The last mixed traffic services?

[alexl92]

I’m curious to know when the last mixed-traffic trains ran in the uk - that is, trains with both passenger and goods vehicles in the same consist. I know some MK1 DMUs used to haul a milk tanker or a box van in rural areas. When did this end? Was it widespread after the end of steam or did it only happen in a few specific places?

 

[Mag_seven]

There was a mixed train that ran between Inverness and Aberdeen a few years back (1980s I think) - it was a passenger train with some container vehicles attached.

 

[341o2]

Still operating on Hythe pier, where fuel for the ferries is transported to the pier head

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Fuel oil tanks to Mallaig pre 156's put on the route ?

 

[scarby]

A DMU transported a mail van, some kind of CCT or GUV as I believe it is called, from York to Scarborough and back with the town's in and outgoing mail, certainly into the early 1980s or thereabouts if I recall correctly. I believe this was quite common practice around the country until mail transport was mainly switched to road.

 

[111-111-1]

Lots still on Ratiche Bahn Switzerland.

 

[delt1c]

A DMU transported a mail van, some kind of CCT or GUV as I believe it is called, from York to Scarborough and back with the town's in and outgoing mail, certainly into the early 1980s or thereabouts if I recall correctly. I believe this was quite common practice around the country until mail transport was mainly switched to road.

There were quite a few DMU’s and a few EMU’s converted for parcels traffic in the 80’s were these ever attached to scheduled passenger services ?

 

[hexagon789]

TTA tankers on some WHL were the last regular "mixed" trains on BR, there may well have been some one offs beyond this

 

[Andy R. A.]

There was a mixed train that ran between Inverness and Aberdeen a few years back (1980s I think) - it was a passenger train with some container vehicles attached.

Fortunately someone had recorded these workings on Flickr

Train crew chat as 37261 stands at Inverness with the mixed freight/passenger 1735 to Wick. Behind 37114 is waiting to work the 1755 to Kyle on 15th October 1984

Another Scottish innovation which won't be seen again - mixed freight & passenger traffic. A re-scanned negative.

www.flickr.com

 

[ainsworth74]

There was a mixed train that ran between Inverness and Aberdeen a few years back (1980s I think) - it was a passenger train with some container vehicles attached.

I'm not sure 30 - 40 years ago qualifies as a "few years back" anymore

 

[Kendalian]

I saw a photo recently on a local Facebook page showing the last running of the Barrow-London sleeper in May 1990; it had a mail van as the first "coach".

 

[matchmaker]

Fortunately someone had recorded these workings on Flickr

Train crew chat as 37261 stands at Inverness with the mixed freight/passenger 1735 to Wick. Behind 37114 is waiting to work the 1755 to Kyle on 15th October 1984

Another Scottish innovation which won't be seen again - mixed freight & passenger traffic. A re-scanned negative.

www.flickr.com

I think - but may be wrong - that that service may have been in relation to the manufacture of fridges somewhere near Wick? Relying on memory alone...

 

[Cowley]

I’ve got a couple of photos on my phone of mixed trains on the Barnstaple line.
I’m not sure where this one was from but it’s a DMU hauling a van at Eggesford:


And I think think this was from the Derby Sulzers site. A pair of 25s at Newton st Cyres with passenger coaches, parcels van, and I think some Fruit Ds bringing up the rear.


Both late 70s/early 80s photos (and not mine obviously).

 

[delt1c]

I’ve got a couple of photos on my phone of mixed trains on the Barnstaple line.
I’m not sure where this one was from but it’s a DMU hauling a van at Eggesford:
View attachment 78553

And I think think this was from the Derby Sulzers site. A pair of 25s at Newton st Cyres with passenger coaches, parcels van, and I think some Fruit Ds bringing up the rear.
View attachment 78552

Both late 70s/early 80s photos (and not mine obviously).

Most likely the Fruit vans were being used for parcels. During the 70’s there were many vans converted for parcels. These include ex fish vans, ex pre grouping BG’s with gangways removes ( even some 6 wheelers). Best though was ex SR elephant vans. The 70’s was a spotters paradise with so much variety to be seen far and wide

 

[30907]

Tail traffic on DMU workings of parcels vans and other NPCCS (Non Passenger Carrying Coaching Stock) was common into the 70s and maybe longer.
True Mixed trains, which could in principle convey non-fitted stock and were limited to 25mph IIRC, ended with the 1600-ish Ft Wm to Mallaig and return for oil tanks mentioned above (though the TTA was fitted and I'm sure the 25 restriction didn't apply - sadly there was no tail traffic wuen I used it!).
Were the Far North container workings classed as Mixed in the WTT, I'd be interested to know?

 

[Clarence Yard]

That's not a mixed train in the two pictures above as it's comprised entirely of "passenger" stock, as opposed to one that has a formation including both "freight" and "passenger" rated stock, which is what gives you the definition. LHCS Parcels Vans attached to passenger trains, both LHCS and DMU, was quite a commonplace sight.

I believe the Scottish Region, as was, was the last real bastion of regular mixed train working.

 

[Cowley]

That's not a mixed train in the two pictures above as it's comprised entirely of "passenger" stock, as opposed to one that has a formation including both "freight" and "passenger" rated stock, which is what gives you the definition. LHCS Parcels Vans attached to passenger trains, both LHCS and DMU, was quite a commonplace sight.

I believe the Scottish Region, as was, was the last real bastion of regular mixed train working.

Ah fair enough. Thanks for that @Clarence Yard.

Erm. I suppose it’s probably a good time to mention that I actually started a thread on this a few years ago that I’d completely forgotten about..?

Here it is:

DMUs hauling freight/parcels vehicles

Hello folks. I'm wondering if anyone has any memories or even photographic evidence of DMU mixed trains that they've seen in the 70s or early 80s? I definitely remember seeing them with a parcels van in tow a couple of times when I was very young. Would they have ever had a milk tanker or other...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[curly42]

Here's one of the Scottish services -

West Highland Scene.

It's April 1987,and class 37 no. 37407 "Loch Long" is seen in the Glenfinnan area with a service for Mallaig.Note the refrigerated van on the rear.

www.flickr.com

A Fort William to Mallaig working with a refrigerated van attached.Taken in April 1987.

 

[Cowley]

Here's one of the Scottish services -

West Highland Scene.

It's April 1987,and class 37 no. 37407 "Loch Long" is seen in the Glenfinnan area with a service for Mallaig.Note the refrigerated van on the rear.

www.flickr.com

A Fort William to Mallaig working with a refrigerated van attached.Taken in April 1987.

I just got lost looking through his photos. If anyone’s got a spare half hour I highly recommend it.

 

[alexl92]

Wow. Thanks everyone, many fascinating answers and some great photos to go wtih it. Really appreciate every response!

 

[43096]

Lots still on Ratiche Bahn Switzerland.

Certainly are!

 

[Cowley]

Certainly are!
View attachment 78573

Oh wow. I need a cold shower after seeing that!

 

[43096]

Oh wow. I need a cold shower after seeing that!

Would a jump in a snowdrift help?


In all seriousness, the Rhätische Bahn is a must do for any rail enthusiast. Quite the most wonderful railway, running through an absolutely outrageously spectacular part of the world.

 

[Peter C]

I've seen photos of Network SouthEast Class 50-hauled Cotswold Line services in the 1980s/90s which had a Mk1 full-brake coach at one end for parcels. Would this count? Apparently this was common practice to attach a full brake (I think it's classified as a BG - Brake Guard) coach to the end of a Cotswold Line train (so Hereford or Worcester-bound) running from London Paddington, right up until the end of loco-hauled services* on the route.

-Peter

*(excluding Class 43 HST sets)

 

[ChiefPlanner]

As MOD Contract Manager I ran a Ramsgate to Pembroke Dock one day with a pair of 33's , 2 MK1 coaches for officers and other ranks and about 15 loaded warflats with (German) armoured vehicles.

Caused a few heads to be turned at Clapham Junction I am told. About 1984.

 

[Cowley]

Would a jump in a snowdrift help?


In all seriousness, the Rhätische Bahn is a must do for any rail enthusiast. Quite the most wonderful railway, running through an absolutely outrageously spectacular part of the world.

It’s now on my list to do...

 

[hexagon789]

Tail traffic on DMU workings of parcels vans and other NPCCS (Non Passenger Carrying Coaching Stock) was common into the 70s and maybe longer.
True Mixed trains, which could in principle convey non-fitted stock and were limited to 25mph IIRC, ended with the 1600-ish Ft Wm to Mallaig and return for oil tanks mentioned above (though the TTA was fitted and I'm sure the 25 restriction didn't apply - sadly there was no tail traffic wuen I used it!).
Were the Far North container workings classed as Mixed in the WTT, I'd be interested to know?

My 1977 Scottish Region Sectional appendix (with 1979 ammendments booklet) says in respect of the Mallaig line under local instructions that fitted freight vehicles (4 or 6-wheeled) of not less than 15ft wheelbase may be worked in passenger trains on the line. On the speed restrictions pages there are no further restrictions given to speeds of certain classes of train nor is any speed restriction listed in the local instructions.

Presumably then normal linespeed was permissible for the mixed trains on this route?

 

[hexagon789]

In all seriousness, the Rhätische Bahn is a must do for any rail enthusiast. Quite the most wonderful railway, running through an absolutely outrageously spectacular part of the world.

It’s now on my list to do...

Mine too, along with far too many other routes/systems but that would fill too many threads!

 

[Peter Mugridge]

As MOD Contract Manager I ran a Ramsgate to Pembroke Dock one day with a pair of 33's , 2 MK1 coaches for officers and other ranks and about 15 loaded warflats with (German) armoured vehicles.

Caused a few heads to be turned at Clapham Junction I am told. About 1984.

Did the 33s run through or were they swapped for something else somewhere on the way? During reversal at Exeter maybe if it ran via the Honiton route?

 

[111-111-1]

Did the 33s run through or were they swapped for something else somewhere on the way? During reversal at Exeter maybe if it ran via the Honiton route?

Strange route to West Whales if it went via Exeter!