South Wales 'Metro' updates

[AdamWW]

A two hour commute is what they put up with in order to live in a three bedroom semi in a leafy commuter town. How many people would put up with that commute to live in a miners' terrace in Merthyr Tydfil? You'd have to be pretty desperate.

Or perhaps it's where you grew up, where your friends and family are, but not many jobs going there any more.

I think commuting into Cardiff from the Valleys is very much a thing.

 

[Krokodil]

Or perhaps it's where you grew up, where your friends and family are, but not many jobs going there any more.

Like I say, if you grew up in Merthyr and still haven't escaped you're in a pretty desperate situation.

 

[DannyMich2018]

So long as they don't replace the 4 car 231s with 2 car 150s...

In fact a 2 car TFW 150 only has about 62 less seats (both exclude tip ups) than a 4 car 231 so capacity wise not very efficient the 231s of course there is more standing room on them.

 

[Markdvdman]

Well I commute to Cadoxton and I will be getting to work 15 mins later every day due to the change! Progress? I think not 6:08am from Merthyr to Cadoxton arrives at 7:26am (ish). Well the new journey arrives at Central after the train I need to get there at 7:26am leaves! So it is pretty poor will probably mean having to leave work 15 mins earlier too! Do they EVER think of workers?

 

[Krokodil]

Well I commute to Cadoxton and I will be getting to work 15 mins later every day due to the change! Progress? I think not 6:08am from Merthyr to Cadoxton arrives at 7:26am (ish). Well the new journey arrives at Central after the train I need to get there at 7:26am leaves! So it is pretty poor will probably mean having to leave work 15 mins earlier too! Do they EVER think of workers?

You can't freeze the timetable in aspic forever. At some point you have to bring it up to date and there will be both winners and losers.

 

[Bald Rick]

Do they EVER think of workers?

Yes, very much so.

Do you EVER think about all the people (apart from you) who will benefit?

 

[Markdvdman]

So I have to suffer - it is the kind of issue that could cost me my job - as 30 mins a day lost - as the buses are pathetic? How would YOU feel if you were in my position? That is a bad change - so some prosper the rest lose? This is 2024 - not the 50s!

 

[Anonymous10]

So I have to suffer - it is the kind of issue that could cost me my job - as 30 mins a day lost - as the buses are pathetic? How would YOU feel if you were in my position? That is a bad change - so some prosper the rest lose? This is 2024 - not the 50s!

It is unfortunate but you can't make an omnett without breaking some eggs. In time everything will improve.

 

[Bald Rick]

How would YOU feel if you were in my position?

I have been.

In fact in the distant past when I was directly responsible for making such amendments on one part of the network, and I had to take one train out of the morning peak, I chose the one I usually caught. (it cost me an hour a day). Mostly because it was the solution that inconvenienced the fewest people, but also so that when anyone asked ‘How would you feel in my position’ at meet the manger events I could say with genuine sympathy ‘I am in your position’.

 

[AdamWW]

It is unfortunate but you can't make an omnett without breaking some eggs. In time everything will improve.

It might have been better though if at some point TfW had explained that they were going to have to degrade services for a while before the promised improvements come in.

And yes of course there will be winners and losers, though in general there's maybe some bias towards more losers than winners given that service patterns at the time may influence where some people choose to live.

 

[Anonymous10]

It might have been better though if at some point TfW had explained that they were going to have to degrade services for a while before the promised improvements come in.

And yes of course there will be winners and losers, though in general there's maybe some bias towards more losers than winners given that service patterns at the time may influence where some people choose to live.

Yes that is the case. I for one my have journey planners say to change in Bridgend for Tir Phil, fortunately I know my ticket is good to central. But communication is key and tfw don't seem great at it.

 

[WelshBluebird]

It would be interesting to see just how many passengers make that journey. Obviously with major employers like the Welsh Govt. and Cardiff University nearby there will be some but a daily commute of two hours a day is pretty challenging and I'm guessing the numbers aren't huge.

Plenty of people commute from the heads of the valleys to Cardiff. It's a huge commuter flow. You only have to look how busy the A470 is during peak hours to see that. A one hour each way commute on single train isn't exactly challenging either - infact I'd say its pretty average!

A two hour commute is what they put up with in order to live in a three bedroom semi in a leafy commuter town. How many people would put up with that commute to live in a miners' terrace in Merthyr Tydfil? You'd have to be pretty desperate.

Given how property prices have been increasing in the valleys of late, you are pretty mistaken.

Like I say, if you grew up in Merthyr and still haven't escaped you're in a pretty desperate situation.

Or maybe having cheaper housing, being close to family and having good commuter links to Cardiff is fine for most people? The valleys aren't this horrific place where everyone is desperate to leave you know! And I'm actually pretty fed up of people thinking it is. Plenty of people have moved there because of the fact you can easily commute into Cardiff but also be in a pretty picturesque setting (and in sure you'll post photos of Merthyr Town centre and laugh at the idea of it being picturesque, but the view from my old bedroom window onto the local mountains and the lovely walks I had literally on my doorstep are things I miss having moved away from where I grew up).

 

[Dai Corner]

A two hour commute is what they put up with in order to live in a three bedroom semi in a leafy commuter town. How many people would put up with that commute to live in a miners' terrace in Merthyr Tydfil? You'd have to be pretty desperate.

As someone working in heritage, I've looked at living around Bargoed to commute into the city centre. It's very much real now.

I thought the whole premise of the South Wales Metro was making it easier for people to commute to Cardiff?

 

[Brissle Girl]

Plenty of people commute from the heads of the valleys to Cardiff. It's a huge commuter flow. You only have to look how busy the A470 is during peak hours to see that. A one hour each way commute on single train isn't exactly challenging either - infact I'd say its pretty average!

Given how property prices have been increasing in the valleys of late, you are pretty mistaken.

Or maybe having cheaper housing, being close to family and having good commuter links to Cardiff is fine for most people? The valleys aren't this horrific place where everyone is desperate to leave you know! And I'm actually pretty fed up of people thinking it is. Plenty of people have moved there because of the fact you can easily commute into Cardiff but also be in a pretty picturesque setting (and in sure you'll post photos of Merthyr Town centre and laugh at the idea of it being picturesque, but the view from my old bedroom window onto the local mountains and the lovely walks I had literally on my doorstep are things I miss having moved away from where I grew up).

Indeed, in the 40 years since the mines closed the valleys have become much more green and pleasant, albeit that there is still considerable deprivation and relatively poor housing stock*. The Metro should help improve links to Cardiff to ease that deprivation too.

* Although I’d argue that for some people a terraced house in the valleys might be a better and cheaper bet than an expensive if not unaffordable flat in Cardiff, although that is clearly a matter of opinion.

 

[Llanigraham]

So I have to suffer - it is the kind of issue that could cost me my job - as 30 mins a day lost - as the buses are pathetic? How would YOU feel if you were in my position? That is a bad change - so some prosper the rest lose? This is 2024 - not the 50s!

And probably there will be another person who GAINS from the change; have you thought of that?

I thought the whole premise of the South Wales Metro was making it easier for people to commute to Cardiff?

And for many people the changes will make it easier to commute into Cardiff.

As has already been said, you can't make an ommlete without breaking a few eggs.

 

[Brissle Girl]

It’s certainly the case though that established journey patterns will tend to be based on the existing favourable journey options. So even if in theory there should be an equal number of winners and losers, the reality is that there will be fewer winners, as if the previous journey options were less convenient there will be fewer people making that journey.

 

[The exile]

Plenty of people commute from the heads of the valleys to Cardiff.

And some go beyond - I work with several people who commute in from a variety of South Wales origins by train. That’s to Bristol and we’re talking reasonably ordinary office jobs.
While accepting the omelettes and eggs analogy - I would hope that when timetables are recast the implications for first and last trains are given extra weighting . If my train at 09.08 no longer makes a vital connection, I can get the previous one (however inconvenient). At 06.08 that may mean leaving before I’ve got home the previous night. I won’t get started on the late start up times in our supposedly 24 hour economy….

 

[Krokodil]

While accepting the omelettes and eggs analogy - I would hope that when timetables are recast the implications for first and last trains are given extra waiting. If my train at 09.08 no longer makes a vital connection, I can get the previous one (however inconvenient). At 06.08 that may mean leaving before I’ve got home the previous night. I won’t get started on the late start up times in our supposedly 24 hour economy….

Oh, I agree there. For three of four lines on a so-called "Metro" to have no departures before 06:00 is a poor show. Hopefully it will be easier to change the access agreements with the infrastructure owned by TfW.

 

[anthony263]

Oh, I agree there. For three of four lines on a so-called "Metro" to have no departures before 06:00 is a poor show. Hopefully it will be easier to change the access agreements with the infrastructure owned by TfW.

Hopefully it will have earlier services in the future

 

[Doveymain158]

To.be fair it’s very hard to be able to make decisions regarding 1st and last trains. Maintenance teams also need access on a safe manner when no trains are operating..The earlier you run trains and the later they run. Reduces night access to the infrastructure which later down the line will be line block affecting passenger services bit of a catch 21 situation.

 

[WelshBluebird]

* Although I’d argue that for some people a terraced house in the valleys might be a better and cheaper bet than an expensive if not unaffordable flat in Cardiff, although that is clearly a matter of opinion.

More to the point, similar terraced houses in Cardiff and Bristol are much much more expensive too! Having just bought in Bristol terraced houses of the exact same age, style, size and quality are easily selling for £300k plus here, and in the nicer bits of town easily over £400k.

 

[anthony263]

More to the point, similar terraced houses in Cardiff and Bristol are much much more expensive too! Having just bought in Bristol terraced houses of the exact same age, style, size and quality are easily selling for £300k plus here, and in the nicer bits of town easily over £400k.

People pushed out of Bristol into Newport Cardiff pushing up prices there forcing people up the valleys. Think well soon see the end of cheap homes up the valleys

 

[AdamWW]

Looking at the new timetable, there seems to still be a unit allocated to the Bay to Queen Street shuttle, but rather than doing 5 trips an hour as at present it manages 2, spending much of its time sitting in platform 1 while the Pontypridd trains handle 2 trips an hour.

This seems a little inefficient - I presume rather than there being a burning need for through services to Pontypridd it's because there isn't the capacity to turn the shuttles round at Central.

Now if heaven forbid there should be a shortage of rolling stock the Bay-Pontypridd shuttles would seem like a good candidate for removal from the timetable (just as the Pontypridd-Central shuttles rarely ran and were then removed completely). In which case presumably they could just run the existing captive unit another couple of times an hour.

 

[Cathays147]

Is there any further update on the proposed Crwys Road station?

 

[Pat Figg]

That new timetable also shows all trains stopping at Trefforest Estate. Not before time, if that's correct. Is it likely to be the case though? I wouldn't be surprised to see it get changed so that only trains to and from Merthyr stop there, as happens currently. I notice most of the train codes are currently showing with a leading 1 (Express Passenger) but in the current timetable they always show with a leading 2 (Ordinary Passenger). That makes me suspect that these timetables are not quite the finished article.

I hope they do stop all stop at the Estate. Partly because I've already messaged a mate of mine with the good news, as he travels from Aberdare to Trefforest Estate everyday, and has to hop off at Abercynon/Ponty/Trefforest and wait 15 minutes in both directions for a train to or from Merthyr to stop at the Estate. I often do the same journey during the summer months so it would be good news for me as well.

 

[5021]

That new timetable also shows all trains stopping at Trefforest Estate. Not before time, if that's correct. Is it likely to be the case though? I wouldn't be surprised to see it get changed so that only trains to and from Merthyr stop there, as happens currently. I notice most of the train codes are currently showing with a leading 1 (Express Passenger) but in the current timetable they always show with a leading 2 (Ordinary Passenger). That makes me suspect that these timetables are not quite the finished article.

I hope they do stop all stop at the Estate. Partly because I've already messaged a mate of mine with the good news, as he travels from Aberdare to Trefforest Estate everyday, and has to hop off at Abercynon/Ponty/Trefforest and wait 15 minutes in both directions for a train to or from Merthyr to stop at the Estate. I often do the same journey during the summer months so it would be good news for me as well.

There is a plan to relocate the Estate section, though I don't know whether it's still going ahead - there was a comment that it was to be funded from revenue pre-Covid.

 

[Markdvdman]

One great positive I see is the introduction of Sunday hourly services Cardiff to Merthyr etc. I know the plan will be to go to every 30 mins but that is a positive change indeed!

 

[AdamWW]

One great positive I see is the introduction of Sunday hourly services Cardiff to Merthyr etc. I know the plan will be to go to every 30 mins but that is a positive change indeed!

Indeed.

They've come a long way in the last 25 years from zero Sunday services to this.

 

[5021]

idIt's slipped again - Feb 29th. At least this time it's official!

https://nation.cymru/news/transport-for-wales-confirms-reopening-date-for-treherbert-line/

Now advised by a senior TfW staff member that the public reopening is planned for next Monday, 26th, but the official opening - i.e. a ceremony or event to be attended by press, VIPs etc. - is to be on the 29th.

 

[Brissle Girl]

Indeed.

They've come a long way in the last 25 years from zero Sunday services to this.

I don’t recall the upper valleys ever had no Sunday services (at least since the 1970s) but it is certainly a country mile from the handful of services that used to run.