Train hits car,woman killed.

[merlodlliw]

Train hits car on level crossing (BBC Wales News)

A train has struck a car on a level crossing in Gwynedd, say British Transport Police.
The incident happened on the Cambrian Coast railway line at Penrhyndeudraeth on a minor road which accesses farmland.
Officers were called to the scene at 1146 BST on Wednesday.
Two fire crews have been called to the scene from Porthmadog and Blaenau Ffestiniog.


Later announced one woman killed.

 

[SWT Driver]

Here's a direct link to the BBC News page: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/north_west/8233778.stm

 

[j0hn0]

natural selection at work there

 

[Aussie_Rail]

Does the level crossing in question have any warning lights, signs, bells, boom gates etc?

Also if it were dark, foggy or sun glare then it is possible that it was a terrible accident.

Are there laws in the UK regarding stopping at a level crossing then proceeding when it is clear?

 

[2030720310]

natural selection at work there

Why on earth do you find this funny??

 

[SWT Driver]

It's not...

For either the driver or the family of the bereaved.

 

[mumrar]

natural selection at work there

Whilst I'm always in agreement when we've got idiot trespassers, we don't know the circumstances of this incident yet. So until then I'm keeping an open mind. The level crossing rules in this country are simple. If it has a visual warning you wait regardless. If not, there'll be a telephone to communicate and you follow instructions given.

 

[merlodlliw]

Does the level crossing in question have any warning lights, signs, bells, boom gates etc?

Also if it were dark, foggy or sun glare then it is possible that it was a terrible accident.

Are there laws in the UK regarding stopping at a level crossing then proceeding when it is clear?

Good afternoon Australia.

I know this line very well, it would be signed and its just a farm track, as for
gates etc dont know, the great shame is this was not a timetabled train
on this very infrequent line, a train an hour Up & Down,on a two hourly
timetable. No uk Laws say stop at level crossings, the car driver is responsible
for looking before crossing, but this was an unexpected engine, but that's
no excuse, so that may rule out deliberate. How many times one wonders has this
been taken for granted no train expected at this time,great shame.

 

[The Snap]

Any idea of the loco involved? I doubt the photo the BBC has used is an accurate portrayal of the loco involved in the accident.

 

[GB]

*All vehicular level crossings will have some sort of a gate, be it barriers, wooden crossing gates, booms or in the case of farm crossings, user operated gates.

*In the case of "open" level crossings, these have no barriers but do have warning lights.

No uk Laws say stop at level crossings, the car driver is responsible

This is partly true. It is the car drivers responsability to stop and obey written and/or verbal instructions....which is law and you can be prosecuted for if you fail to comply

 

[anthony263]

Any idea of the loco involved? I doubt the photo the BBC has used is an accurate portrayal of the loco involved in the accident.

I think it was a network rail class 97

 

[the sniper]

natural selection at work there

Your out of order here mate, this doesn't look like someone up to no good, it was probably a tragic, unintentional accident.

It's got to be an open or user worked crossing, knowing that line.

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

Any idea of the loco involved? I doubt the photo the BBC has used is an accurate portrayal of the loco involved in the accident.

97303 reported

 

[Dai.]

Anyone else notice in the news article they've put

"A woman woman believed to be in her eighties has died after a train hit a car on a level crossing."

 

[Royston Vasey]

natural selection at work there

I find sniping at dead teenage trespassers on here distasteful enough, but regarding this unfortunate person, take a look at yourself.

Please don't claim that the wink meant you were being ironic.

 

[Phoenix]

natural selection at work there

You have just proved that you wont last long as far a forum Natural selection is involved cause after that well no one gonna be bothered with your opinions now that's funny.

But on a different note yes it was 97303 and by the looks of it the locomotive didn't come off that bad but condolences should go to the deceased and family.

 

[Old Timer]

Those of us who have had to deal with such situations out on the track do not hold such simple views.

Tonight someone has lost a Sister/Wife/Mother/Grandmother/Great Grandmother and I am sure will be very distraught by the circumstances of her passing.

There will also be others directly involved such as the train crew who will be as upset as everyone else.

Once again such things seem to be lost on those who comment from behind the distance and comfort of an anonymous Internet connection.

As with all things, such instances are not as cut and dried in many cases as people would seek to make out. No doubt a train running outside the normal timetable may well have been a factor but MOST people are human and errors of judgement are made.

Possibly she was not expecting a train to be about, maybe she looked and did not see it in time. Maybe she stalled her car when she saw the train coming.

Nothing can be certain until investigations are concluded.

A few on here could do well with attending a scene such as this and then attending the funeral afterwards.

I have had to represent the Railway at such occasions and I can assure you it is an extremely unpleasant experience, particularly where young children are attending.

Just a little compassion to someone who was not a vandal or a ne'r do well, but probably a cherished family member would be a little more fitting rather than inapproriate adolesecent half-thought out jibes and comments.

 

[Phoenix]

Those of us who have had to deal with such situations out on the track do not hold such simple views.

Tonight someone has lost a Sister/Wife/Mother/Grandmother/Great Grandmother and I am sure will be very distraught by the circumstances of her passing.

There will also be others directly involved such as the train crew who will be as upset as everyone else.

Once again such things seem to be lost on those who comment from behind the distance and comfort of an anonymous Internet connection.

As with all things, such instances are not as cut and dried in many cases as people would seek to make out. No doubt a train running outside the normal timetable may well have been a factor but MOST people are human and errors of judgement are made.

Possibly she was not expecting a train to be about, maybe she looked and did not see it in time. Maybe she stalled her car when she saw the train coming.

Nothing can be certain until investigations are concluded.

A few on here could do well with attending a scene such as this and then attending the funeral afterwards.

I have had to represent the Railway at such occasions and I can assure you it is an extremely unpleasant experience, particularly where young children are attending.

Just a little compassion to someone who was not a vandal or a ne'r do well, but probably a cherished family member would be a little more fitting rather than inapproriate adolesecent half-thought out jibes and comments.

Well said mate spot on.

 

[krus_aragon]

From the video article on the BBC's page, the crossing in question was a residential crossing: one only used by people crossing the railway to get to their property. No bells, whistles or alarms, just a phone to ask control if the line is clear. I assume that the lady crossed without calling, thinking that the line was clear. Given that the loco involved was a NR one running light engine, it may be that the lady knew that no passenger train was due (service every two hours each way) and was caught out by the unexpected ERTMS train.

 

[37401]

Those of us who have had to deal with such situations out on the track do not hold such simple views.

Tonight someone has lost a Sister/Wife/Mother/Grandmother/Great Grandmother and I am sure will be very distraught by the circumstances of her passing.

There will also be others directly involved such as the train crew who will be as upset as everyone else.

Once again such things seem to be lost on those who comment from behind the distance and comfort of an anonymous Internet connection.

As with all things, such instances are not as cut and dried in many cases as people would seek to make out. No doubt a train running outside the normal timetable may well have been a factor but MOST people are human and errors of judgement are made.

Possibly she was not expecting a train to be about, maybe she looked and did not see it in time. Maybe she stalled her car when she saw the train coming.

Nothing can be certain until investigations are concluded.

A few on here could do well with attending a scene such as this and then attending the funeral afterwards.

I have had to represent the Railway at such occasions and I can assure you it is an extremely unpleasant experience, particularly where young children are attending.

Just a little compassion to someone who was not a vandal or a ne'r do well, but probably a cherished family member would be a little more fitting rather than inapproriate adolesecent half-thought out jibes and comments.

couldnt have put it better myself, well said in any fatailty many suffer not just the person who is dead

-The driver (may never work again)
- Traincrew
- The family
-BTP
- the person that has to scrape the remains off the loco
- the person that informs the family
- anyone who sees it happen
- even family`s of friends (as the friend may be in a state)

Hope the driver and crew are doing ok and can return to what they do best soon

 

[Spartacus]

Ironically not only wasn't this train in the PTT, it wasn't in the WTT either, being VSTP-ed. First thoughts seem to suggest the box wasn't contacted for clearance to cross although tests should be carried out on the vehicle to see if it suffered a mechanical problem causing it to stop on the crossing.

With a long time before the next booked passenger service sadly it seems a little knowledge may have been dangerous thing on this occasion

A lesson for everyone here. No timetable will tell you how everything's running.

 

[Vader]

Hi,

I am from the same town, and i heard about the accident while i was in work.

The crossing has barriers which have to be manually opened by the crosser, two gates on either side of the line. And yes, there is a phone there.
The crossing is very rarely used. Mainly gets used by the occupants of the 2 houses, farmer, and people going to the estuary (usually by foot). With the weather that we had today, the crossing would be used almost none.

At first, i presumed the accident happened with the loco traveling from porthmadog, because trees and bushes were able to obscure the view. But, their is also a red house (where my uncle used to live before he passed away) on the left side, right next to the line which was obscuring some of the view to the left (direction the loco approached from). She definetely could not see the train coming from the left after she went back into the car after opening the gate. But, after she opened the gate, she should of had a good look and a good listen (i know she was old, and her eyesight or hearing may of been the cause) as the direction the train was approaching from, can be seen from literally several miles away.

Here is google map view of the area.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...2832,-4.066583&spn=0.001117,0.003479&t=h&z=19

This was here house

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...,-4.066891&spn=0.001117,0.003479&z=19&iwloc=A

Does anybody know which direction she was traveling? If she was traveling across the line from north to south, then i could understand. But, if she was traveling south to north, then this its a strange one, as their is almost no obstruction in that direction.

 

[Old Timer]

0Z97 0800 Sutton Bridge to Pwllheli was the train involved, it was travelling in the Down direction that is towards Porthmadog at the time of the incident.

 

[j0hn0]

wow, seemed to have touched a nerve there with some people who obviously take life far too seriously.

I have no sympathy for idiots who cannot read signs and drive properly and will not apologise to people who take offence at my simplistic analysis.

Do you think that saying things like "my condolances to the families involved" gives you some sort of moral high ground? Well it doesn't, it just means that you are too emotionally attached to an issue which has absolutely no relevance to you. Go and cry for Diana or something whilst more health and safety legislation gets written to prevent idiots from hurting themselves; restricting your own ability to watch trains.

Get over yourselves please, if you can't handle an opinion that is different to yours then I suggest that you shouldn't be on a message forum
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You have just proved that you wont last long as far a forum Natural selection is involved cause after that well no one gonna be bothered with your opinions now that's funny.

Judging by the response, and the fact that you replied, means that you obviously ARE bothered with my opinions.

And regarding natural selection, I am alive so your theory is flawed, and wishing death on another forum member is more abhorrent than laughing at and old person, who has had a good innings, who shouldn't have been on the road.

Engage brain before posting next time :roll:

 

[O L Leigh]

As strange as this may appear to you, this is serious. It's not hand-wringing woolly liberal "group hug" thinking to have sympathy for someone who has died in an accident brought about by an error of judgement.

If I take your post completely at face value it is you who seems to have the problem accepting other people's opinions. You've dragged this discussion down to the level of personal insult and it dignifies neither you nor the topic. We're happy for you to be entitled to express your opinions on this incident the same as you should be happy for us to be entitled to express our opinions to the contrary. This isn't a battle for the moral high ground.

Some of us have actually been involved in railway deaths and I happen to know Old Timer's credentials in this respect, and I completely agree with him in what he says about some of the reaction voiced so far. I don't believe he's condemning anyone here but simply encouraging folk to stop and think for a minute about the consequences of this incident and to have a little compassion.

O L Leigh

 

[SouthEastern-465]

natural selection at work there

Get a hold of your self thats just nasty to say.

Poor woman I feel for her family they must feel dreadful and what annoys me more is that the crossing probaly had no gates no warnings etc...

 

[j0hn0]

As strange as this may appear to you, this is serious. It's not hand-wringing woolly liberal "group hug" thinking to have sympathy for someone who has died in an accident brought about by an error of judgement.

If I take your post completely at face value it is you who seems to have the problem accepting other people's opinions. You've dragged this discussion down to the level of personal insult and it dignifies neither you nor the topic. We're happy for you to be entitled to express your opinions on this incident the same as you should be happy for us to be entitled to express our opinions to the contrary. This isn't a battle for the moral high ground.

Some of us have actually been involved in railway deaths and I happen to know Old Timer's credentials in this respect, and I completely agree with him in what he says about some of the reaction voiced so far. I don't believe he's condemning anyone here but simply encouraging folk to stop and think for a minute about the consequences of this incident and to have a little compassion.

O L Leigh

Could've fooled me!

See where Royston Vasey called me a moron (now removed), then check the other posts, see where I have insulted anyone, at all, then perhaps you might want to re-post.

What on earth is the "level crossings - DON'T RUN THE RISK" campaign from the government all about then?

I also fail to see why I should have compassion for someone I don't know, just because Old Timer says so? Give me a break.

Old people should take their driving test again at 60 and then have their sight tested every 5 years thereafter.

Removed paragraph that insults others

You are also assuming that I have never experienced any railway or road deaths myself, and if I did then I wouldn't think like this.....WRONG!!!!!

please wake up

 

[O L Leigh]

Ah. Now we're getting somewhere.

See where Royston Vasey called me a moron, then check the other posts, see where I have insulted anyone, at all, then perhaps you might want to re-post.

I quote...

I have no sympathy for idiots who cannot read signs and drive properly and will not apologise to people who take offence at my simplistic analysis.

Do you think that saying things like "my condolances to the families involved" gives you some sort of moral high ground? Well it doesn't, it just means that you are too emotionally attached to an issue which has absolutely no relevance to you. Go and cry for Diana or something whilst more health and safety legislation gets written to prevent idiots from hurting themselves; restricting your own ability to watch trains.

Get over yourselves please, if you can't handle an opinion that is different to yours then I suggest that you shouldn't be on a message forum

I also fail to see why I should have compassion for someone I don't know, just because Old Timer says so? Give me a break.

I agree. I don't think you should do anything simply because Old Timer, or indeed anyone else, tells you.

I'm suggesting simply that for probably the majority of people, feeling sympathy at the news of a death is a normal reaction. Hearing of an untimely death as a result of a silly accident generally provokes a reaction.

Old people should take their driving test again at 60 and then have their sight tested every 5 years thereafter.

You're assuming the person's age had any bearing on the incident.

Again, you're assuming. Generally speaking the feelings are towards the traincrew, the emergency services and the bereaved family. Some people (myself included) don't actually have much of a reaction one way or another.

However, for some reason I can't quite fathom, it really seems to have got under your skin. Why is that? Do you believe that yours is the only valid reaction? Are we not permitted to have a reaction at all?

You are also assuming that I have never experienced any railway or road deaths myself, and if I did then I wouldn't think like this.....WRONG!!!!!

I made no such assumption. However, if you really have had experience with rail or road deaths then I'm more than a little surprised at the strength of your feelings.

please wake up

Oh, I'm awake thanks.

O L Leigh

 

[j0hn0]

Ah. Now we're getting somewhere.



I quote...





I agree. I don't think you should do anything simply because Old Timer, or indeed anyone else, tells you.

I'm suggesting simply that for probably the majority of people, feeling sympathy at the news of a death is a normal reaction. Hearing of an untimely death as a result of a silly accident generally provokes a reaction.



You're assuming the person's age had any bearing on the incident.

Again, you're assuming. Generally speaking the feelings are towards the traincrew, the emergency services and the bereaved family. Some people (myself included) don't actually have much of a reaction one way or another.

However, for some reason I can't quite fathom, it really seems to have got under your skin. Why is that? Do you believe that yours is the only valid reaction? Are we not permitted to have a reaction at all?



I made no such assumption. However, if you really have had experience with rail or road deaths then I'm more than a little surprised at the strength of your feelings.



Oh, I'm awake thanks.

O L Leigh

sorry, none of those responses make any sense. I did not insult anyone one this forum, merely idiots who cannot drive or see properly, if you consider yourself to be part of that group then that is your prerogative to take offence to something which was not aimed at you. Just like you are grieving for something which doesn't involve you. Are you omnipotent?

I quote " Some of us have actually been involved in railway deaths "

which assumes that I haven't

You were the ones assuming the contributing factors, I was merely reacting to that.

As you have already said, no-one knows what the details are.

I made a light-hearted comment and was insulted for it, surely I am within my rights to respond?

I think the issue here is that my comments get under other peoples skin, I am merely defending myself against the pious pseudo-moral majority. Something which I am happy to do all day my good man so we can keep this going as long as you want......:roll:

 

[SouthEastern-465]

sorry, none of those responses make any sense. I did not insult anyone one this forum, merely idiots who cannot drive or see properly, if you consider yourself to be part of that group then that is your prerogative to take offence to something which was not aimed at you. Just like you are grieving for something which doesn't involve you. Are you omnipotent?

I quote " Some of us have actually been involved in railway deaths "

which assumes that I haven't

You were the ones assuming the contributing factors, I was merely reacting to that.

As you have already said, no-one knows what the details are.

I made a light-hearted comment and was insulted for it, surely I am within my rights to respond?

I think the issue here is that my comments get under other peoples skin, I am merely defending myself against the pious pseudo-moral majority. Something which I am happy to do all day my good man so we can keep this going as long as you want......:roll:

There are no need for the nature of these posts and the people there aimed at when they was just trying to point out that it is a nasty thing to say about a person when is is not there fault.

I think no-one cares if it continues as it will get ignored.

All I got to say is some person needs to grow up and have respect for others.