TPE - "Essential travel only" Friday 23rd June.

[stevieinselby]

Tightening up the PG cancellation get out clause so that it couldn't be used outside of normal rostering timescales would be a big boost, rather than the current theoretical 22:00 on the previous day, which is far too late for many passengers, and in my experience gets abused anyway. In return I know some TDAs who refuse to do TPE PGs on principle, even if they might eventually get recoded that way.

Agreed. Far better to have a reduced timetable that is in place every day for a defined period so that passengers know what to expect, rather than the random short-notice cancellations all over the place that we've been having.

 

[trainophile]

They really don't seem to know what's going on do they?

https://twitter.com/TPEassist/status/1672625926159343617

(^Twitter link from 3 hours ago to someone asking about travel on 22nd July and being told "Hi there, there are currently no strike dates announced.")

Another tweeter put them right on the three dates in July, to be replied with:

"These are days that staff are not required to work rest days therefore strike timetables will not be in place at the moment but on the day disruption should be expected".

Is it me?

 

[ComUtoR]

Another tweeter put them right on the three dates in July,

Are they 'Strike Days' ?

to be replied with:

"These are days that staff are not required to work rest days therefore strike timetables will not be in place at the moment but on the day disruption should be expected".

There is a difference between 'Action short of a strike' and 'Strike'

Is it me?

If there is no actual strike, then TPE are correct. Can you confirm what is actually happening on those days. Clarity here would be important.

 

[eastwestdivide]

So now to add to the farce all mk5s are out of action until a full inspection for cracks have taken place. 4 sets are stranded at Scarborough.

Are they all out of action? There was a Mk5 set in service at Meadowhall this afternoon about 1700 heading for Sheffield.

 

[trainophile]

Are they 'Strike Days' ?




There is a difference between 'Action short of a strike' and 'Strike'



If there is no actual strike, then TPE are correct. Can you confirm what is actually happening on those days. Clarity here would be important.

Everything you need to know about September rail strikes

Aslef and RMT unions are staging fresh strikes as disputes appear deadlocked

www.independent.co.uk

The RMT, which began striking on 21 June 2022, has called three more days of walk-outs in July: Thursday 20, Saturday 22 and Saturday 29.

Am I missing something? Sounds like a strike days announcement to me.

 

[CAF397]

Are they all out of action? There was a Mk5 set in service at Meadowhall this afternoon about 1700 heading for Sheffield.

If cracks need checking, that set was probably checked on Longsight before it entered service this morning.

The other Mk5s at Scarborough are not "maintained", only serviced, so presumably someone from CAF with ultrasonic equipment will need to attend, or they have a one way ticket to a maintenance depot.

 

[Krokodil]

But this sounds in itself like an ideological position. If the issue were simply the incompetence or active malice of state actors, all TOCs would be affected equally, but few of them are in the same dire state as Trans Pennine services.

There's an element of luck. Some operators had sorted out their recruitment before the start of the pandemic so had a bit more leeway than those who were already short of staff.

 

[ComUtoR]

Am I missing something? Sounds like a strike days announcement to me.

Neither party here is being 100% open. The strike days (thanks for posting) are RMT days. I don't work for TPE. I'm not aware of how they run.

Will they be running services or are they 100% Guard operated or do they run DOO so it will be more of a 'Disruption'. to their services ?

 

[Silenos]

There's an element of luck. Some operators had sorted out their recruitment before the start of the pandemic so had a bit more leeway than those who were already short of staff.

That may be so, but it seems from various comments made by people who appear to be in a position to know that in the case of TPE there is also a very large element of poor management, contributing to those same recruitment problems.

 

[DanNCL]

Will they be running services or are they 100% Guard operated or do they run DOO so it will be more of a 'Disruption'. to their services ?

TPE is 100% guard operated.

 

[Mat17]

Nobody is surprised.

The people who thought that transfering operations to the state would solve all the problems of the railways are blinkered by their obsession with ideology. The DFT are and always have been a large part of the problem. Simply giving them more control was never going to achieve what some people would have you believe.

Over the past number of years the TOCs have been used as a shield by the DFT. The DFT dictating things behind the scene and making decisions on many things that result in things that the public then blame the TOCs for, despite the fact the DFT are pulling the strings behind the scenes and the DFT themselves are often operating on a political whim to their Government paymasters rather than what's best for me and you.

This has allowed the DFT to nationalise the praise and privatise the blame for too long, but seems even now some people still haven't cottoned on.

You have it in a nutshell. As I've always said Beeching could only happen under Nationalisation. Bean counters running the whole thing and their only consideration is, "how much will it cost and how cheap can we make it?"

 

[Snow1964]

There's an element of luck. Some operators had sorted out their recruitment before the start of the pandemic so had a bit more leeway than those who were already short of staff.

Not sure recruitment is luck.

Ever since HR Human Resources was invented about 3 or 4 decades ago, the clue is in the title Resources. There one function is to plan and ensure sufficient trained staff are employed and able to do the job, to provide the required Human Resources needed.

Fundamental rail timetable changes (not minor tweaks) take at least 2-3 years, the age (retirement) profile of staff is known.. Good HR even anticipate some minor changes (someone is bound to retire early, or move away etc.).

Not knowing the staff level required to operate 2023 summer timetable isn't some unplanned guess, it was known at least 2 years ago (probably nearer 3-4 years ago). So not getting the resources in place is just bad management.

 

[CAF397]

HR don't deploy drivers onto routes though. TPE has more drivers than they have ever had, it's just the drive shorter routes than they have ever had before. It is the Planning department who allocate drivers by the allocation of work.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Having dealt with the planning department managers that is exactly where I would point the finger of blame along with the senior managers above them that signed off these decisions

 

[noddingdonkey]

Was bringing in FOC drivers as route conductors not an option here?

 

[Krokodil]

Not sure recruitment is luck.

The timing was luck. Some operators would have ended up in a similar predicament if the pandemic had happened a year earlier.

 

[fabs]

Perhaps this is reason enough for Chris Jackson and OLR/DfT to have a clearout, not just of that senior management & directors, but going beyond that now right down towards middle and local management too.

Why stop there? Let’s do a total review of all the personnel that have contributed. Including the ‘tactical route review’ submitters, the ones that stop training by refusing cab access leaving you catching the 9 hour 0230 start.

Let’s get rid of those telling lies in the mess room and whipping up a frenzy (anyone been told what the 7 AORs were that were voted on yet?). Allow the business to actually go after the obvious sick notes rather than have the union defend them to the hilt.
Actually support TPE in trying to get those that haven’t turned a wheel in 3 years instead of threatening managers with some kind of action every time they try and get them to work.

Let’s vote out our reps who never drive and claim overtime every release day (10 hours) during a dispute when we are all losing money.

Do that and get rid of those managers that have been responsible for this.

Yeah me too, with word spreading a certain junior manager collecting grieviances as if they are labels of honour is getting promoted into a senior role

No one is perfect but as an outsider this looks and smells like a bullying campaign. First one or two maybe, but beyond that; have you seen what some of the ‘complaints’ are. RMT have turned that into a joke.

 

[mike57]

Looking at recent posts regarding the culture within TPE it is fairly obviously toxic. I am not going to point fingers to blame, as beyond a couple of acquaintances who have now both left I dont have any knowledge to come to a judgement, but a couple of more general observations:

• In any other industry a company that had failed as badly as TPE would be bankrupt and out of business, and everyone from the MD to the lowest grades would be looking for jobs, with just statutory redundancy pay, as that is all you get if a company fails and receivers are appointed. This realisation will also serve as a brake on the more 'outspoken' elements at all levels in the business.
• In any toxic situation there are usually a number of contributers who all feed off each other, it is rare for it to be one manager or one staff representative, so whilst more or less blame may placed on various people it is never 100% one person or group of people.
• There seems to be no real penalty for failure with in the rail industry, OK so franchises or similar may be lost or won, but overall the majority it goes on as before. This leads back to my first point, as people can act as badly as they like knowing they will still have a job.

Which leads to my final point, the TPE operation is heavily subsidised by the taxpayer. As a taxpayer I am fine with subsidies, even for services I dont use, if they are seen as 'in the national interest' but I do have an issue with subsidies which end up being wasted and the service which they were meant to provide not operating in any useful manner, which has been the case with TPE since May 2018, with a small respite during the height of Covid.

 

[scarby]

Looking at recent posts regarding the culture within TPE it is fairly obviously toxic. I am not going to point fingers to blame, as beyond a couple of acquaintances who have now both left I dont have any knowledge to come to a judgement, but a couple of more general observations:

• In any other industry a company that had failed as badly as TPE would be bankrupt and out of business, and everyone from the MD to the lowest grades would be looking for jobs, with just statutory redundancy pay, as that is all you get if a company fails and receivers are appointed. This realisation will also serve as a brake on the more 'outspoken' elements at all levels in the business.
• In any toxic situation there are usually a number of contributers who all feed off each other, it is rare for it to be one manager or one staff representative, so whilst more or less blame may placed on various people it is never 100% one person or group of people.
• There seems to be no real penalty for failure with in the rail industry, OK so franchises or similar may be lost or won, but overall the majority it goes on as before. This leads back to my first point, as people can act as badly as they like knowing they will still have a job.

Which leads to my final point, the TPE operation is heavily subsidised by the taxpayer. As a taxpayer I am fine with subsidies, even for services I dont use, if they are seen as 'in the national interest' but I do have an issue with subsidies which end up being wasted and the service which they were meant to provide not operating in any useful manner, which has been the case with TPE since May 2018, with a small respite during the height of Covid.

I have just taken a trip to Ostende, which I think it is very fair to say is very comparable to Scarborough as a destination.

Three trains arrive from Bruges and onward starting points per hour and the ones we travelled on were TEN coach trains.

There also appear to be numerous trains in reserve occupying sidings, which of course we have been told the UK's railways "can't afford to have sitting around doing nothing".

On Sunday I went up to the station in the morning to buy the tickets back for the next day just at the right time to see one of these trains disgorge absolutely hundreds upon hundreds of day-trippers.

That's the type of summer service that they should be offering for York-Scarborough, and when I read of the sheer shambles post May 2018, which has now gone on for FIVE years, I can only despair.

 

[Taunton]

People are not there to move their lives around to fit the needs of the rail system.

This will come as a considerable surprise to some on the railway. In no small part to quite a number who post here.

 

[mike57]

UK's railways "can't afford to have sitting around doing nothing".

Unfortunately this is part of the race to the bottom caused by the bean counters going for cheap short term solutions to 'save' money

Examples:

• The current TPE arrangements with multiple crew changes
• TPE running 3 new and one existing fleet rather than one (or may be two) large common fleet
• Previous decisions to reduce the 185s from 4 to 3 car.
• Further afield the requirement to squeeze as much out of rolling stock as possible, at the expense of passenger comfort, reduced luggage space etc. Compare that with various other rail systems on the continent where there even things like family areas.
• Again further afield, 220/1s replacing much longer units.
• Demographic trends which means there is a need to maintain a flow of new recruits to replace those retiring etc. But accountants wont invest because its a long term thing and the results will not be felt during their tenure.

Everything seems to be cut back to the point where it 'just' works and no more, and of course when circumstances change it is then found wanting, and over the hopefully 30 - 40 year life with refurbs of railway rolling stock needs will change. With the current lease arrangements no thought is given to future use.

In TPE's case these issues have bitten them badly, but they were all foreseen by various posters on here, so the TPE/DfT/Whoever managers who signed off on things need some harsh questions asking as to their competancy.

No doubt others could add to this list.

 

[MontyP]

It looks (so far) as if all 19 scheduled TPE departures from Hull will run today, all the way to their scheduled destinations as well. When was the last time this happened?

 

[Silenos]

Looking at recent posts regarding the culture within TPE it is fairly obviously toxic. I am not going to point fingers to blame, as beyond a couple of acquaintances who have now both left I dont have any knowledge to come to a judgement, but a couple of more general observations:

• In any other industry a company that had failed as badly as TPE would be bankrupt and out of business, and everyone from the MD to the lowest grades would be looking for jobs, with just statutory redundancy pay, as that is all you get if a company fails and receivers are appointed. This realisation will also serve as a brake on the more 'outspoken' elements at all levels in the business.
• There seems to be no real penalty for failure with in the rail industry, OK so franchises or similar may be lost or won, but overall the majority it goes on as before. This leads back to my first point, as people can act as badly as they like knowing they will still have a job.

Which leads to my final point, the TPE operation is heavily subsidised by the taxpayer. As a taxpayer I am fine with subsidies, even for services I dont use, if they are seen as 'in the national interest' but I do have an issue with subsidies which end up being wasted and the service which they were meant to provide not operating in any useful manner, which has been the case with TPE since May 2018, with a small respite during the height of Covid.

To be fair, at the highest management levels there is little or no penalty for failure in other commercial businesses either. CEs come in, run businesses into the ground, and fail upwards to their next lucrative appointment and set of directorships. While in politics…

 

[Krokodil]

Unfortunately this is part of the race to the bottom caused by the bean counters going for cheap short term solutions to 'save' money

It goes back further than privatisation. BR had a two-for-three policy.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

I jave always argued that theres no demand for a service because we don't provide a service. Look at the newcastle-edinburgh shuttles stopping at all the intetmediate stations (morpeth, alnmouth, berwick, reston, dunbar and soon east linton). LNER and XC only serve one or two of these stations per hour at the most. Yet now there is a shuttle I have seen an increase in people using it in between those intermediate stations as they are a lot quicker than the route 505 bus.
York-scaborough shuttles used to see a 3 car duplicate in front of the service train because it would already be full and standing from leeds. We COULD be meeting the demand but we simply dont. 153s may not be disability compliant but couoled to a 158 shouldnt be an issue. Where theres a will theres a way but the current railway industry has no will whatsoever

 

[AndrewE]

It goes back further than privatisation. BR had a two-for-three policy.

I think BR was told it could only have money to modernise if it did it on a 2-for-3 basis. Which is a bit different to

BR had a two-for-three policy.

 

[Krokodil]

It's the same thing, the holders of the purse strings are the same as they were then.