Stansted Airport Short Ticket Caution

[stanstedmarch]

Last Thursday I travelled from Tottenham Hale and then on to Stansted. My journey started in South London.

I tapped in at Tottenham Hale and when I got to Stansted Airport I saw that they did not accept oyster.

I went on the trainline app and paid for a ticket from Bishop's Stortford as it was the last stop I went through and obviously as it was fairly cheap. My logic was I'd be paying an Oyster max fair for not tapping out so it'd work out about evens.

Obviously, when I tried to use that ticket, the inspector did not agree with that logic. He got his badge out, said it was an interview under caution and would not allow me to pay a penalty fair.

He asked for proof of address. The only thing I had is a drivers license which has an old address on it. I said had no proof of address with current address on it. He said I would not be going through unless I can produce one.

so I didnt miss my flight, I gave him my drivers license and sa that this was not my current address but he wrote it down anyway.

I then immediately emailed greater anglia flagging the address issue and said I don't want to miss whatever letter I should be expecting.

I've never had to pay a penalty fare or anything like that before but wondered what I should be expecting from next steps? And whether just chasing greater anglia to ensure they know about the address issue is the right thing to do?

My ideal outcome is basically pay whatever fine they want to send...

 

[vinnym70]

You'll get some good advice here but Stansted is a fairly regular issue where people expect Oyster/contactless to work and the gateline staff there are used to dealing with these issues.
I suspect trying to buy another ticket will work against you a little as I'm sure it's something that's been done many times before.

You're not the first and you're unlikely to be the last but I'd be happy to agree there does seem to be some unfairness here, even though there are warnings at Tottenham Hale and Liverpool Street - you can tap in but you can't tap out at the airport. You can probably find the same articles as me from about a month ago where the Evening Standard, Independent, Daily Mail and Telegraph all have news items relating to the same.

Sensible advice would be to get your mail forwarded from your old address, but also to get the address on your driving license changed ASAP. You might be annoyed at the railway right now but DVLA will happily slap you with a fine up to £1000 for not updating your address and you run the risk of any parking/speeding fines, etc being sent to your old address without your knowledge.

 

[furlong]

Genuine question, but did you not see any of the signs at Tottenham Hale telling you not to do this? Have you any suggestions about what else they might have done that would have prevented you from making this mistake? As the recent press articles attest, it's stilll happening to far too many people.

"He said I would not be going through unless I can produce one." Are you sure you remembered it correctly? If true, it's worthy of a formal complaint and action ought to be taken against the inspector. In law you must provide your correct address - it's a separate criminal offence not to do so. The inspector has no power to demand any proof - they can request it of course, but they can only stop you going through (i.e. detain you against your will, which might otherwise be false imprisonment) if you didn't actually (as a fact, not as a mere suspicion) provide your correct name and address AND if they also allowed you alternatively to pay the correct fare for the (complete) journey on the spot (which they rarely seem to do) AND you refused to do this too.

Reference: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Vict/52-53/57/section/5

5(2)If a passenger having failed either to produce, or if requested to deliver up, a ticket showing that his fare is paid, or to pay his fare, refuses or fails on request by an officer or servant of a railway company, to give his name and address, any officer of the company may detain him until he can be conveniently brought before some justice or otherwise discharged by due course of law.

Interviewers would often remind you that you are free to leave and record this in writing (to avoid the risk of an accusation of false imprisonment).

Buying a ticket from the wrong station falls straight into 5(3)(a) at that same link - it's viewed as deliberately intending not to pay the complete fare and it sounds like you've admitted as much anyway.

(1) You need to make sure you get the letter, and you've already taken steps to deal with that.
(2) You'll then need to apologise and ask if they'll agree to settle this out-of-court. If you ask nicely, normally they do in a straightforward case like this.

(3) I wouldn't raise the matter of detaining you without lawful justification until after this, if at all, in case it derails your attempt to get a settlement. It would have no bearing on the substantive matter of the apparent ticketing offence.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Passengers trying to use Contactless/Oyster at Stansted Airport is a constant problem. What happens next is the Greater Anglia will write to you asking for your version of events before deciding how to proceed. It's important that you get a copy of this letter given that the wrong address was given. Personally I wouldn't have shown your driving license, there is no requirement to carry ID in this country, I rarely do. It's good that you've been proactive and contacted GA about this already but who did you contact at GA? If it's customer services it's unlikely to be passed on. You need to contact the Prosecutions Office, unfortunataly there's not a contact email address or telephone for this department on their website (if fact the Revenue Protection and Prosecutions page of their website is so out of date it refers to the 2012 edition of the National Rail Conditions of Carriage)!

When you get the letter send a short, concise reply mentioning the following:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Greater Anglia are normally prepared to offer an out of court settlement to people who haven't come to their attention before. This tends to cost around £150 plus the outstanding fare at the full Anytime rate with no credit given for the ticket already purchased. An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one. We cannot guarantee that this will be the outcome, legally GA could procesute you in the Magistrates Court should they decide to do so.

Feel free to post a copy of the letter once it arrives (with personal details redacted) along with your draft reply in this thread and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[WesternLancer]

Last Thursday I travelled from Tottenham Hale and then on to Stansted. My journey started in South London.

I tapped in at Tottenham Hale and when I got to Stansted Airport I saw that they did not accept oyster.

I went on the trainline app and paid for a ticket from Bishop's Stortford as it was the last stop I went through and obviously as it was fairly cheap. My logic was I'd be paying an Oyster max fair for not tapping out so it'd work out about evens.

Obviously, when I tried to use that ticket, the inspector did not agree with that logic. He got his badge out, said it was an interview under caution and would not allow me to pay a penalty fair.

He asked for proof of address. The only thing I had is a drivers license which has an old address on it. I said had no proof of address with current address on it. He said I would not be going through unless I can produce one.

so I didnt miss my flight, I gave him my drivers license and sa that this was not my current address but he wrote it down anyway.

I then immediately emailed greater anglia flagging the address issue and said I don't want to miss whatever letter I should be expecting.

I've never had to pay a penalty fare or anything like that before but wondered what I should be expecting from next steps? And whether just chasing greater anglia to ensure they know about the address issue is the right thing to do?

My ideal outcome is basically pay whatever fine they want to send...

If you can't rely on your e-mail to GA getting passed to their prosecutions team (and that is a risk) you need to do all you can to get the letter they will send you (maybe a royal mail redirect, or if there is a relaible person at the address you can gaurantee will forward on post), not getting the letter will result in a lot more time and hassle to you to sort out later as it will automatically escalate to court and the 1st you might hear about it is when court baliiffs eventaully find you (they seem good at that!) chasing you for a much increased court fine and costs. Hope you can sort this aspect out.

 

[jon0844]

I'd be sure to notify the DVLA about the address change too, as carrying a licence with the wrong address could land you with a hefty fine too. It would have probably been better not to show it or mention having it.