Trainline Business Account £5.50 Booking Fee

[Gareth Marston]

One of the TOD collectors we had today brought his whole confirmation e mail from his company with him including the booking fee amount. He collected a £61.00 ticket and had a £5.50 booking fee charged.

I double checked and it was just for one transaction. This is a lot more than the Fees on the Trainline website. If trainline are doing this for every ticket booked they must be fleecing their corporate customers no end. Having a nice pretty statement of your company's train travel is one thing but a c 8% surcharge is not worth it surely?

Needless to say the bloke picked up an Anytime ticket and not the hypothetical average saving one Trainline advertise......

 

[BML247]

You forget that the business account is extremely handy for businesses and they are willing to pay that fee for the simplicity of single monthly billing and other stuff that comes with it.

 

[pdq]

Businesses will pay the fees because, instead of having to process x number of travel expense claims every month, they get one consolidated invoice, complete with cost codes etc. So the amount paid out in fees is recouped in efficiency and accuracy in the accounts dept.

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[gingerheid]

They're relying on people being slow to move supplier. Other providers will do it for far less (sometimes even just for the commissions, if enough tickets are bought).

 

[edwin_m]

My employer is charged £1 per ticket for printing on an in-office printer, or £2 per ticket for ToD. This is regardless of the number of physical coupons and applies to either a single or a return but out and back Advances are charged as a pair of singles. The benefits of splitting start to be eaten away when the printing charge is per ticket too.

 

[yorkie]

You forget that the business account is extremely handy for businesses and they are willing to pay that fee for the simplicity of single monthly billing and other stuff that comes with it.

Agreed.

They're relying on people being slow to move supplier. Other providers will do it for far less (sometimes even just for the commissions, if enough tickets are bought).

Are you sure? Have you seen how little commission third party retailers get?

Is there really anyone providing a comparable business service with no fees whatsoever?

 

[Merseysider]

Don't any TOC websites offer corporate accounting? I'd have thought they'd be keen to out-compete the Trainline given the potentially lucrative sums involved.

 

[cactustwirly]

Don't any TOC websites offer corporate accounting? I'd have thought they'd be keen to out-compete the Trainline given the potentially lucrative sums involved.

I've seen leaflets for a GWR business account, so I assume other TOCs must do it as well.

 

[najaB]

If trainline are doing this for every ticket booked they must be fleecing their corporate customers no end.

They are not. My last employer used TheTrainline and we paid no booking fees at all, and received substantial discounts on some tickets to boot.

 

[Llanigraham]

Perhaps, Gareth, if this is a local company you need to discuss an arrangement with them?

 

[pdq]

It isn't always just rail tickets though. My previous employer (a Government agency) used Redfern Travel and we had to use them for all rail travel, hotel bookings, car hire and flights. It was all pretty integrated so one trip could have used all 4 components, all grouped to my cost centre, and showing how much my carbon footprint was for the trip.

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[Gareth Marston]

Businesses will pay the fees because, instead of having to process x number of travel expense claims every month, they get one consolidated invoice, complete with cost codes etc. So the amount paid out in fees is recouped in efficiency and accuracy in the accounts dept.

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As someone whose been on both sides of the fence ( as a claim processor and a frequent business traveler) I am skeptical of this claim becuase-

Any T&S policy will always see travel authorised and claims(Invoices) checked before payment is made. Folk are simply not just going to pay the Invoice from Trainline without checking it - its against all the natural flow of accounts depts. Therefore there will still be a lot of admin involved.

 

[Gareth Marston]

It isn't always just rail tickets though. My previous employer (a Government agency) used Redfern Travel and we had to use them for all rail travel, hotel bookings, car hire and flights. It was all pretty integrated so one trip could have used all 4 components, all grouped to my cost centre, and showing how much my carbon footprint was for the trip.

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Trainline don't do those elements though so the above will all still be done separately. A business trip will not just involve a train ride invariably there will be some subsistence, taxi ride/bus ride, hotel etc so the company will still need accounts people to process these elements hence why I don't think there's much to be saved in Finance time - combined with the fact that they will double check the Trainline Invoice.

In fact when you think about it Employee A will submit their T&S claim for hotel, meals etc which will be checked over and authorized and then at a different time Trainline will submit their Invoice with Employee A's train journey and this will have to be checked and authorized which to my mind is doubling the admin not cutting down on it!

 

[Gareth Marston]

Perhaps, Gareth, if this is a local company you need to discuss an arrangement with them?

A National Supermarket Chain in fact.

 

[Gareth Marston]

They are not. My last employer used TheTrainline and we paid no booking fees at all, and received substantial discounts on some tickets to boot.

The £5.50 Booking Fee stuck out like a sore thumb hence why I started the thread. Trainlines website says they'll charge their usual 75p/£1.50 Booking Fees for Business Accounts.

Outside of London £5.50 the cost of employing someone in Accounts for 20 to 30 minutes!

The corporate ones i see most are from Evolvi and there's a high propensity for folk to have Any Permitted and Anytime tickets they don't actually need from them. A separate thread really but it seems letting people book their own tickets on the internet or via a corporate site induces them to "play safe" as they don't have the knowledge of what the restriction codes are/mean. Most folk assume "Off Peak" actually means something generic and universal rather than the reality which is its shorthand for "check restriction code for validity".

 

[greatkingrat]

Or maybe they know the restrictions but as it is not their money are not too bothered about the price? They think they might as well have the extra flexible in case their meeting finished earlier or later than expected.

 

[najaB]

In fact when you think about it Employee A will submit their T&S claim for hotel, meals etc which will be checked over and authorized and then at a different time Trainline will submit their Invoice with Employee A's train journey and this will have to be checked and authorized which to my mind is doubling the admin not cutting down on it!

In the case of my previous employer, Trainline did a lot of that admin work for them. When booking it would automatically request a justification for booking anything outside the travel policy (e.g. First Class, Anytime fares when Off-Peak would be valid, etc.) which made the procurement manager's job a lot easier.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Or maybe they know the restrictions but as it is not their money are not too bothered about the price? They think they might as well have the extra flexible in case their meeting finished earlier or later than expected.

The example i had the other day was someone going out on first day after 0930 on a XC service for part of route staying overnight and coming back next day from a non London destination. She was aiming for 1530 ish train but was worried if meeting ran on she'd be in evening peak after 1600. It was a XC owned fare and of course the 2V restriction on the correct Off Peak Return is no travel before 0930. The women had convinced herself a peak restriction existed where in fact there isn't one.

Internet ticket sales are a marvelous way to make more money as people don't have the knowledge to choose correctly. The most common one we see is London Terminals to Newtown Any Permitted versus Via BHM. In theory if you do two tight chances at Wolves and Stafford you can get to Euston 10 minutes quicker than via BHM which is one change and a 20 min connection. The Any Permitted Off Peak Return is £12.00 more expensive than the via BHM. All the Conductors and Booking Office staff on the Cambrian sell via BHM its only the internet purchasers that go Any Permitted. A late train in the afternoon usually brings people in the office worried about connections to London all clutching Any Permitted's bought online I tell them to go via BHM.

 

[Merseysider]

I don't know about other websites, but TPE (Mixing Deck) will normally give a pop up box warning you that a cheaper fare is available for your selected trains, if for example you choose two singles instead of a return, or an Anytime instead of an Off Peak etc. One needs to actively choose between the cheaper appropriate fare offered, or sticking with the pointlessly expensive fares they've chosen.

We have found a cheaper fare for the services you have selected. You can buy a Off-Peak Return valid on your selected services for £83.90.

Buy selected tickets
Total Cost: £318.00

Buy substitute tickets
Total Cost: £83.90

Terms & Conditions for this ticket

On the mobile site, a warning appears at the top of the page before payment:

Cheaper fares exist for your selected trains. Click the 'Return to Seach' button if you wish to search again.

It shouldn't be that difficult to implement, and should be a requirement, for all booking websites to display such a warning.

 

[alistairlees]

One of the TOD collectors we had today brought his whole confirmation e mail from his company with him including the booking fee amount. He collected a £61.00 ticket and had a £5.50 booking fee charged.

I double checked and it was just for one transaction. This is a lot more than the Fees on the Trainline website. If trainline are doing this for every ticket booked they must be fleecing their corporate customers no end. Having a nice pretty statement of your company's train travel is one thing but a c 8% surcharge is not worth it surely?

Needless to say the bloke picked up an Anytime ticket and not the hypothetical average saving one Trainline advertise......

It does indeed look eye-wateringly expensive at first sight.

However, there are probably a few things to bear in mind that might be affecting this:
- for corporate ticket sales over £50k a year the commission rate is 3% (not 5%)
- for all either of us know this commission might be being given back to the supermarket chain by Trainline. Arrangements like that are commonplace. So Trainline may have only its own fee as income. The 3% is worth £1.83 on the transaction you posted
- the comparison made later in the thread with the Trainline direct to business service (£1.50 a booking) is where Trainline keeps the commission (3% or 5% depending on size), so there is up to £4.50 to play with in that model
- probably in both circumstances costs of card payment and fulfilment have to be accounted for, as well as sales / marketing, account management and, of course, the enormous cost of keeping an RSP-compliant TIS going at a time of ever-increasing technology changes and consumer expectations (apps with more functionality; more data integration; smart ticketing etc.)
- corporates get extra Management Information (CO2, passenger manifests, savings etc.) as well as policy compliance (don't travel 1st class etc.)
- corporates value these things, or they wouldn't pay for them.

I'm not saying there isn't room for improvement, just that it's a bit more complex (and with reason) than it looks at first glance.

 

[gingerheid]

Agreed.

Are you sure? Have you seen how little commission third party retailers get?

Is there really anyone providing a comparable business service with no fees whatsoever?

My employer used to pay £1 a booking, but renegotiated that to £0. We are a very large organisation that buys a *lot* of tickets though. A couple of our largest sites have TVMs installed (which I guess we also pay for).

 

[Hadders]

I work for a large organisation that books a lot of train travel. We have to use a corporate provider who handles all our travel and accommodation.

I don't know the detail but we do get a retrospective discount which offsets much of the booking fee.
If we the TVMs in our own office it's cheaper (this isn't reflected in the ticet price but in the amount of retrospective discount)
We get itemised invoicing by cost centre.

We book our own rail tickets through a website so there's nothing to stop us using split tickets, loopholes etc although I'm always a it careful when using a ticket for business or recommending tickets for colleagues - I know the rules and am prepared to fight my corner if necessary, most of my colleagues lack this knowledge and I wouldn't wish to see them (or me) in a difficult position.

Also, to book any tickets you have to set up a profile with your contact details so in these turbulent times the business knows exactly where in the world its employees are and how to contact them should there be an emergency situation.

 

[xotGD]

We use a corporate provider, and built in to the system we use is a requirement to select a reason for not selecting the cheapest tickets for the train selected. 'Need flexibility' is the usual reason for not booking an advance.

 

[gingerheid]

We have to provide an excuse for why we didn't book at least 7 days in advance.

"No advance tickets on route so may as well book at last minute when the journey is definitely happening" isn't an option...

 

[TUC]

It isn't always just rail tickets though. My previous employer (a Government agency) used Redfern Travel and we had to use them for all rail travel, hotel bookings, car hire and flights. It was all pretty integrated so one trip could have used all 4 components, all grouped to my cost centre, and showing how much my carbon footprint was for the trip.

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We use Redfern at work too and my understanding is that their fee is a lot less than that of the Trainline in the OP.

 

[TUC]

Or maybe they know the restrictions but as it is not their money are not too bothered about the price? They think they might as well have the extra flexible in case their meeting finished earlier or later than expected.

The view often taken at work is that people can usually predict when a meeting wiĺ start, and so an Advance is suitable. However they may be less certain when it will actually finish and so a flexible ticket may be appropriate for the return.

 

[Hadders]

The corporate ones i see most are from Evolvi and there's a high propensity for folk to have Any Permitted and Anytime tickets they don't actually need from them. A separate thread really but it seems letting people book their own tickets on the internet or via a corporate site induces them to "play safe" as they don't have the knowledge of what the restriction codes are/mean. Most folk assume "Off Peak" actually means something generic and universal rather than the reality which is its shorthand for "check restriction code for validity".

I agree with this. I use evolvi to book business travel. Usually all I need is a return to Kings Cross as my office is a short walk from there but despite specifying Kings Cross as the destination a One Day Travelcard is always the 1st option shown. The cheaper return to London Terminals is further down the list.

I know what I'm doing when it comes to rail fares but most don't...

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Don't any TOC websites offer corporate accounting? I'd have thought they'd be keen to out-compete the Trainline given the potentially lucrative sums involved.

A train company who used to have adverts of an anti-trainline nature now use trainline for all its own business travel, rather than go through it's own ticket offices like it used to, apparently it's cheaper.......

 

[Merseysider]

That wouldn't happen to be Northern and/or EMT would it?

 

[CyrusWuff]

A train company who used to have adverts of an anti-trainline nature now use trainline for all its own business travel, rather than go through it's own ticket offices like it used to, apparently it's cheaper.......

They're not the only one...I'm aware of a few TOCs that have stopped using Rail Warrants for staff travel and switched to using Company Credit Cards to either book online or at a Ticket Office.