Super Off-Peak Return, Worcester to London

[jednick]

I am buying a Super Off-Peak Return from Worcester to Euston, limited to West Midlands Railway / London Northwestern trains only.

I'll be travelling to London this Sunday, breaking the return journey and stopping overnight on Sunday in Northampton, and returning Monday evening.

Two questions, please.

On my Sunday evening return from Euston to Northampton, can I break the journey at Harrow and Wealdstone, providing I stick to London Northwestern trains? I'll be travelling Euston-H&W-Watford Jn-Northampton, on their trains. I am asking because almost all Euston-Northampton trains don't stop at H&W.

Secondly, what is the earliest time I can travel from Northampton to Birmingham on Monday evening? I'm asking because I know there is a restriction on this ticket regarding the times I can return, but am unsure with the situation if I recommence my journey from Northampton.

 

[Birmingham]

Break of journey is not permitted on this ticket.

 

[andythebrave]

It is on the return journey.
I'm sure more knowledgeable folks will be along soon to confirm or deny this but it seems that once you have left Euston whilst adhering to any time restriction from there you are, effectively, free to stop wherever you please en route for as long as you like within the ticket's validity.

 

[Watershed]

Break of journey is not permitted on this ticket.

For the outward portion, yes. For the return portion, normal break of journey rules apply. Restriction code LV refers:

Notes
Break of journey is not permitted on the outward journey on any day except to change trains at an intermediate station or to access station facilities.

Therefore break of journey at Harrow & Wealdstone on the return journey is permitted, seeing as this on a permitted route from London to Worcester. Of course, as the OP says, only WMT services could be used to reach Harrow & Wealdstone, and similarly when continuing the journey.

The fact that services to Northampton don't stop at Harrow & Wealdstone is immaterial as it is on a permitted route. The calling patterns of services heading to your final destination are of no relevance; you can take 'stoppers' if you prefer, including to allow you to break your journey at a station you wouldn't otherwise stop at.

The time restrictions for continuing from Harrow & Wealdstone to Northampton or Worcester are a little ambiguous. Restriction code LV says:

Return Travel
Not valid for travel on services timed to depart London Terminals before 10:30 or between 16:00 and 19:00.

A connecting service can be used to complete a journey begun at a valid time.

The question is, when recommencing your journey at Harrow & Wealdstone, are you taking a 'connecting' service? Or do you take the London Terminals restrictions as if you had boarded there? The restriction code doesn't spell this out - if you were being conservative, I would suggest avoiding services that have departed London Euston between 16:00 and 19:00, even if you join them at Harrow & Wealdstone or Northampton.

Of course, bear in mind that you don't have to travel via Northampton. Your ticket is perfectly validly to take one of the WMT Crewe semifast services that avoid Northampton, and then change at Rugby - in fact, this is often the fastest journey opportunity when restricted to WMT.

 

[Starmill]

Break of journey is not permitted on this ticket.

It is as the return portion is being used:

Break of journey is not permitted on the outward journey on any day except to change trains at an intermediate station or to access station facilities.

Ticket Restriction LV | National Rail

Ticket restriction details LV. Each train ticket restriction code states when and/or on what train(s) the ticket is not valid and the days and/or dates that these restrictions apply.

www.nationalrail.co.uk

 

[Birmingham]

It is as the return portion is being used:

Ticket Restriction LV | National Rail

Ticket restriction details LV. Each train ticket restriction code states when and/or on what train(s) the ticket is not valid and the days and/or dates that these restrictions apply.

www.nationalrail.co.uk

Ah, yes. Misread the ‘return’ bit!

 

[JBuchananGB]

I think you could take the 1710 from Northampton to Birmingham as it departs Euston at 1556, then your next opportunity is the 2040, departing Euston at 1923. Which will get you to Worcester Shrub Hill at 2239