Taunton to Minehead New Proposals

[John Luxton]

It appears the prospect of a Minehead to Taunton link is on the cards again according to this report on the BBC web site.

One wonders if this will be successful this time?

West Somerset Railway: New bid to connect to mainline services

A fresh bid is submitted to the government to connect the Somerset line to the mainline.

www.bbc.co.uk

A bid to connect one of the longest heritage railways in Britain with mainline services has taken a step forward.

West Somerset Railway (WSR) and Somerset Council have now submitted a business plan to the government to restore the mainline from Taunton to the final WSR stop at Bishop's Lydeard.

The proposal suggests Bishop's Lydeard could become a commuter and tourist hub.

Richard Wilkins, the council's lead for transport, said it would "provide a significant transport link" to communities.

 

[DerekC]

Hmm - sense of deja vu (Swanage to Wareham) all over again!

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Bishop's Lydeard is too far out (6 mi) and in the wrong direction for a succesful Taunton P & R in my opinion. One solution might be to reopen Norton Fitzwarren on the main line (and which has a lot of new houses) and serve it with the proposed Wellington and Cullompton trains. The WSR could be extended to interchange there, and avoid any complication of GWR services operating over a private line.

 

[37114]

Bishop's Lydeard is too far out (6 mi) and in the wrong direction for a succesful Taunton P & R in my opinion. One solution might be to reopen Norton Fitzwarren on the main line (and which has a lot of new houses) and serve it with the proposed Wellington and Cullompton trains. The WSR could be extended to interchange there, and avoid any complication of GWR services operating over a private line.

That sounds a very pragmatic solution. The WSR has enough on its plate managing the longest Heritage line in the UK without adding in the complexity of running into Taunton.

 

[stuu]

Bishop's Lydeard is too far out (6 mi) and in the wrong direction for a succesful Taunton P & R in my opinion. One solution might be to reopen Norton Fitzwarren on the main line (and which has a lot of new houses) and serve it with the proposed Wellington and Cullompton trains. The WSR could be extended to interchange there, and avoid any complication of GWR services operating over a private line.

The traffic into Taunton is appalling in the mornings, it can easily take half an hour if not longer to get in from Bishops Lydeard. So I can imagine there would be some customers. But then Taunton station is pretty useless for any major destinations in the town, so maybe not

 

[fgwrich]

Hmm - sense of deja vu (Swanage to Wareham) all over again!

But, depending on which stock is used, they may at least be able to avoid some of the big costs incurred in the Swanage program (eg the DMU situation).

 

[74A]

Could they extend the current Taunton terminators to Bishops Lydiard ? Though that might require an extra set so would cost too much.

 

[duffield]

Could they extend the current Taunton terminators to Bishops Lydiard ? Though that might require an extra set so would cost too much.

There aren't even any regular terminating services to extend though, a lot of them go through to Penzance or Plymouth.

 

[Ashley Hill]

I suppose with Cullompton and Wellington being kicked into the long grass this is Somersets next option to improve rail /road services.

 

[D Williams]

It appears the prospect of a Minehead to Taunton link is on the cards again according to this report on the BBC web site.

One wonders if this will be successful this time?

West Somerset Railway: New bid to connect to mainline services

A fresh bid is submitted to the government to connect the Somerset line to the mainline.

www.bbc.co.uk

There aren't even any regular terminating services to extend though, a lot of them go through to Penzance or Plymouth.

Ho, hum, yawn....here we go again. Somebody in the council has a Hornby train set and is therefore an expert on railways. There are a couple of main line ready DMUs at Swanage that may be available at the right price.

 

[yorksrob]

Cullompton and Wellington really need to be resurrected ASAP. Dropping them is just penny pinching in the scheme of public funds

Norton Fitzwarren could be an add on.

 

[chrisp37]

Didn’t GWR trial a Taunton to Bishops Lydeard shuttle in 2019, to connect with the WSR? Not sure how long it ran for or how well used it was. I’ve yet to try the WSR (hopefully next year!) but I like the idea of travelling all the way to Minehead by rail.

 

[stuu]

Didn’t GWR trial a Taunton to Bishops Lydeard shuttle in 2019, to connect with the WSR? Not sure how long it ran for or how well used it was. I’ve yet to try the WSR (hopefully next year!) but I like the idea of travelling all the way to Minehead by rail.

It ran for five or six weekends over the summer. No idea how well used it was, but I seem to recall the WSR saying it wasn't value for money (they put some of the money up IIRC)

 

[duffield]

It ran for five or six weekends over the summer. No idea how well used it was, but I seem to recall the WSR saying it wasn't value for money (they put some of the money up IIRC)

The only way it's ever likely to work is (as suggested) if it was doubling up as a local service to Taunton and beyond, and a park and ride service for the Bishops Lydeard area. And I'm not saying that that proposition is at all viable, just that the WSR shuttle link will never be viable on its own.

 

[12LDA28C]

Didn’t GWR trial a Taunton to Bishops Lydeard shuttle in 2019, to connect with the WSR? Not sure how long it ran for or how well used it was. I’ve yet to try the WSR (hopefully next year!) but I like the idea of travelling all the way to Minehead by rail.

Charter trains regularly visit Minehead from various starting points all over the network if you want to traverse the main line connection.

 

[Harpo]

Sounds like a job for Go-op.

 

[lauderlight]

Having seen first hand the some of the hoops the NYMR have had to jump through to get regular services to Whitby, I can see why this might be a non starter. To run on Network Rail:

1. the heritage railway has to be registered as a TOC.
2. The engines and stock have to be mainline registered eg. The LNERCA teak set can't run to Whitby.
The locos may need some or all of GSM-R, AWS, TPWS and OTMR. Some locos are banned from network rail altogether eg 9Fs.
The coaches will need some sort of CDL system
4. All the traincrew need a Network Rail medical. Network Rail doesn't differentiate between drivers and fireman so all fireman undergo the same medical as drivers from the big TOCs eg ECG monitoring etc.
5. The fitter who inspects the steam loco before lighting it up can't be the same person as conducts the network rail fitnesss to run. This is fine if the loco starts at Grosmont but not good if it starts at New Bridge (Pickering). It means that an extra person has to come from Grosmont every morning to do the FTR. So that's at least a couple of hours of somebody's shift lost that could be spent overhauling locos.

There is an ongoing big debate amongst NYMR staff and volunteers whether running to Whitby is worth it. Revenue is certainly up but so are costs. A new management position seems to be created every month. Sometimes it feels that we are a park n' ride to Whitby with many passengers not spending any time at the NYMR stations.

 

[Harpo]

Re Whitby: I always wondered why you’d send your secondary spend away somewhere else.

 

[74A]

Long term it would probably be easier to reinstate the track between Norton Fitzwarren and Taunton. Used to be 4 track all the way.

There are also a pair of unused bay platforms which they could run into. Be separate from Network Rail then.

 

[Brush 4]

Yes, that is the longer term answer (above) Relay the separate track to the Minehead bay (as was). Then, operations are self contained.
GWR can operate to/from Bristol if they want.

 

[lauderlight]

Re Whitby: I always wondered why you’d send your secondary spend away somewhere else.

Especially now with the all year rover ticket. You could drive to Pickering, park up in an non-NYMR car park, stock up on food from aldi/co-op/anywhere in the market place, go to Whitby for the day, have fish and chips and an ice cream (its the law!), get train back and spend nowt on the NYMR.

Even the footplate crews don't get time to go to the NYMR cafes sometimes as some diagrams say "PNB break on shed".

 

[12LDA28C]

Long term it would probably be easier to reinstate the track between Norton Fitzwarren and Taunton. Used to be 4 track all the way.

There are also a pair of unused bay platforms which they could run into. Be separate from Network Rail then.

If you mean the bays at Taunton, they are regularly used for stabling of track machines as well as diesel locos from charter trains.

 

[Ashley Hill]

If you mean the bays at Taunton, they are regularly used for stabling of track machines as well as diesel locos from charter trains.

I think @12LDA28C means the disused bays adjacent to P5 which are currently being turned into some sort of garden.
If the old Up Relief alignment was used from Norton Fitzwarren to the station the WSR could run into those bays independently of NR. Won’t be cheap though.

 

[D Williams]

Yes, that is the longer term answer (above) Relay the separate track to the Minehead bay (as was). Then, operations are self contained.
GWR can operate to/from Bristol if they wan

Having seen first hand the some of the hoops the NYMR have had to jump through to get regular services to Whitby, I can see why this might be a non starter. To run on Network Rail:

1. the heritage railway has to be registered as a TOC.
2. The engines and stock have to be mainline registered eg. The LNERCA teak set can't run to Whitby.
The locos may need some or all of GSM-R, AWS, TPWS and OTMR. Some locos are banned from network rail altogether eg 9Fs.
The coaches will need some sort of CDL system
4. All the traincrew need a Network Rail medical. Network Rail doesn't differentiate between drivers and fireman so all fireman undergo the same medical as drivers from the big TOCs eg ECG monitoring etc.
5. The fitter who inspects the steam loco before lighting it up can't be the same person as conducts the network rail fitnesss to run. This is fine if the loco starts at Grosmont but not good if it starts at New Bridge (Pickering). It means that an extra person has to come from Grosmont every morning to do the FTR. So that's at least a couple of hours of somebody's shift lost that could be spent overhauling locos.

There is an ongoing big debate amongst NYMR staff and volunteers whether running to Whitby is worth it. Revenue is certainly up but so are costs. A new management position seems to be created every month. Sometimes it feels that we are a park n' ride to Whitby with many passengers not spending any time at the NYMR stations.

There is an ongoing big debate amongst NYMR staff and volunteers whether running to Whitby is worth it. Revenue is certainly up but so are costs. A new management position seems to be created every month. Sometimes it feels that we are a park n' ride to Whitby with many passengers not spending any time at the NYMR stations.

I've heard this said in the past but is there any substance to it? The NYMR, particularly with the way the tickets are pushed, has become a Pickering to Whitby railway . There was the bust up at Levisham that was brushed under the carpet. I wonder what the average volunteer thinks about it? I have visited and paid for the car park but wouldn't travel as I don't want to go to Whitby, don't want to pay the exorbitant cost of a travel ticket and don't want to be jammed into a full train back from Whitby. At least you can always find a seat on the WSR!

 

[norbitonflyer]

Sounds like a job for Go-op.

GoOp's fourth proposal, in 2021, was to do just that: Bishops Lydeard - Taunton -Westbury - Swindon
https://www.wiltshiretimes.co.uk/ne...M3YTZI&state=89cc11a0480b485190df5e0f3b5e305b

Their most recent proposal (the fifth) omits Bishops Lydeard though.

 

[Cowley]

I think @12LDA28C means the disused bays adjacent to P5 which are currently being turned into some sort of garden.
If the old Up Relief alignment was used from Norton Fitzwarren to the station the WSR could run into those bays independently of NR. Won’t be cheap though.

Isn’t part of the issue with reinstating the relief (slow?) line to do with the mains needing to be slewed over to get everything under the bridge? Basically not a simple job.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Isn’t part of the issue with reinstating the relief (slow?) line to do with the mains needing to be slewed over to get everything under the bridge? Basically not a simple job.

Slow line? This is the GWR! Silkmill Crossing was replaced with an overbridge some years ago - not sure if it is wide enough to accommodate an additional track.

 

[Cowley]

Slow line? This is the GWR! Silkmill Crossing was replaced with an overbridge some years ago - not sure if it is wide enough to accommodate an additional track.

Yes I thought that the bridge was built wide enough to take another track (even a fast one ) but that it would involve slewing the other lines over to accommodate it. In other words a very complicated and expensive bit of work?

 

[duffield]

Yes I thought that the bridge was built wide enough to take another track (even a fast one ) but that it would involve slewing the other lines over to accommodate it. In other words a very complicated and expensive bit of work?

And moving some equipment cabinets, as I remember it. Probably means cables buried in the "wrong" places too...

I really can't see it happening, unless there's some other reason for re-modelling the whole area at some point.

 

[Harpo]

The cost of that work might just be a single figure sum. With a ‘m’ after it.