Should all buses using motorways have seat belts and no standees

[Busaholic]

Newer First buses have driver seatbelts, but certainly not all of them. It's not a legal requirement though, more a company policy AFAIK. But a driver must wear a seatbelt where it is fitted.

I'm interested that you say that. My observations on take-up by drivers of seat belt wearing on First Kernow's MMCs is that, when first introduced, little use was seen, then in a few months almost every driver wore them: now I'm seeing more drivers not wearing them again, though they're in a minority. I wonder whether what you say about drivers having to wear them where fitted is just company policy and what sanctions (if any) can be brought against non-complying individuals.

 

[philthetube]

one issue drivers have with seat belts, (right or wrong) is that they have no protection from a vehicle, unlike if driving a car. There are no crumple zones or airbags on a bus.

 

[AB93]

Newer First buses have driver seatbelts, but certainly not all of them. It's not a legal requirement though, more a company policy AFAIK. But a driver must wear a seatbelt where it is fitted.

. I'm interested that you say that. My observations on take-up by drivers of seat belt wearing on First Kernow's MMCs is that, when first introduced, little use was seen, then in a few months almost every driver wore them: now I'm seeing more drivers not wearing them again, though they're in a minority. I wonder whether what you say about drivers having to wear them where fitted is just company policy and what sanctions (if any) can be brought against non-complying individuals.

It is a legal requirement to wear the driver seat belt where fitted.
Naturally this also makes it a company policy.

 

[Busaholic]

It is a legal requirement to wear the driver seat belt where fitted.
Naturally this also makes it a company policy.

In that case I wonder why it's apparently up to individual bus companies whether they order buses with seatbelts: you can't order new cars without seatbelts, after all!

 

[AB93]

In that case I wonder why it's apparently up to individual bus companies whether they order buses with seatbelts: you can't order new cars without seatbelts, after all!

It's not mandatory for buses to have seatbelts, however, if they do have them fitted, it is mandatory to wear them (including the cab if it's just the cab that's got one fitted).

As is covered elsewhere in the thread, First took the decision to fit driver seatbelts to all new buses from 2009 onwards, following some nasty accidents with drivers being thrown through the windscreen etc.

 

[carlberry]

one issue drivers have with seat belts, (right or wrong) is that they have no protection from a vehicle, unlike if driving a car. There are no crumple zones or airbags on a bus.

Both of which make wearing a seatbelt a good idea!

 

[Busaholic]

It's not mandatory for buses to have seatbelts, however, if they do have them fitted, it is mandatory to wear them (including the cab if it's just the cab that's got one fitted).

As is covered elsewhere in the thread, First took the decision to fit driver seatbelts to all new buses from 2009 onwards, following some nasty accidents with drivers being thrown through the windscreen etc.

So, in theory, police could stop a bus being driven by a driver not wearing the fitted seatbelt and threaten prosecution. Does anyone know whether this has ever happened?

 

[laststop@96]

It would be interesting to find out how many buses/coaches have been stopped by the police for speeding with a full load at rush hour not many i think.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would be interesting to find out how many buses/coaches have been stopped by the police for speeding with a full load at rush hour not many i think.

On a motorway, unless it was a smart motorway, that will be 0 because it is impossible. Buses have a limiter to 62mph (100km/h), but can legally do 70mph on a motorway.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Both of which make wearing a seatbelt a good idea!

I don't get why bus drivers don't wear the seatbelt. I wouldn't fancy being thrown through a bus windscreen, and unlike the passenger ones the driver belt is properly mounted so won't feel constraining on them. (I dislike those on coach passenger seats because they pull you down into the seat).

 

[laststop@96]

On a motorway, unless it was a smart motorway, that will be 0 because it is impossible. Buses have a limiter to 62mph (100km/h), but can legally do 70mph on a motorway.

How can a bus do 70mph when its limited to 62mph by law and must do lower speeds by law on single A roads .

 

[Bletchleyite]

How can a bus do 70mph when its limited to 62mph by law and must do lower speeds by law on single A roads .

It can't, which would make it impossible, as I said, for a bus driver to be stopped for speeding on a motorway. Which is why I suspect the number of bus drivers stopped for speeding on a motorway since limiters were introduced to be precisely 0.

The bus is required to have a limiter set to 62mph or 100km/h. The speed limit for a bus on the motorway is 70mph. Therefore it is impossible for the driver to be caught speeding on a motorway as he cannot do so, other than *possibly* if the limiter doesn't apply enough engine braking to stop the speed running up another 8mph on a long downhill.

 

[Busaholic]

It can't, which would make it impossible, as I said, for a bus driver to be stopped for speeding on a motorway. Which is why I suspect the number of bus drivers stopped for speeding on a motorway since limiters were introduced to be precisely 0.

The bus is required to have a limiter set to 62mph or 100km/h. The speed limit for a bus on the motorway is 70mph. Therefore it is impossible for the driver to be caught speeding on a motorway as he cannot do so, other than *possibly* if the limiter doesn't apply enough engine braking to stop the speed running up another 8mph on a long downhill.

Or, of course, at times when the speed limit is less than 70!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Or, of course, at times when the speed limit is less than 70!

Indeed, hence my mention of smart motorways (and I guess roadworks, and the very small number of fixed <70mph speed limits on motorways).

 

[AB93]

So, in theory, police could stop a bus being driven by a driver not wearing the fitted seatbelt and threaten prosecution. Does anyone know whether this has ever happened?

Yes, that's right, the police could stop you and do the usual thing for not wearing a seatbelt.

 

[PermitToTravel]

The bus is required to have a limiter set to 62mph or 100km/h. The speed limit for a bus on the motorway is 70mph. Therefore it is impossible for the driver to be caught speeding on a motorway as he cannot do so, other than *possibly* if the limiter doesn't apply enough engine braking to stop the speed running up another 8mph on a long downhill.

If well loaded, and going down a sufficiently steep hill, putting it in Neutral pays dividends ;D

 

[RJ]

It can't, which would make it impossible, as I said, for a bus driver to be stopped for speeding on a motorway. Which is why I suspect the number of bus drivers stopped for speeding on a motorway since limiters were introduced to be precisely 0.

The bus is required to have a limiter set to 62mph or 100km/h. The speed limit for a bus on the motorway is 70mph. Therefore it is impossible for the driver to be caught speeding on a motorway as he cannot do so, other than *possibly* if the limiter doesn't apply enough engine braking to stop the speed running up another 8mph on a long downhill.

This is in theory. I drive buses with limiters set higher than 62mph and some coaches definitely do more than 70mph on the motorway.

 

[richw]

This is in theory. I drive buses with limiters set higher than 62mph and some coaches definitely do more than 70mph on the motorway.

Should also consider the tyres speed rating. Ours are F which is 80kmh. Unsure of what may happen to tyres if this is exceeded? None of my routes go on roads with speed limits where this is a concern to me.

 

[Busaholic]

It appears, therefore, that bus drivers must legally wear seatbelts where supplied, but bus companies can choose as to whether they are fitted. Taking this a stage on, then, if First, say, sell a bus to Ensign, or Joe Bloggs, or whomever, then they are AT LIBERTY to remove the seatbelt and its fittings. Am I right, or am I missing something? Equally First might take over an operator (admittedly an unlikely scenario these days ) with similar buses to its own, excepting they have no seat belts. Would First retrofit them?

 

[richw]

No reason to remove the seatbelt if fitted when selling the vehicle.
At a guess it’s fitted as specified by whoever orders the vehicle new.

It is a legal requirement to wear any seatbelts as fitted unless covered amongst any of the exemption categories specified in the relevant law.

 

[AB93]

I don't get why bus drivers don't wear the seatbelt. I wouldn't fancy being thrown through a bus windscreen, and unlike the passenger ones the driver belt is properly mounted so won't feel constraining on them. (I dislike those on coach passenger seats because they pull you down into the seat).

I always wear them, but it can be less comfortable and it restricts your movement in the cab when you need to lean forwards/backwards to press buttons on the dash and check blindspots (the latter which we are taught to do). Especially if you go to move too quickly at a crucial point and the belt cuts in and stops you.
Also, serious accidents hardly ever happen and still the majority of buses don't have them... so why bother in the few buses that do have them is the mentality.