be triggered by that action. In Scotland they normally don’t arrest at the outset. You are interviewed and reports gathered, where necessary a search warrant may be obtained, and the case will be discussed with the Procurator Fiscal who will decide whether to take it to court. Once all enquiries are complete and Fiscal's approval given, you are then arrested and charged. That arrest is a specific Scottish legal requirement that brings the investigation to a close, after which the police can’t normally make any further enquiries. In England that would be the point at which you are charged. But that Scottish arrest, usually in a police station, is a very different legal concept to a PACE arrest.

(In Scotland there is a separate power to detain someone, where appropriate, that parallels an English arrest, but that’s a separate story).

Good to hear from someone who actually has worked in law enforcement in Scotland, which presupposes this person has more understanding of Scottish Law than some of the armchair critics based in England.
 

C J Snarzell

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Either way her career is over - how can she have any respect from her constituents after her arrogant, selfish & reckless act?

CJ
 

Journeyman

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Either way her career is over - how can she have any respect from her constituents after her arrogant, selfish & reckless act?

CJ
Her constituents are absolutely furious and have wanted rid of her ever since the story broke.
 

kristiang85

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Nicola Sturgeon broke Covid rules but nobody want to get rid of her (except Boris)

To be honest, not wearing a mask for a minute is not in the same realm of rule breaking as testing positive for the virus and spending five hours on an enclosed train with members of the public in full knowledge of that.

And Sturgeon was heavily castigated on social media for what was a pretty trivial offence that all of us have done (albeit rightly castigated given her draconian opinon on such matters).
 

takno

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Nicola Sturgeon broke Covid rules but nobody want to get rid of her (except Boris)
I'd very much like to get rid of her. Not particularly for 5 seconds without a mask though.

In general I'm not very keen on this whole recall of MPs thing. There's something to be said making people live with their decisions for 5 years, on the basis that next time they might be less inclined to vote for a nodding donkey in the right coloured rosette
 

MikeWM

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The reported charge is "Culpable and Reckless Conduct"

That sounds a remarkably vague offense. I hope there are very strict rules about what is permitted under that, because it sounds like it could be used for almost anything that the authorities wanted to frown upon.
 
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