should some sleepers be doubled up?

[popeter45]

so NJ and many of the new EN trains have proved very popular to the point many are solid booked weeks in advanced and just adding more coaches wont be possible beyond a extent
would any make sence to run 2 trains split by a hour or two?, e.j. run NJ470 Zurich to Hamburg as it is now 21:00-8:10 but also a later one e.g. 23:00-10:10 that would be better timed for earlier stops e.g. Hannover at 7:32 rather than 5:32?

 

[jamesontheroad]

Yes, and where trains are popular you could probably serve two different passenger profiles: those who want to have more time in the destination (leave early, arrive early) and those who want to have more time in the origin (leave later, arrive later).

As it’s down to the shortage of rolling stock. NJ are operating close to the capacity of the fleet. It’s possible that the new Siemens rolling stock will be used to compliment rather than replace all of the existing stock, or that ÖBB will order more. There’s certainly a natural (if protectionist) business case for ÖBB not to sell off older stock to prevent newcomers from establishing competing services.

 

[AlbertBeale]

Yes, and where trains are popular you could probably serve two different passenger profiles: those who want to have more time in the destination (leave early, arrive early) and those who want to have more time in the origin (leave later, arrive later).

As it’s down to the shortage of rolling stock. NJ are operating close to the capacity of the fleet. It’s possible that the new Siemens rolling stock will be used to compliment rather than replace all of the existing stock, or that ÖBB will order more. There’s certainly a natural (if protectionist) business case for ÖBB not to sell off older stock to prevent newcomers from establishing competing services.

I thought the plan was for the new Austrian stock to be used on routes which required it for compliance purposes - ie Switzerland and Austria to/from Italy - and for the stock released from those routes to be used to lengthen (or make more frequent) existing routes. If yet more stock becomes available with more new stuff being built, I'd guess that Austrian railways would try to run additional routes themselves if they'd really satisfied demand on their existing services, rather than selling off carriages. It'll surely be a few years yet before there's enough sleeper stock to go round, and OBB seem to be good at making a success of overnight runs, so why would they sell rather than build on their own success? Whether you call that "protectionist" I'm not sure.

(And this would be by way of complEmenting their existing stock...)

 

[JonasB]

Yes, but even better would be to run a slightly different route to cover different cities. E.g. Geneva to Hamburg instead.

 

[Trainbike46]

If routes consistently sell-out running it twice per night, possibly with different slightly different routes makes sense.

It's not looking like NJ will have spare stock anytime soon, as they are opening new routes, increasing frequencies and extending trains as new stock comes in, so a follow-on order from siemens may be required

 

[Route115?]

More trains means that you can run between a greater range of cities (changes at 3 in the morning don't really work for sleeper trains) and that can create a virtuous circle. You could of course shunt vehicles en route but that can be a logistics nightmare. The problem with sleepers can be finding platforms at busy terminal stations (a short dwell mean that you cannot join a train early or leave it late) and also joining and alighting at intermediate stations where the timing may not be ideal.

 

[Austriantrain]

I thought the plan was for the new Austrian stock to be used on routes which required it for compliance purposes - ie Switzerland and Austria to/from Italy - and for the stock released from those routes to be used to lengthen (or make more frequent) existing routes. If yet more stock becomes available with more new stuff being built, I'd guess that Austrian railways would try to run additional routes themselves if they'd really satisfied demand on their existing services, rather than selling off carriages. It'll surely be a few years yet before there's enough sleeper stock to go round, and OBB seem to be good at making a success of overnight runs, so why would they sell rather than build on their own success? Whether you call that "protectionist" I'm not sure.

(And this would be by way of complEmenting their existing stock...)

ÖBB have ordered a second series of new NJ sets, which will - AFAIK - serve Amsterdam, Hamburg etc (not Paris unfortunately, since approving a train for France is not easy and not worth the expense).

Now, all we need is for the first sets to be approved… the capacity is certainly needed

 

[ABB125]

ÖBB have ordered a second series of new NJ sets, which will - AFAIK - serve Amsterdam, Hamburg etc (not Paris unfortunately, since approving a train for France is not easy and not worth the expense).

Now, all we need is for the first sets to be approved… the capacity is certainly needed

I've not really been keeping up with NightJet news - how many new sets have been ordered? Are they all the fixed-formation 7 car sets with 2 seats, 3 couchettes and 2 sleepers? And which routes are they planned to be used on (the Italian ones, and Amsterdam/Hamburg as you mention, but presumably others as well)? Thanks

 

[Austriantrain]

I've not really been keeping up with NightJet news - how many new sets have been ordered? Are they all the fixed-formation 7 car sets with 2 seats, 3 couchettes and 2 sleepers? And which routes are they planned to be used on (the Italian ones, and Amsterdam/Hamburg as you mention, but presumably others as well)? Thanks

33 Sets - 13 in the first order (for Italy services) and 20 in the second. AFAIK all of those will be in the same formation. I am certainly not aware of the full plans for the second series, but I believe intra-Austria, Austria - Switzerland, Austria/Switzerland - Germany and the Netherlands are planned.

 

[zero]

(changes at 3 in the morning don't really work for sleeper trains)

Of course it would be nice to have direct overnight services to lots of places but there was no shortage of people changing at 3am in Frankfurt both this year and in previous years. Also trains in Germany are always late and I have actually found it useful a few times to change in the middle of the night in order to mitigate delays.

It's not exactly the sleeper, I travel on the ICE portion which is attached to sleeper coaches (but not once have I not managed to get a compartment where I can lie flat) though I don't know if people are changing from the sleeping coaches.