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Southeastern guard thinks that Redhill to Tonbridge is a Southeastern service.

stadler

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5 Jun 2023
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The jobsworth Southeastern guard on my Redhill to Tonbridge train has tried telling me that my Southern Daysave was not valid because it was a Southeastern service.

He checked tickets after leaving Redhill and says my ticket is not valid because this is a Southeastern service and my ticket is for Southern only. I tried correcting him but he was very stubborn and not having it. He told me that the Redhil to Tonbridge line is a Southeastern service that borrows rolling stock from Southern to use on the line. I told him he was talking nonsense and he should look on the Southern website and see for himself that it is a Southern service but he was not having it. I then told him to listen to the automated announcements that announce at every stop "this train is the Southern service to" but he replies that is because the train is borrowed from Southern so the announcements have not been changed. He kept insisting that it was simply a Southeastern service that borrows rolling stock from Southern and that the livery of the train makes no difference. He was a very dumb individual that insisted he was right no matter what evidence you give him.

He tells me i need to either get off at the next station or buy a new ticket from him. I completely refused and said i was staying on until Tonbridge and not buying a new ticket. He gives up after then and walks away. Then after Nutfield he makes an announcement over the PA saying this "this is a Southeastern service and Southern only tickets are not permitted" which was obviously directed at me. After departure he then comes back and starts giving me more hassle about how i have to buy a new ticket from him or get off. Then when we approach Godstone he gives up and walks away again and i am left alone until Tonbridge station.

Then when we approach Tonbridge he comes back and as i alight he tells me he is reporting me to their revenue protection department. I laughed out loud at him and asked how they will get my information from a paper card ticket with no barcode and he says they can use CCTV to aquire my details. I know this is just an empty threat and i very highly doubt he will go to the effort of reporting me to revenue protection. But his attitude was ridiculous.

The line between Redhill to Tonbridge has always been worked by Southeastern drivers and guards mostly. Currently around 80% of services are worked by Southeastern drivers and guards with only around 20% of services worked by Southern drivers and obs. This arrangement goes back to Connex days so it is nothing new. So you would really think that staff would be trained properly. But instead we get muppets like this. To be fair this is the first time i have ever had an issue with a Southeastern guard so at least it seems to be rare. The majority of Southeastern guards on the Redhill to Tonbridge line are fine and i have used a daysave on this line before and had it checked by a Southeastern guard with no issue. So it seems like just an issue with this one guard rather than a bigger issue. But this man needs some serious retraining.
 
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sh24

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It is astonishing that an employee is allowed out in front of customers with such a fundamental gap in their knowledge.
 

30907

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Please refer the incident to SE, perhaps with slightly less detail :)
 

gray1404

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Submit a formal complaint both to Southern who's train you were travelling on and to Southeastern about their staff member. Tell them you were concerned about his obsessive behaviour and that he refused to leave you alone.
 

Towers

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Would suggest politely requesting the colleague’s name in such a situation, and state that for the avoidance of doubt you will also submit “ze paperwork” (in this case of course, a complaint) in order to establish for everyone’s future reference, which is the correct situation.

Irrespective of the rights or wrongs of this particular case, it is deeply concerning regardless that any customer facing, revenue trained staff member should consider it reasonable for the travelling public to comprehend that a Southern train, with PA announcements introducing it as a Southern service, is not a Southern service, and therefore expect them to pay again. Even if the above were true, common sense should come into play in a situation like this.
 

tram21

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Nottingham
Just for my own knowledge, what is the operation on this route? Why would it ever be thought it could be a Southeastern service? From a quick look it looks like all trains are Southern operated?
 

Towers

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Just for my own knowledge, what is the operation on this route? Why would it ever be thought it could be a Southeastern service? From a quick look it looks like all trains are Southern operated?
But with SE crew. Rather bizarrely!
 

tram21

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The line between Redhill to Tonbridge has always been worked by Southeastern drivers and guards mostly. Currently around 80% of services are worked by Southeastern drivers and guards with only around 20% of services worked by Southern drivers and obs.
So basically it's all Southern operated just with Southeastern staff? Very odd! :lol:

But with SE crew. Rather bizarrely!
Very odd. Thank you! Surprised the staff didn't know that :rolleyes:
 

stadler

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Horsley
I will certainly email both Southeastern and Southern later on today and complain. Unfortunately both Southeastern and Southern outsource to Teleperformance who are about as useful as a chocolate teapot. When i have emailed them in the past to report faults and other issues i get what are very clearly stock copy and paste replies and nothing gets fixed. But it is worth reporting anyway so i shall do that later. Hopefully it at least gets passed on to someone who can track down the Guard and retrain them. Unfortunately i never thought to ask for his name but i think the headcode and time of the service and a description of him should be enough. He was either a Hastings guard or a Tonbridge guard as they are the only two depots that work it.
 

jawr256

Member
Joined
15 Apr 2017
Messages
152
I travelled this line last summer with a Southern Daysave. Naturally I had no idea of the staffing arrangements so would have been completely baffled if I had encountered this guard! I'd probably have pulled out the timetable I'd printed from the Southern website showing the 'SN' operator code but it doesn't sound like that would have convinced him.

Thankfully my journey was uneventful!
 

Peter Mugridge

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Epsom
I will certainly email both Southeastern and Southern later on today and complain. Unfortunately both Southeastern and Southern outsource to Teleperformance who are about as useful as a chocolate teapot. When i have emailed them in the past to report faults and other issues i get what are very clearly stock copy and paste replies and nothing gets fixed. But it is worth reporting anyway so i shall do that later. Hopefully it at least gets passed on to someone who can track down the Guard and retrain them. Unfortunately i never thought to ask for his name but i think the headcode and time of the service and a description of him should be enough. He was either a Hastings guard or a Tonbridge guard as they are the only two depots that work it.
I suggest openly CC'ing the ceos from both companies into the same e-mail.

You can dig them up here: http://www.ceoemail.com/
 

WesternLancer

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Joined
12 Apr 2019
Messages
10,111
The jobsworth Southeastern guard on my Redhill to Tonbridge train has tried telling me that my Southern Daysave was not valid because it was a Southeastern service.

He checked tickets after leaving Redhill and says my ticket is not valid because this is a Southeastern service and my ticket is for Southern only. I tried correcting him but he was very stubborn and not having it. He told me that the Redhil to Tonbridge line is a Southeastern service that borrows rolling stock from Southern to use on the line. I told him he was talking nonsense and he should look on the Southern website and see for himself that it is a Southern service but he was not having it. I then told him to listen to the automated announcements that announce at every stop "this train is the Southern service to" but he replies that is because the train is borrowed from Southern so the announcements have not been changed. He kept insisting that it was simply a Southeastern service that borrows rolling stock from Southern and that the livery of the train makes no difference. He was a very dumb individual that insisted he was right no matter what evidence you give him.

He tells me i need to either get off at the next station or buy a new ticket from him. I completely refused and said i was staying on until Tonbridge and not buying a new ticket. He gives up after then and walks away. Then after Nutfield he makes an announcement over the PA saying this "this is a Southeastern service and Southern only tickets are not permitted" which was obviously directed at me. After departure he then comes back and starts giving me more hassle about how i have to buy a new ticket from him or get off. Then when we approach Godstone he gives up and walks away again and i am left alone until Tonbridge station.

Then when we approach Tonbridge he comes back and as i alight he tells me he is reporting me to their revenue protection department. I laughed out loud at him and asked how they will get my information from a paper card ticket with no barcode and he says they can use CCTV to aquire my details. I know this is just an empty threat and i very highly doubt he will go to the effort of reporting me to revenue protection. But his attitude was ridiculous.

The line between Redhill to Tonbridge has always been worked by Southeastern drivers and guards mostly. Currently around 80% of services are worked by Southeastern drivers and guards with only around 20% of services worked by Southern drivers and obs. This arrangement goes back to Connex days so it is nothing new. So you would really think that staff would be trained properly. But instead we get muppets like this. To be fair this is the first time i have ever had an issue with a Southeastern guard so at least it seems to be rare. The majority of Southeastern guards on the Redhill to Tonbridge line are fine and i have used a daysave on this line before and had it checked by a Southeastern guard with no issue. So it seems like just an issue with this one guard rather than a bigger issue. But this man needs some serious retraining.
Worth letting him report you so they waste south eastern money on a pointless investigation. I’d probably have invited him to report me !
 

steamybrian

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26 Nov 2010
Messages
1,851
Location
Kent
He must be a "newbie". As a regular traveller on the Redhill to Tonbridge line I have never had any problem. You should have taken his name and depot and reported him.
 

Towers

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UK
It’s very straightforward for a TOC to identify who the guard is on a given service, as opposed to areas like roving revenue inspectors or gateline staff, and so a complaint does actually have a decent chance of being forwarded on to the relevant manager so that an appropriate conversation can take place - in this instance that would be very much to the colleague’s benefit, as they can be duly informed that their understanding of the situation is incorrect here. It’s a mere training issue, although entirely up to the OP of course if they wish to complain about the individual’s personal conduct.
 

JordR

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Joined
31 Aug 2014
Messages
179
Location
Leeds
Possibly leave out the "jobsworth", "dumb" etc when you write. It tends to reduce how credibly you'll be handled even if there's any accuracy to them. :)
 
Last edited:

John R

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1 Jul 2013
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4,454
Alternatively post about it on X and tag @stevewhiterail and then the MD of Southeastern will see it.
 

DPQ

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Joined
4 Feb 2017
Messages
85
I had almost the same experience on that line 10 years ago. Nothing changes, apparently.
 

gray1404

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3 Mar 2014
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7,098
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Merseyside
There is also a map on the Southern website accessable on the Day Save page showing where you can go. That line is included.
 

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