South Wales 'Metro' updates

[gjscott33]

I would hope that Wedal Road would be called Roath Park because most people don’t have a clue as to where Wedal Road is - although it does give a more specific location than just Roath Park - which is big. I think the station would be on the south side of Wedal Road although it would be a good idea to have the platform as part of the bridge - similar to Waungron Park.

The benefit of Roath Park (Wedal Road) station would be massive as it would be the shortest walking distance into Heath Hospital - especially of they made a new footpath on the south side of the cemetery. (A pity Heath Hospital was not on the site of the cemetery as the station would have been right at the hospital - a mistake not being made with the new Velindre Hospital).

All day long, Wedal Road is rammed with parked cars - presumably from hospital workers.

Surely, this is nothing to do with Crossrail as that is a west > east route from Cregiau/Plasdwr via the City line to Central and down to the Bay and on to Newport Road via Splott?

I think i know why wedal road is part of crossrail. On early plans there was a single roath park station around where the gower hotel used to be. This split to be the better located crwys road (on loads of bus routes and well linked to alot of people), and wedal road roath park. The idea is to run a metro style bus along the a48 from the newport road station, with stops at major overpasses, link to rail at wedal and call at the hospital then on to waun-gron park. In the consultations people proposed that a station in gabalfa would complete the link. It would be a very useful line on the metro map, even if not trains.

 

[Smwrff]

I would hope that Wedal Road would be called Roath Park because most people don’t have a clue as to where Wedal Road is - although it does give a more specific location than just Roath Park - which is big. I think the station would be on the south side of Wedal Road although it would be a good idea to have the platform as part of the bridge - similar to Waungron Park.

The benefit of Roath Park (Wedal Road) station would be massive as it would be the shortest walking distance into Heath Hospital - especially of they made a new footpath on the south side of the cemetery. (A pity Heath Hospital was not on the site of the cemetery as the station would have been right at the hospital - a mistake not being made with the new Velindre Hospital).

All day long, Wedal Road is rammed with parked cars - presumably from hospital workers.

Surely, this is nothing to do with Crossrail as that is a west > east route from Cregiau/Plasdwr via the City line to Central and down to the Bay and on to Newport Road via Splott?

Crossrail is a wider plan with two planned lines:
- Crossrail Line running from Creigau via Cardiff Central to Cardiff Bay to Cardiff East (phase 1A of which is underway)
- Circle Line linking Coryton and City lines (which includes Roath Park, Ely Mill plus other new stations)

 

[Bob Price]

The paths for testing on Coryton and Caerphilly weren't used again last night. Not quite ready I guess.

 

[CapitalStar378]

The paths for testing on Coryton and Caerphilly weren't used again last night. Not quite ready I guess.

Nothing ever is with TfW/AIW it seems.

 

[AWCook]

Will the 398s still be battery powered between Queen St and Butetown? If so, why will that section not be electrified?

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Will the 398s still be battery powered between Queen St and Butetown? If so, why will that section not be electrified?

Battery powered between Queen Street and Cardiff Bay, IIRC. I'm not sure why, particularly as the new link between Central and the Bay Line will have OLE.

 

[sefyllian]

Battery powered between Queen Street and Cardiff Bay, IIRC. I'm not sure why, particularly as the new link between Central and the Bay Line will have OLE.

The TfW part will be electrified, or at least was planned to be, from Cardiff Bay to just north of Butetown, then over to Central.

Shown on the latest plan (post 6765).

The part from north of Butetown to Queen St won’t be electrified as it’ll still be Network Rail infrastructure.

 

[AdamWW]

The TfW part will be electrified, or at least was planned to be, from Cardiff Bay to just north of Butetown, then over to Central.

Shown on the latest plan (post 6765).

The part from north of Butetown to Queen St won’t be electrified as it’ll still be Network Rail infrastructure.

There seems to be a fair bit of 25 kV cabling (or at least trunking for it) heading from the switching station at the junction north of Queen Street towards the station, and presumably then to the Bay Line.

Which of course doesn't mean it wasn't put in and then the plans changed.

 

[Cardiff123]

The TfW part will be electrified, or at least was planned to be, from Cardiff Bay to just north of Butetown, then over to Central.

Shown on the latest plan (post 6765).

The part from north of Butetown to Queen St won’t be electrified as it’ll still be Network Rail infrastructure.

And this highlights the absurdity of the settlement there was on the Core Valley Lines - The lines transferred to Welsh Government ownership are being upgraded and electrified, whilst lines and parts of lines still in DfT ownership get nothing, because when it comes to any funding for rail in Wales, the default response from the UK Treasury is "computer says no".

In any sensible world the Penarth and Barry lines would be getting electrified as well, but won't be because those lines are still in DfT ownership.
It's easy to forget that the CVL upgrades and electrification is only happening because Welsh Government secured enough funding from the very last round of EU Regional Development Funds that Wales was entitled to before Brexit. The UK government contribution is pennies to the overall budget of the CVL upgrades.

 

[positron]

The line from the bay all the way to queen Street is fully controlled by TfW. The boundary is effectively the bottom of the ramp on the valley lines towards central.

I'm assuming the real reason they're not doing further north than butetown is the same reason they're not doing pontypridd etc, they're avoiding complex junctions.

I'm also not sure why people are saying it will be electrified from butetown to central via the new link, none of the plans I've seen suggest that?

 

[Daniel Boone]

From the horses' mouth...

 

[Envoy]

I'm not sure why, particularly as the new link between Central and the Bay Line will have OLE.

That’s news to me as surely they can’t have 25Kv overhead wires above the streets?

 

[Solaris]

The line from the bay all the way to queen Street is fully controlled by TfW. The boundary is effectively the bottom of the ramp on the valley lines towards central.

I'm assuming the real reason they're not doing further north than butetown is the same reason they're not doing pontypridd etc, they're avoiding complex junctions.

I'm also not sure why people are saying it will be electrified from butetown to central via the new link, none of the plans I've seen suggest that?

Correct - you cannot have 25Kv OLE in street environment. The Bay central link (crossrail phase 1a) is being designed/specified to tramway standards (as is the bay line) with no OLE. There will be bay line OLE south of Butetown north station

 

[Bob Price]

There was a plan to electrify just south of Queens Street

 

[Solaris]

There was a plan to electrify just south of Queens Street

That may still be correct..burt much closer to Butetown north rather than Queen st - when I say "south of Butetown north station" i include the new station itself...extent north will prob be impacted by junction design to accommodate Crossrail Phase 1a link - so maybe only 10-20Ms. We'll see in due course

 

[MikePJ]

The 25kV will run from somewhere near the bridge over Herbert Street down to the terminus. It’s really just there to top up batteries. Terminating trams need to recharge before turning around, and once the street running to Pierhead St is built, it’ll also provide a boost for trams that last got juice in Gabalfa!

Some STP overnight non passenger runs shown on Realtimetrains now between Caerphilly, Coryton and Cardiff for today and tomorrow.

Not clear if anything ran this morning - only one shows actual times and that's just between Central and Canton and I'm not sure what to make of that.

Maybe the wires were energised on Sunday and they discovered they could do it without the planned two days of bridge and crossing closures?

RTT shows that a train ran from Barry Tourist Railway to Caerphilly and back in the small hours of Saturday morning - this could have been a 756 test?

 

[Zoomer]

For the Treherbert line, I see TfW have provided an update on Ynyswen station:

"We have temporarily paused works over the winter, allowing our teams to plan the next and final phase of work. On their return to the site in April 2025, they will complete the station footbridge, resurface the station platforms and install new station furniture ready for it’s opening in Autumn 2025."

That's around a year after the original planned re-opening, must be very disappointing for people in that area, although the shuttle bus will continue to take passengers to and from Treherbert and Treorchy stations in the meantime.

 

[CapitalStar378]

For the Treherbert line, I see TfW have provided an update on Ynyswen station:

"We have temporarily paused works over the winter, allowing our teams to plan the next and final phase of work. On their return to the site in April 2025, they will complete the station footbridge, resurface the station platforms and install new station furniture ready for it’s opening in Autumn 2025."

That's around a year after the original planned re-opening, must be very disappointing for people in that area, although the shuttle bus will continue to take passengers to and from Treherbert and Treorchy stations in the meantime.

What a load of rubbish, it's not like there's 6 ft of snow in the Valleys to prevent work taking place. I assume it's a financial decision, shame they're not more honest.

 

[positron]

Does anyone know if Caerphilly station fixed conductor bar went live at the same time as coryton and Lisvane?

 

[AdamWW]

Anyone know why Coryton station now has a 5 mph TSR?

They relaid the track right at the end that trains just put their front wheels onto when stopping but it seems a bit extreme just for some new track.

Does anyone know if Caerphilly station fixed conductor bar went live at the same time as coryton and Lisvane?

I'd also quite like to know why they didn't need the two days of bridge and crossing closures planned for the weekend the wires were to go live.

 

[Cardiff123]

There will be no trains at all, all day, every day, for an entire week 29 March - 4 April on the VoG lines Cardiff - Barry - Bridgend, and Cardiff - Penarth, and also Coryton - Cardiff (likely as a result of the Penarth line being closed).

What are Network Rail doing that week to justify closing those lines all day, every day for an entire week?

Rail improvement works | Transport for Wales

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tfw.wales

 

[StripeyNick]

There will be no trains at all, all day, every day, for an entire week 29 March - 4 April on the VoG lines Cardiff - Barry - Bridgend, and Cardiff - Penarth, and also Coryton - Cardiff (likely as a result of the Penarth line being closed).

What are Network Rail doing that week to justify closing those lines all day, every day for an entire week?

Rail improvement works | Transport for Wales

Transport for Wales | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

tfw.wales

There's a bit of track looking like it's to be laid around Penarth curve coming towards Grangetown so maybe something to do with that?

 

[anthony263]

There's a bit of track looking like it's to be laid around Penarth curve coming towards Grangetown so maybe something to do with that?

Pity trains couldn't run over the VOG between Bridgend and Barry or Barry Docks .

 

[Caaardiff]

Pity trains couldn't run over the VOG between Bridgend and Barry or Barry Docks .

That would make sense as they could still return to Canton via the main line

 

[Cardiff123]

That would make sense as they could still return to Canton via the main line

If a engineering and/or trackwork between Central and Grangetown is what is closing all lines for a week, then trains could even run as far as Cogan junction and use the crossover there usually used by Penarth trains to reverse back under caution from the signaller.

But as it's replacement buses throughout there must be more to it than that, I can't believe there won't be other engineering work happening on the Vale lines to take advantage of a week long closure.

I suspect the fact that mainline crews are not yet trained on 231s might have something to do with the full cancellation of services that week, as how else will 231s get between Canton & Bridgend and over to Barry?
But even a half hour service with 150s or 153s is better than full bus replacement all week.

 

[anthony263]

If a engineering and/or trackwork between Central and Grangetown is what is closing all lines for a week, then trains could even run as far as Cogan junction and use the crossover there usually used by Penarth trains to reverse back under caution from the signaller.

But as it's replacement buses throughout there must be more to it than that, I can't believe there won't be other engineering work happening on the Vale lines to take advantage of a week long closure.

I suspect the fact that mainline crews are not yet trained on 231s might have something to do with the full cancellation of services that week, as how else will 231s get between Canton & Bridgend and over to Barry?
But even a half hour service with 150s or 153s is better than full bus replacement all week.

I been told it's Cogan junction being done. Surely as they do now Surely a 150 could come ecs to Bridgend then work a VOG shuttle between Bridgend and Barry

 

[Cardiff123]

I been told it's Cogan junction being done. Surely as they do now Surely a 150 could come ecs to Bridgend then work a VOG shuttle between Bridgend and Barry

I suspect (and hope) there's engineering work being done on other parts of the Vale lines at the same time during such an extensive week long closure of all lines. No comfort to Barry - Bridgend passengers though stuck on replacement buses that take twice as long compared to the train, but engineering work must be done at some point. At least they are choosing the week before the school Easter holidays start to do it.

 

[positron]

Could hope Network rail are finally doing the second platform at Penarth too but I highly doubt it.

 

[AdamWW]

Does anyone know why some sections of new fencing along electrified sections seem to be made of fibreglass?
They have signs on saying that they're a "permanent insulated fence section".

Many of them are put in where the fence immediately passes behind catenary support posts - but they don't always seem to be used where there's a catenary post.

Some of them do seem to be in line with posts, but set so far back it's hard to see why that would be relevant.

In other cases the placement appears to be totally random.

The signs also say that they are "Not to be breached" - for bonus marks, how does someone "breach" a bit of insulating fence and why is it a specific issue just for insulated fencing? (I could see potential issues with breaching the grounding on metal fences...)

 

[Dai Corner]

Does anyone know why some sections of new fencing along electrified sections seem to be made of fibreglass?
They have signs on saying that they're a "permanent insulated fence section".

Many of them are put in where the fence immediately passes behind catenary support posts - but they don't always seem to be used where there's a catenary post.

Some of them do seem to be in line with posts, but set so far back it's hard to see why that would be relevant.

In other cases the placement appears to be totally random.

The signs also say that they are "Not to be breached" - for bonus marks, how does someone "breach" a bit of insulating fence and why is it a specific issue just for insulated fencing? (I could see potential issues with breaching the grounding on metal fences...)

A guess, but to break the conductive steel fence into sections so if the 25kV conductor comes into contact with it only a limited section of it becomes live instead of potentially (pun intended) several miles?