Todmorden Curve

[Baxenden Bank]

"Operational in May" as stated by Flying Claret on the "Todmorden Chord" thread is surely only likely to be making reference to the long-delayed rail service. Or are there other matters upon this thread that it could also be making reference to?

Now then, 'operational', what does that actually mean?

Are we talking hourly trains throughout the day, or merely that the track and signalling is complete and available for use but no services are actually using it?

When I see an actual timetable, with a start date, confirmed on Northern's website or similar, then I 'May' believe it. Even then it could be cancelled at the last minute for 'unforeseen operational reasons' I suppose.

I shall remain a devoted customer of The Lancashire Way however.

 

[Darren R]

Call me over-cautious, but I can't help noticing that this announcement was made by the acting Chief Executive of Burnley Council to the august body known as Burnley Bondholders (anyone know who they are, by the way?) The two organisations that matter - Northern and Network Rail - refused to comment, other than to confirm May is when the timetables change (which is hardly a State Secret!)

I think I want something more concrete than a local newspaper reporting that the temporary head of a council has told some invited local businessmen it's going to happen before I get excited.

 

[Flying Claret]

MidnightFlyer - thanks for posting the link, I wasnt sure how to do it from my phone. Its not great at copy and paste.

 

[WatcherZero]

Supposed to be available for driver training from this month.

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

The Todmorden Curve infrastructure should be running on February 9th. Driver training starting shortly afterwards.
From Accrington Observer.

 

[thealexweb]

I presume it is going to be full to bursting with Blackburn passengers trying to avoid Bolton during the Farmworth tunnel works?

 

[Haywain]

Call me over-cautious, but I can't help noticing that this announcement was made by the acting Chief Executive of Burnley Council to the august body known as Burnley Bondholders (anyone know who they are, by the way?) The two organisations that matter - Northern and Network Rail - refused to comment, other than to confirm May is when the timetables change (which is hardly a State Secret!)

I think I want something more concrete than a local newspaper reporting that the temporary head of a council has told some invited local businessmen it's going to happen before I get excited.

And what difference would it make if the same statement had come from the permanently appointed Chief Executive? Just curious as to why you would think that there is somehow less knowledge of this because of being the acting Chief Executive.

 

[Darren R]

And what difference would it make if the same statement had come from the permanently appointed Chief Executive? Just curious as to why you would think that there is somehow less knowledge of this because of being the acting Chief Executive.

I was working on the theory that the average council run by someone permanent in charge doesn't know it's elbow from sundry other anatomical items!

It probably doesn't make any difference (although there may be circumstances where it might - such as if he's hankering after the job permanently and thinks an announcement such as this might boost his chances.) My point was more in terms of urging caution over an "opening-date announcement" that may be nothing of the sort.

Train crew training is more positive and tangible news.

 

[spongsdad]

I was working on the theory that the average council run by someone permanent in charge doesn't know it's elbow from sundry other anatomical items!

It probably doesn't make any difference (although there may be circumstances where it might - such as if he's hankering after the job permanently and thinks an announcement such as this might boost his chances.) My point was more in terms of urging caution over an "opening-date announcement" that may be nothing of the sort.

Train crew training is more positive and tangible news.

Burnley has a new CEO. one Pamela Smith. This would have been known by the acting CEO at the time the "announcement" was made. He therefore had nothing to gain by sexing up the information.
Having said that, as followers of this thread know, there have been too many false dawns in this saga for anyone to be other than sceptical about any forecast of a service commencement date. I shall revert to the old adage of "Seeing is believing"

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Will we see Northern Rail go all out in their efforts to provide rolling stock with wifi and comfortable seating of the same type used and enjoyed by bus passengers on the X43 "The Witch Way" service and for those intending rail passengers faced with a half-mile uphill walk from their disembarkation points at Burnley bus station, will Northern Rail provide a free shuttle bus service from there to Burnley Manchester Road railway station?

 

[northwichcat]

Will we see Northern Rail go all out in their efforts to provide rolling stock with wifi and comfortable seating of the same type used and enjoyed by bus passengers on the X43 "The Witch Way" service and for those intending rail passengers faced with a half-mile uphill walk from their disembarkation points at Burnley bus station, will Northern Rail provide a free shuttle bus service from there to Burnley Manchester Road railway station?

Repeating what I posted in another thread Northern's franchise agreement says

The Franchisee shall maintain the composition of the Train Fleet during the Franchise Term, unless the Secretary of State otherwise agrees, such that there are no changes to the Train Fleet, including changes:
16.1.1 to the classes or types;
16.1.2 to the interior configurations; or
16.1.3 which may reduce the journey time capabilities,

So they have a choice of 142s, 144s, 150s, 153s, 155s, 156s and 158s with their current interiors. However, we know Northern reserve the 144s, 155s and 158s for Yorkshire diagrams (we're talking about a North West diagram even if Todmorden is in Yorkshire) so that leaves a choice of 142s, 150s, 153s and 156s with their current interiors.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Update from TfGM

Network Rail has announced that there will be a delay to the completion of
the North West Electrification programme between Manchester and
Liverpool because of unforeseen engineering problems. Electrification was
not commissioned between Liverpool and Earlestown for the December timetable change and is now expected to be completed in early March
2015. Class 319 electric units will be introduced within the existing service
structure once the electrified route is available, starting with Liverpool –
Manchester Airport services. Once these are introduced, cascaded diesel
units will be available for use on Todmorden services and for additional
strengthening on Bolton services.
...
Members may recall that the 500 metre long Todmorden Curve, funded by
Regional Growth Fund funding, bid for and received by Burnley Borough
Council, has been built to re-instate a direct link between the Manchester
to Bradford and the Preston to Todmorden routes. This will enable direct
services to operate between Manchester and Burnley (and beyond), and it
is expected that these will commence with the introduction of the May
2015 timetable. Lancashire County Council, will take the revenue risk on
the new services

 

[spongsdad]

Will we see Northern Rail go all out in their efforts to provide rolling stock with wifi and comfortable seating of the same type used and enjoyed by bus passengers on the X43 "The Witch Way" service and for those intending rail passengers faced with a half-mile uphill walk from their disembarkation points at Burnley bus station, will Northern Rail provide a free shuttle bus service from there to Burnley Manchester Road railway station?

No.

 

[Viscount702]

Did the work to complete the commissioning of the Curve go ahead and is it now fully operational if not actually in use due lack of stock.

 

[PHILIPE]

Lack of stock to operate the service.

 

[Starmill]

Have we got anything concrete on the infrastructure? It's 100% complete?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Have we got anything concrete on the infrastructure?

Only steel and aluminium hopefully.

 

[spongsdad]

I may be a little behind the curve here (sorry, no pun intended) but I noticed this news item on Northern Rail's website. It's dated Feb 4th so I guess others may well have already seen it. What caught my eye was the reference to the new Blackburn-Manchester via Todmorden service commencing in May. The fact that it is on Northern's site does, I suppose give the statement some quasi official status, so I suppose we can be cautiously optimistic that things will happen in May
http://www.northernrail.org/news/7593

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I may be a little behind the curve here (sorry, no pun intended) but I noticed this news item on Northern Rail's website. It's dated Feb 4th so I guess others may well have already seen it. What caught my eye was the reference to the new Blackburn-Manchester via Todmorden service commencing in May. The fact that it is on Northern's site does, I suppose give the statement some quasi official status, so I suppose we can be cautiously optimistic that things will happen in May
http://www.northernrail.org/news/7593

It's possible that stock might be found to run a service via the curve during the Farnworth tunnel works, but that might lead to the unfortunate situation of the service starting, then needing to be withdrawn due to stock shortages before finally starting permanently!

 

[Emyr]

It's possible that stock might be found to run a service via the curve during the Farnworth tunnel works, but that might lead to the unfortunate situation of the service starting, then needing to be withdrawn due to stock shortages before finally starting permanently!

Call it a pilot scheme

 

[PHILIPE]

Or call it a diversion due to the line closed through Farnworth tunnel !!!
Might get away with that.

 

[Class 170101]

Have we got anything concrete on the infrastructure? It's 100% complete?

Perhaps someone can have a look and see if the signal that allows access onto the chord from Burnley end has had its feathers unbagged. They were bagged when I was up there in Autumn 2014. Unbagged feathers means available for use, I would suggest.

 

[Ships]

Only steel and aluminium hopefully.

I would hope for some concrete sleepers/bearers.

 

[Ploughman]

Maybe a few wooden ones as well.

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Maybe a few wooden ones as well.

That is no way to talk about Network Rail

 

[The Lad]

I think that it is in use to turn back a Manchester Victoria (ish)- Todmorden service arriving xx30 and departing xx50.

 

[Deerfold]

I think that it is in use to turn back a Manchester Victoria (ish)- Todmorden service arriving xx30 and departing xx50.

Yes, but that's been happening for a while - we know this end of the curve is done, it's the other end that's the problem.

 

[northwichcat]

Yes, but that's been happening for a while - we know this end of the curve is done, it's the other end that's the problem.

One train recently did Burnley-Manchester (or was it Manchester-Burnley?) There was an issue where the signalling hadn't been done for both directions, making it a bit like the Halton Curve.

 

[Deerfold]

One train recently did Burnley-Manchester (or was it Manchester-Burnley?) There was an issue where the signalling hadn't been done for both directions, making it a bit like the Halton Curve.

Indeed there was. Still doesn't get us any closer to knowing if the signalling is finished yet.

 

[Elecman]

I understand the signalling is now complete and route signed in

 

[Signal Head]

I understand the signalling is now complete and route signed in

It is, see last photo on this page (Hall Royd Junction website), which shows up direction routes set and signals cleared.