Southern DaySave afternoon restrictions

[XAM2175]

Hi, I'm after some guidance on the terms controlling afternoon peak on Southern's Daysave.

Southern's website says:

During the Monday to Friday period your train day pass is not valid before 10:00, or on trains that leave the following stations between 16:15 and 19:15:

• East Croydon
• Victoria
• London Bridge
• Clapham Junction

and NRE says the same thing.

This would appear to rule out travel on any train that calls at any of those stations - even taking the 1529 from Bognor Regis to Ford (arr 1540), for example, would be barred because it later departs East Croydon at 1658.

NRE however also says that it's ticket type SD1 (for one person), which when queried at BR Fares shows the very different text of restriction DS, of which the pertinent part is:

Not valid when boarding at a station within London Zones 1-6 on trains departing London Terminals after 16:14 until 19:16.

(and the unpublished restrictions are even less restrictive, but are obviously of limited value seeing as you won't get a journey planner to offer this ticket anyway)

Which of these can I reasonably rely upon? Or am I being overly restrictive in my interpretation?

Thanks in advance.

 

[bspahh]

Hi, I'm after some guidance on the terms controlling afternoon peak on Southern's Daysave.

Southern's website says:

and NRE says the same thing.

This would appear to rule out travel on any train that calls at any of those stations - even taking the 1529 from Bognor Regis to Ford (arr 1540), for example, would be barred because it later departs East Croydon at 1658.

I don't think it does. You would be on a train that leaves Bognor Regis. It then goes on to leave East Croydon, but not when you are on it.

 

[Chris Butler]

I used three Southern Daysavers last week. I also noticed this ambiguity but decided that the Zone 1-6 restriction was what was referred to on the website (Southern's) as part of the purchase process and so could be relied on contractually. In practice, I had no problems at all.

As I understand it, consumer legislation also says that in the case of ambiguity in the terms of a contract the version most advantageous to the consumer applies. That's not a discussion I'd want to get into but it's a 'backstop' argument.

 

[XAM2175]

I used three Southern Daysavers last week. I also noticed this ambiguity but decided that the Zone 1-6 restriction was what was referred to on the website (Southern's) as part of the purchase process and so could be relied on contractually. In practice, I had no problems at all.

As I understand it, consumer legislation also says that in the case of ambiguity in the terms of a contract the version most advantageous to the consumer applies. That's not a discussion I'd want to get into but it's a 'backstop' argument.

Ah yes, I've just attempted a dummy booking now and it indeed does show the "boarding at" text, complete with a link to NRE's page for restriction for DS. Thanks very much.

 

[prod_pep]

During the Monday to Friday period your train day pass is not valid before 10:00, or on trains that leave the following stations between 16:15 and 19:15:

• East Croydon
• Victoria
• London Bridge
• Clapham Junction

This confusing wording has thrown me before and could do with a re-write. It implies this restriction applies in both directions from Croydon and Clapham, but I don't think it does. I've never had a problem at the London Victoria barriers despite invariably arriving from the coast during the 16.15-19.15 period.

I recently bought a DaySave from the tourist information centre at Lewes, and on the coupon-style ticket the very nice lady issued, it simply says:

Not valid before 10.00 Monday to Friday (except Bank Holidays).

Travel is not valid on trains that depart London Victoria or London Bridge between 16.15 and 19.15 Monday to Friday (except Bank Holidays).

This ties in with what I always thought was the restriction: you can't travel from the terminus stations during this period, but arrivals are fine. Not complaining but worth noting that I only paid £22 for the ticket from the tourist centre, suggesting they aren't aware the price online has increased.

 

[XAM2175]

This ties in with what I always thought was the restriction: you can't travel from the terminus stations during this period, but arrivals are fine.

To me that says that you can't use any train that departed from those stations within those times, at any point in that train's run.

If they want to say "you're not allowed to board the train at x station" they should us the unambiguous "not valid for boarding at..."

 

[Andy Pacer]

I used three Southern Daysavers last week. I also noticed this ambiguity but decided that the Zone 1-6 restriction was what was referred to on the website (Southern's) as part of the purchase process and so could be relied on contractually. In practice, I had no problems at all.

As I understand it, consumer legislation also says that in the case of ambiguity in the terms of a contract the version most advantageous to the consumer applies. That's not a discussion I'd want to get into but it's a 'backstop' argument.

Did you have any issues at barriers out of interest with it not being recognised and then barrier staff not understanding what it was?

 

[Chris Butler]

Did you have any issues at barriers out of interest with it not being recognised and then barrier staff not understanding what it was?

They weren't recognised by any barrier (I stopped even trying) and no staff (barrier or on-train) hesitated at all in accepting them.

 

[Andy Pacer]

They weren't recognised by any barrier (I stopped even trying) and no staff (barrier or on-train) hesitated at all in accepting them.

Interesting, thanks. I had a few issues on my last one with barrier staff knowledge. I even missed a train at Hove as the barrier attendant was adamant it was only valid in London zones 1 to 6.

 

[MrJeeves]

Interesting, thanks. I had a few issues on my last one with barrier staff knowledge. I even missed a train at Hove as the barrier attendant was adamant it was only valid in London zones 1 to 6.

Ouch, poor showing. I haven't had any issues and usually have staff surprised to see one, often saying they haven't seen one of those in years!

 

[185143]

Ouch, poor showing. I haven't had any issues and usually have staff surprised to see one, often saying they haven't seen one of those in years!

That's my experience too!

Remember doing a couple back in about 2019, came across a few OBSs who were clearly ex Conductors and understandably still very bitter over the dispute situation. "We don't see many of these, and tickets are all we do now since THEY took the doors off us" being a sentence I heard more than once.